very informative video about welding ti with Zank

[old fat man]

Most of the technical stuff is over my head, but it's clear, these two guys are near the top of their respective games

Not just a saw, file, and torch here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLbC5Qlpjgw

[HenryA]

Thanks for that.

[wallymann]

dude. awesome video. thx for posting. #knowledge

[alancw3]

very informative video. thanks for sharing!

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by old fat man

Most of the technical stuff is over my head, but it's clear, these two guys are near the top of their respective games

Not just a saw, file, and torch here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLbC5Qlpjgw

Very interesting...along with a slew of new rims for wheelbuilders..titanium is getting kinda 'crowded'...and jumping into that market takes cojones.

People looking for 'sumthin else'...whether it be handbuild, designed for the rider, wheelset or a non carbon, non cookie cutter carbon frame.

[wgp]

Echoing appreciation for the video posting. As an owner of several Ti bikes, I have a "vested interest" in learning more about working with Ti. I learned a lot!

[Butch]

Very well done video and it speaks to the high level that Mike manufactures to. I agree with him about educating the customer about double pass welds. When I got to Moots in '96 there was not a 100% double pass system in place. What I found from the frames I welded and then from previous built frames that came back that had cracked in the weld was that the most important spots for a fusion pass is where a very thin tube contacts a thick piece of material ie at the dropout and the bb shell. When heated to weld temps Titanium expands and then contracts - a lot. From cutting welds apart at some of these joints when the single pass weld was not done properly there would be a gap created between the tube and the dropout for instance. This put all the stress on the weld. The YBB's we were making en mass did not like that. By sealing these up the shrinkage and separation does not take place. To Mike's point in the video if the weld is done properly with a single pass this won't happen. At Moots we knew the way to take care of that was to have tight fit ups and then fuse the joint. As a company that was welding 6 bikes a day taking this step eliminated a potential problem.
Also to his point, cleanliness and I will add tube quality both pay huge dividends to durability and the ability to bend and shape tubing.

[Mikej]

Originally Posted by Butch

Very well done video and it speaks to the high level that Mike manufactures to. I agree with him about educating the customer about double pass welds. When I got to Moots in '96 there was not a 100% double pass system in place. What I found from the frames I welded and then from previous built frames that came back that had cracked in the weld was that the most important spots for a fusion pass is where a very thin tube contacts a thick piece of material ie at the dropout and the bb shell. When heated to weld temps Titanium expands and then contracts - a lot. From cutting welds apart at some of these joints when the single pass weld was not done properly there would be a gap created between the tube and the dropout for instance. This put all the stress on the weld. The YBB's we were making en mass did not like that. By sealing these up the shrinkage and separation does not take place. To Mike's point in the video if the weld is done properly with a single pass this won't happen. At Moots we knew the way to take care of that was to have tight fit ups and then fuse the joint. As a company that was welding 6 bikes a day taking this step eliminated a potential problem.
Also to his point, cleanliness and I will add tube quality both pay huge dividends to durability and the ability to bend and shape tubing.

Thank you for these points, it goes to show how deep some techniques go and imho how ti frame building is not for beginners. Not saying Zanc is a beginner. I can’t understand why some builders would start building titanium when there are so many who have mastered it years if not decades ago. I’m guessing the people asked him for it, but even if it’s spelled out, the experience of failure iover time is undoubtedly the hardest to master. Best of luck to him, custom ti people are a bit different (I’ve owned many ti frames, I’m a know it all type)

[StephenCL]

I’m just happy that my new ride made a cameo appearance in the video.

I think for those that have asked why ti at this point, I think Mike recognized that ti was the ultimate material for custom made bicycles. I don’t think it takes away anything he does with brazed or tig steel, or Alu for that matter. I would like to think that as a designer and fabricator he has stepped up his game to the most challenging and rewarding material.

By the way, the frame he made for me is pure genius. I absolutely love it. Also, he will be doing things with ti that only the true fabricators want to mess with. Custom dropouts, jet tubes, butted tubing, in house bent chain stays and anodizing to name a few. There a lot of ti builders cranking out frames from stock paragon parts...

Yes, I agree it is getting crowded, but there is always room at the top for the very best. 30k views in 2 days for this video tells me there a lot of people watching what Mike is up to!

Stephen

[HenryA]

Originally Posted by StephenCL

I’m just happy that my new ride made a cameo appearance in the video.

I think for those that have asked why ti at this point, I think Mike recognized that ti was the ultimate material for custom made bicycles. I don’t think it takes away anything he does with brazed or tig steel, or Alu for that matter. I would like to think that as a designer and fabricator he has stepped up his game to the most challenging and rewarding material.

By the way, the frame he made for me is pure genius. I absolutely love it. Also, he will be doing things with ti that only the true fabricators want to mess with. Custom dropouts, jet tubes, butted tubing, in house bent chain stays and anodizing to name a few. There a lot of ti builders cranking out frames from stock paragon parts...

Yes, I agree it is getting crowded, but there is always room at the top for the very best. 30k views in 2 days for this video tells me there a lot of people watching what Mike is up to!

Stephen

Like button needed for this post!

[93KgBike]

Super video. Thanks for the link.

TIG Finger, 100% made in the USA!

[zank]

Thanks, everyone. Glad you guys enjoyed it. Having Jody in the shop was amazing. His experience in the aerospace, nuclear, oil and gas, and pipeline fields is vast. And on top of all that, he's an amazing teacher. I've learned a ton from him over the years.

Butch, thank you for all that you have shared over the years. I've learned so much from your posts on the various forums. It's great to have such a generous community where the information is shared so freely.

[zank]

If anyone is interested, we also did a brazing video and an aluminum welding video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=no-OWfC5-RY&t=1s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEQCSbxZoeA&t=227s

[Ronsonic]

Good stuff. Always good to learn something. The lab grade acetone .... that causes me to think some of the cleaning problems I've had in electronics might be related.

Anyway, thanks to all

[metrotuned]

Art in motion!!!