OT*-Who do you think should get the Amazon headquarters?

[fa63]

Good points.

Originally Posted by Mark McM

Most loopholes exist on purpose. So as long as corporations keep funding politicians, politicians will continue including loopholes in legislation. (Also of note is that many times proposed bills are actually written by corporations.)

Originally Posted by echappist

exactly this. ain't a fair fight if the player wrote the rules of the game...

[Black Dog]

Originally Posted by echappist

are you guys at least a bit more fortunate than those of us living south of the border?

what has always struck me as amusing is that in America, welfare for corporations (and especially sport teams) is promoted, while welfare for the needy is deemed unnecessary (or worse, as being infantilizing)...

In contrast, there's greater (though declining) social welfare in the GB, but little welfare for sport teams. Not only do most have to pay their own way for stadia, there's actual promotion/relegation, quite a survival of the fittest...

sometimes I really wish I were Canadian. Actually had the opportunity to become a Canadian citizen but passed on it...

We have had similar fiascos for sports stadia but nothing at the level of what goes on south of our border. We do however, happily give out corporate welfare to very profitable companies all the time. Our federal government just wrote off over $1 billion in loans to Chrysler that were never repaid after the 2008 crash, even tough the company has been making money every year since. We also give away tax dollars to gas an oil companies that make money etc.... Corporate welfare sucks...it is truly taking from the poor and giving to the rich.

[Mikej]

Amazon is our own monster, it our fault.

[fiamme red]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Bezos one smart cookie..not only big $ incentives to the most valuable company on the planet but invaluable info about each of these potential markets that threw tons of info their way..which I'm SURE goes into some sort of logarithum...

That's a good point.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/14/tech/...ata/index.html

Amazon's search for a second headquarters was never just about finding a new home.

Throughout the process, Amazon skillfully obtained data from 238 cities and metro areas in North America for free, including proprietary information about real estate sites under development, details about their talent pool, local labor cost and what incentives cities and states were willing to cough up to bring the company to town.

"Amazon was not going through this exercise to pick a single HQ2," said Richard Florida, a leading urbanist and professor at the University of Toronto. "It was part of a broader effort -- a corporate relocation strategy -- to crowdsource a wide variety of data."

[fiamme red]

Now JPMorgan Chase is sure to want their share of public funding.

https://www.crainsnewyork.com/articl...ives-as-amazon (February 26, 2018)

Wherever Jeff Bezos goes, Jamie Dimon is sure to follow.

Once Amazon decides where to locate its second headquarters, the JPMorgan Chase CEO said he will lobby that state’s leadership for the same tax breaks and incentives offered to the giant retailer.

“The second they give benefits to those people, you can damn well be sure I’m going to be calling the governor up,” Dimon said at an investor meeting Tuesday. “I’m not kidding. You’ve got to fight for your company,” he said. “If you don’t, no one else does.”

Dimon added that he would also consider calling the state that finishes runner up in the Amazon sweepstakes and offer to relocate 50,000 employees there “if we get the same deal.”

...

[cdimattio]

Originally Posted by parris

I'm just sickened by this s**t. As someone that's lived in upstate NY my entire life and seeing the way the state has lost jobs and more importantly people and the talent that they take with them the amount that's being thrown at the company is just shattering.

The New York State Amazon incentives would seem a prudent investment when compared to the Cuomo "Buffalo Billion" efforts. At least the jobs may actually materialize. Aside from the corruption indictments and trials, I think the state has paid ~$2 million per job created upstate?

It goes without saying that the whole HQ search was a farce and Bezos would have steered this to Washington DC and New York for far less money.

[Ozz]

Originally Posted by parris

I'm just sickened by this s**t. As someone that's lived in upstate NY my entire life and seeing the way the state has lost jobs and more importantly people and the talent that they take with them the amount that's being thrown at the company is just shattering.

Any idea what the number of jobs / payroll that are going to located in Queens? Before judging too harshly, those tax incentives are creating jobs, and not just Amazon jobs.

You might check this out: https://sloanreview.mit.edu/article/...novation-jobs/

I don't like the "corporate welfare" states go thru to attract jobs, but I would have to think that the math pencils out to the positive.....

[unterhausen]

Originally Posted by fiamme red

Now JPMorgan Chase is sure to want their share of public funding.

https://www.crainsnewyork.com/articl...ives-as-amazon (February 26, 2018)

The masters of the universe that work in finance always make noises like this, "I'm going to move." Yeah, go for it. I know there are finance companies in a lot of cities other than New York, but I don't think JPMorgan is going to be one of them or can really afford to be one of them. Maybe a branch office

eta: I don't think New York should have made these offers to Amazon. But hopefully they will fix the subway. Is fixing the subway a recurring theme here?

[torquer]

Originally Posted by unterhausen

eta: I don't think New York should have made these offers to Amazon. But hopefully they will fix the subway. Is fixing the subway a recurring theme here?

Subway repairs only if there’s any money left over after the helipads are done.
The one good aspect of the deal (at least as reported) is that most of the subsidy is directly tied to actual jobs created.
Although there will probably be some creative bookkeeping on this as well.

And speaking of massive wealth transfers (upward), kudos to our northern neighbors for telling the IOC where they can (not) shove the 2026 winter games.

[Black Dog]

Originally Posted by torquer

Subway repairs only if there’s any money left over after the helipads are done.
The one good aspect of the deal (at least as reported) is that most of the subsidy is directly tied to actual jobs created.
Although there will probably be some creative bookkeeping on this as well.

And speaking of massive wealth transfers (upward), kudos to our northern neighbors for telling the IOC where they can (not) shove the 2026 winter games.

This was the result of of vote. The people of Calgary did not want the games again. Citizens are getting wise to the giant ripoff that the olympics are. Lots of promises but at the end of the day the taxpayers are subsidizing the enormous greed of the IOC.

[jet sanchez]

I just heard on the radio that the cost of the Tokyo Olympics for 2020 is approaching $25 billion USD, four times what was initially budgeted.

The original bid was approved because organizers said that they would be able to make sure that these would be the cheapest Olympics ever; so far, it's now the second most expensive.

[jlwdm]

Originally Posted by jet sanchez

I just heard on the radio that the cost of the Tokyo Olympics for 2020 is approaching $25 billion USD, four times what was initially budgeted.

The original bid was approved because organizers said that they would be able to make sure that these would be the cheapest Olympics ever; so far, it's now the second most expensive.

You wonder why any country wants to hold the Olympics. Always argue their are financial benefits but does not seem to be the case anymore. Ridiculous costs and many facilities without any use after the Olympics.

Jeff

[Jaybee]

Originally Posted by jlwdm

You wonder why any country wants to hold the Olympics. Always argue their are financial benefits but does not seem to be the case anymore. Ridiculous costs and many facilities without any use after the Olympics.

Jeff

Somewhere in the Intermontane West is hosting the 2030 Winter Olympics. SLC already has the venues from 2002, but who knows how much the updates will cost. Denver is pretty much starting from scratch, though if an Olympic bid means improved metro area transit, and an extra lane on 70/public transit to the Summit County resorts, I might be in favor of that. Assuming it still actually snows in Summit County in 2030, of course.

Reno/Tahoe was smart enough to back out.

[FlashUNC]

Originally Posted by Ozz

Any idea what the number of jobs / payroll that are going to located in Queens? Before judging too harshly, those tax incentives are creating jobs, and not just Amazon jobs.

You might check this out: https://sloanreview.mit.edu/article/...novation-jobs/

I don't like the "corporate welfare" states go thru to attract jobs, but I would have to think that the math pencils out to the positive.....

Except there's plenty of evidence that it doesn't, that the largesse balloons inevitably, the number of jobs don't appear as promised, and taxpayers are the ones who get soaked. Look at Foxconn in Wisconsin. Darn thing isn't even built yet and it's being revised by the company to not meet the projections and lofty promises put out there.

Municipalities shouldn't be giving the richest man on the planet (at $150 billion and counting) a red cent for anything.

[bocobiking]

I’d have been in favor of tax-incentivizing Amazon to locate anywhere but here. Happily that has not been necessary.