Holland Exogrid vs. Traditional Ti?

exapkib · #1 12-22-2019, 11:18 PM

My continual searching for a titanium frame has turned up some interesting options. Most curious among them is a lead on a Holland Exogrid frameset.

Searching in the usual spots, I have not turned up very much information about people's experiences with these bikes. "Professional" reviews of the frames seem to focus primarily on how expensive the frames are. A few people clearly love them. Maybe it's just a case of having a very small number of bikes on the road?

Does anybody have any real-world experience on these frames? Comments about ride qualities? It's in the same price range as the used Ti from the major players (Moots, Eriksen, etc.)--should I be thinking seriously about this? I typically shy away from mixed material frames (not because of any personal experience, just for no reason at all), but this does not seem to be your dad's mixed material frame . . .

Any thoughts? Experiences? Thanks!

Matthew · #2 12-23-2019, 12:51 AM

Pretty sure there's one or two people here that have one. Anything I've ever read gave a pretty glowing review of the ride and craftsmanship. And they are definitely unique and beautiful.

RedRider · #3 12-23-2019, 07:14 AM

Think of all the good things you've heard about multi material frames, carbon/ti, such as the Serotta Ottrott, Seven Odonata, etc. Then supercharge it, put larger wheels on it, lower it and but a big wing on the back. That's the Holland Exogrid!

exapkib · #4 12-23-2019, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthew

Pretty sure there's one or two people here that have one. Anything I've ever read gave a pretty glowing review of the ride and craftsmanship. And they are definitely unique and beautiful.

Unique and beautiful, but is it all flash, or is it the missing link? Not having seen one in person, are these frames too flashy for one drawn to the understated aesthetics of a titanium frame?

Red Rider's comment above put a smile on my face, but it also makes me wary--how does this frame actually compare to the other high-zoot missed material frames out there?

buddybikes · #5 12-23-2019, 08:33 AM

He's been doing it for sometime now, so that tells you something.

Matthew · #6 12-23-2019, 08:35 AM

I doubt it's all flash. But I've never ridden one. If it fits and is in good shape and for a decent price I say go for it. If you don't like it I'm sure you could sell it here. Guessing you'll love it though.

happycampyer · #7 12-23-2019, 08:35 AM

Back in the mid 2000’s, I was debating between a Titus Exogrid Racer-X and a Moots YBB, and ended up getting the Moots. The Titus frames were highly regarded, and I think owners of Titus Exogrid bikes lamented Titus’ demise.

Most accounts regarding frames made of the material are positive. My guess is that its popularity has been limited because a builder needs to license the tubing (used to be a company called Vyatech). Pretty sure Dean and Holland offer frames made of Exogrid tubing—not sure of anyone else (other than baseball bats, etc.). The trend for small builders that build carbon-ti bikes (Seven, Firefly, etc.) seems to be to try to have as much control over their tubing as possible.

Not sure any of that helps answer your question...

mhespenheide · #8 12-23-2019, 08:41 AM

If you haven't seen these threads:
https://forums.thepaceline.net/showt...hlight=exogrid
https://forums.thepaceline.net/showt...hlight=exogrid

Perhaps reach out to Jeff N. if he doesn't comment here; he's had the most experience of other high-end bikes to compare it to.

alancw3 · #9 12-23-2019, 10:01 AM

from what I have heard it is almost like a cult following with the exogrid bikes. I have my doubts performance wise but they sure do look good!

roguedog · #10 12-23-2019, 10:20 AM

I know a few folks on here have owned an Exogrid on here.

I met them at one of the bike shows and they were really nice folks. Holland has been doing Ti for a long long time. Have you also noticed that the forks on his Carbon frames are done w/ Mike Lopez? I think Holland's experience with Ti and building bikes says there's something real there.

Also, I think there are lots of folks in the San Diego area who can't say enough about his work. When I attended a bike camp in San Deigo, one of the coaches had one and said nothing but good things about the bike and about the experience/builder.

I don't know if they still have this program but when I met them at the show, they said if you were in the area to give them a ring and they could set up a demo ride. Not sure if you're anywhere close but that might be a worthy trip before plunking down some $.

old_fat_and_slow · #11 12-23-2019, 10:30 AM

Unless you really have "a thing" for mixed material bikes, I would just stick with Ti or carbon bike. IMHO, the Holland exogrid is just a carbon bike with flashy Ti lugs. If that floats yer boat great, but I'd rather have an all carbon or all Ti bike.

I imagine cleaning the dirt out of all those pockets isn't too fun.

YMMV.

Burnette · #12 12-23-2019, 11:40 AM

I can't speak for the frame but I can for the man behind it, Bill Holland.

I went to NAHBS Charlotte 2014 and met some great people. Nate Zukas and his wife of Zukas Cycles, Kristofer Henry of 44 Bikes, Boyd of Boyd Cycling, Bob Holland and many others. It was like bicycle Comicon for me and I really enjoyed it.

Bill Holland spoke to me at length about his company, his passion, his history and his bikes. He is sharp on all fronts and if he was down the street from me I'm sure I would have a Holland. Positive sharp people are a draw and he's patient and helpful too. His best advice was to ride more than one type back to back, which at home headquarters he can accommodate.

For me I'm as cynical as they come and believe that the whole package, frame geo, saddle, bars, seat, pedals, position, wheels and tires are the majority of feel right there.

I would get a mixed material bike mainly for vanity, they look cool as hell IMO. I like the Holland Exogrid, the Firefly Riad Ti/Carbon, Zukas Cyckes is doing aluminum and carbon and Rob English is doing steel and carbon. I like them all but for me it's more for when I'm off the bike.

Once I'm on it and a few miles into a ride nothing much matters if the package I noted above is right.

kookmyers · #13 12-23-2019, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by old_fat_and_slow

Unless you really have "a thing" for mixed material bikes, I would just stick with Ti or carbon bike. IMHO, the Holland exogrid is just a carbon bike with flashy Ti lugs. If that floats yer boat great, but I'd rather have an all carbon or all Ti bike.

I imagine cleaning the dirt out of all those pockets isn't too fun.

YMMV.

There aren’t any “pockets”. The diamonds are flush with the Ti.

SoCalSteve · #14 12-23-2019, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exapkib

My continual searching for a titanium frame has turned up some interesting options. Most curious among them is a lead on a Holland Exogrid frameset.

Searching in the usual spots, I have not turned up very much information about people's experiences with these bikes. "Professional" reviews of the frames seem to focus primarily on how expensive the frames are. A few people clearly love them. Maybe it's just a case of having a very small number of bikes on the road?

Does anybody have any real-world experience on these frames? Comments about ride qualities? It's in the same price range as the used Ti from the major players (Moots, Eriksen, etc.)--should I be thinking seriously about this? I typically shy away from mixed material frames (not because of any personal experience, just for no reason at all), but this does not seem to be your dad's mixed material frame . . .

Any thoughts? Experiences? Thanks!

Reach out to Jeff N. He is a huge fan of Bill Holland and Joe Bell. He has lots of real world experience with the bike.

Clean39T · #15 12-23-2019, 11:54 AM

I think it all starts with what experience you are looking to add that differs from your Yamaguchi - which I assume you aren't contemplating selling..

The Exogrid, especially with a Mike Lopez fork, is an incredible machine. However, the ride is likely to be tuned to match that of your Yamaguchi - i.e., to ride like an excellent classic road bike - and it is unlikely to be all that much lighter (probably 1-1.5lbs I'm guessing).

So, if you are interested in just adding another exceptional classic road bike, it would be a good choice to consider - assuming the fit and price is right.

But if you want to experience something truly different from your Yamaguchi, I'd look elsewhere.

Fat-tire options - maybe you want something that takes 650x42-48 or even just 700x32-35?

Light climber - maybe you want to enjoy a 14-15lb bike on the long climbs in your area?

Modern all-rounder - maybe you want something that is light/fast and capable of taking 28-30c tires on aero wheels with integrated hydro discs and electronic shifting?

With moderate hunting, I'm guessing you could acquire any of those for the cost of the Holland. It just depends on what you want, and how you want to add to your riding experience.

For me, at this point in my cycling experience, adding another bike that is very similar to something I already have just doesn't make sense or get my heart fluttering.