The Road Dangers That We Face & Why

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https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/10/m...smid=url-share

Quite sobering ...

[GregL]

Thank you for sharing the article! Many of its points align with my observations.

Greg

[bikinchris]

I have watched dashboard camera channels on YouTube for years. The number of drivers who are scofflaws has dramatically increased over the years. It's one thing to be distracted and/or do something dumb on the road. It's a totally different thing to pass in turn lanes, cut drivers off or speed far too fast, pass on shoulders etc.
The fines for doing these things is FAR too lenient. It should START at jail time, losing your license AND your vehicle. If you take their license, they'll just drive without a license. They NEVER have insurance. If you're caught driving without a license and insurance, the fine should require that you give up the vehicle.

[fourflys]

in a local report here in Sonoma County, I just read about a rider who was going down a decline and when they came around a curve, there was a tree in the road it sounds like.. rider went off the road and did not make it. No other vehicles or riders involved from the report.

certainly makes you wonder.. no judgement on the rider.. part of the reason we go uphill to go downhill for most of us..

[cgolvin]

Originally Posted by bikinchris

The number of drivers who are scofflaws has dramatically increased over the years. It's one thing to be distracted and/or do something dumb on the road. It's a totally different thing to pass in turn lanes, cut drivers off or speed far too fast, pass on shoulders etc.

Lacking any actual data I'm reluctant to claim an increase, but anecdotally I certainly see a lot more of this dangerous and extreme behavior than I used to. Running red lights as well -- I now assume that approaching traffic won't stop when the light initially changes.

Originally Posted by bikinchris

The fines for doing these things is FAR too lenient.

Wholeheartedly agree with this. In addition (still anecdotally), the level of enforcement seems to have declined. I'd be a lot happier about funding local law enforcement if the money went to more traffic enforcement rather than military grade equipment.

[donevwil]

Originally Posted by fourflys

in a local report here in Sonoma County, I just read about a rider who was going down a decline and when they came around a curve, there was a tree in the road it sounds like.. rider went off the road and did not make it. No other vehicles or riders involved from the report.

certainly makes you wonder.. no judgement on the rider.. part of the reason we go uphill to go downhill for most of us..

That was on Hauser Bridge Rd, one of the most treacherous descents around, fast sweeping turns up top leading to tight, wet turns at the bottom. Many go down every year during the GranFondo. Report suggests (not yet clear) she overcooked a turn and hit a downed tree off the road. I've done this descent many times and it still earns my utmost respect.

[Coluber42]

There was this in Vox a few months ago about how traffic enforcement is broken in this country:
https://www.vox.com/23880418/traffic...ck-creek-crash

It has definitely been my experience that in the last several years, the drivers in my area have gotten faster, crankier, more aggressive, and more prone to road rage.

It's a constant frustration that we basically have no mechanism to penalize people for speeding and driving aggressively, especially on smaller side streets, except in the case of assigning fault when a crash has already occurred. Good enforcement is about preventing those, and that's missing.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by bikinchris

I have watched dashboard camera channels on YouTube for years. The number of drivers who are scofflaws has dramatically increased over the years.

How do you know whether it is the number of drivers who are scofflaws that has increased, and not the number of dashboard cameras that have increased (or the number of dashboard camera videos that have been uploaded to youtube)?

[Spdntrxi]

Originally Posted by donevwil

That was on Hauser Bridge Rd, one of the most treacherous descents around, fast sweeping turns up top leading to tight, wet turns at the bottom. Many go down every year during the GranFondo. Report suggests (not yet clear) she overcooked a turn and hit a downed tree off the road. I've done this descent many times and it still earns my utmost respect.

I quit doing that fondo.. fatality 1 year, heli rescue the next. Nothing like waiting 45min to an hour waiting for that stuff to clear.

[thwart]

Weird thread… initial post about the trend of increasingly dangerous auto driving across the US… it’s morphed into posts about a dangerous downhill road (for cycling) in California.

[benb]

I think it all boils down to no one cares.

The drivers are not motivated to behave.

Car companies are not motivated to care about whether what they are doing actually improves safety.

Smartphone manufacturers don't care about the negatives they've caused, including distracting drivers.

Police don't seem to care about enforcing the rules as much anymore, and they're too distracted by their smartphones.

[vertr]

Originally Posted by benb

I think it all boils down to no one cares.

Without visible police enforcement driving laws and norms are governed by a social contract. Entitled people easily exploit the contract to the detriment of everyone else. They get away with it most of the time, and don't kill people most of the time, so the violence against everyone continues. It's a pretty nasty society where you can't walk around without fearing for your life on a daily basis, with a bike being even more dangerous.

[fourflys]

Originally Posted by thwart

Weird thread… initial post about the trend of increasingly dangerous auto driving across the US… it’s morphed into posts about a dangerous downhill road (for cycling) in California.

I added the post about the fatality because the title of the thread is "The Road Dangers that we face & why".. this was certainly a road danger..

[MikeD]

Originally Posted by donevwil

That was on Hauser Bridge Rd, one of the most treacherous descents around, fast sweeping turns up top leading to tight, wet turns at the bottom. Many go down every year during the GranFondo. Report suggests (not yet clear) she overcooked a turn and hit a downed tree off the road. I've done this descent many times and it still earns my utmost respect.

As I remember, doesn't that road have a cattle guard on a downhill corner? Absolutely the worst place to put a cattle guard.

[EB]

It's interesting that the article talks about the failures of municipalities to build infrastructure that encourages safer driving - that our built infrastructure often encourages the opposite.

Pragmatically, we can reduce deaths by building better and safer infrastructure, and to replace unsafe infrastructure with safer infrastructure.

But (typically) when faced with these problems, Americans focus instead on the behavior of others - if only everyone was a great driver (like me!) and followed the rules (also like me!) then everything would be OK. Like that old line about how 100% of drivers think that they're above average drivers.

The reality is - you're always going to have a lot of bad drivers. If you build a better system for them to operate in, they'll kill fewer people.

Or we could ban cars, which is my preferred approach, but I'm being pragmatic here.