OT/HELP: any experience with teensy natural-gas leaks?

wallymann · #1 06-12-2019, 02:49 PM

so we had a whole-house generator installed last year. functionally, it's been a godsend.

however, installation necessitated running of a single/continuous 75ft length of flexible corrugated stainless steel tubing from the gas-meter to the generator. and ever since installation we've had a faint smell of gas in the house that was not present before the generator came along.

edit: the CSST installation runs entirely inside the house (2/3 basement and 1/3 crawlspace), except for the connections to the gas-main and to the generator which use short sections of black pipe until inside the rim-joist.

we've had the gas company check everything out and they did not detect gas-levels that posed an explosion risk. the contractor has bubble-tested the unions and no leaks big enough to cause bubbling were detected

but the smell is there, it varies, but its there and at times nauseating. we have friends/guests come over, and invariably they smell it. the smell is worse when we leave the house buttoned up for a few days, like take a trip or something.

the contractor is like "we tested the unions they're fine -- no leakage" and are showing no inclination to do anything more.

with that backdrop, what should i do?

oliver1850 · #2 06-12-2019, 03:16 PM

I would replace the connector. My guess is the the seal between the connector and the flexible tubing has a slight leak.

Mikej · #3 06-12-2019, 03:25 PM

I would replace the flexible line with black pipe. Was the entire 75 ft run of corrugated bubble tested? If it was bent too much it could leak.

Hindmost · #4 06-12-2019, 03:26 PM

I wouldn't be comfortable with this situation either. Under the circumstances I don't think the bubble test (soapy water right?) is sufficient. Did the contractor do a pressure leak down test when installed? Will he do leak down test now?

Also, what can be said about the integrity of the generator?

hokoman · #5 06-12-2019, 03:38 PM

I had a leak in a rental house in Brooklyn. I could smell it at times and I knew it was coming from the range. I had 2 different contractors out and tried to figure it out, both used the soapy water test and sprayed all over the place. One said they smelled it and couldn't find it, the other said he couldn't smell it either. My wife didn't believe me, until finally her friend came over and mentioned it.

I called Con Edison and they sent someone - their sniffer machine tracked it immediately. It was the smallest leak coming from the flexible hose from the gas line to range.

I would try and get someone with a sniffer or whatever they call it to test again.

Jaybee · #6 06-12-2019, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hokoman

I had a leak in a rental house in Brooklyn. I could smell it at times and I knew it was coming from the range. I had 2 different contractors out and tried to figure it out, both used the soapy water test and sprayed all over the place. One said they smelled it and couldn't find it, the other said he couldn't smell it either. My wife didn't believe me, until finally her friend came over and mentioned it.

I called Con Edison and they sent someone - their sniffer machine tracked it immediately. It was the smallest leak coming from the flexible hose from the gas line to range.

I would try and get someone with a sniffer or whatever they call it to test again.

The "sniffer" is probably a PID, or photoionization detector. Should be able to detect methane down to the single PPM range, and the utility field crews should carry them as a safety tool.

FlashUNC · #7 06-12-2019, 03:53 PM

Keep pushing. The whole reason for the odor is to flag when its leaking.

Dave · #8 06-12-2019, 04:06 PM

I had gas smell near my meter. I used the special product that bubbles to show a leak and found nothing leaking at any fitting. Finally called the gas company and they found it with a sniffer. A union just needed tightening.

If there's a valve you can shut off, I'd shut the generator off until the leak is found.

rwsaunders · #9 06-12-2019, 04:36 PM

I'd start with the couplings as others have mentioned and code requires a shutoff valve between the supply line and the generator. Is the pipe above ground or underground? I ask as CSST by code needs to be installed in watertight, non-metallic conduit if underground as directly burying CSST can cause damage when backfilling. Last question and nothing to do with a leak, did the contractor bond and ground the CSST for lightning strikes?

charliedid · #10 06-12-2019, 04:46 PM

Rent or buy a tester ($25-$125 ) and see if you can locate?

We did this when I was managing properties. We would find teeny tiny pin holes. I worked with a guy who loved to light them with a match to light his smoke. That guy...

Hope you find it but I'd press the contractor harder as well.

AngryScientist · #11 06-12-2019, 05:27 PM

firts off, if they were just using soapy water, that's not good enough for small leaks, a product called "snoop" is much more sensitive with bubble action to find small leaks because it doesnt run off as fast:

you may pick up a bottle of that and test yourself to prove where the leak is or might be.

realistically though, you paid someone for an installation and now you smell gas. as flash mentioned, the whole reason they oderize gas for residential applications is for safety concerns to alert people of leaks; and if you and others smell gas - there is obviously a leak. i would push the issue until they fix you up - that's part of a complete job.

if they arent too responsive and you want to fiddle with it, i'd shut the gas off, take apart the union to the flex hose, clean the mating surfaces, grease the threads and re-tighten everything - that might just fix your issue without too much hassle.

Mikej · #12 06-12-2019, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charliedid

Rent or buy a tester ($25-$125 ) and see if you can locate?

We did this when I was managing properties. We would find teeny tiny pin holes. I worked with a guy who loved to light them with a match to light his smoke. That guy...

Hope you find it but I'd press the contractor harder as well.

Pretty sure the corrugated flexible line runs through the basement and is connected to the main hard plumbed black pipe to the generator, so it’s not the generator valve to be concerned about, that’s outside. Replace the line with black pipe, I was a pipe fitter at one time.

charliedid · #13 06-12-2019, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikej

Pretty sure the corrugated flexible line runs through the basement and is connected to the main hard plumbed black pipe to the generator, so it’s not the generator valve to be concerned about, that’s outside. Replace the line with black pipe, I was a pipe fitter at one time.

Good advice

sparky33 · #14 06-12-2019, 06:50 PM

Don’t f around or call it good enough.
It’s not right if you can smell it.

PeregrineA1 · #15 06-12-2019, 07:06 PM

I’d run poly pipe under ground and the flex only at the gen set to account for vibration. I would be surprised if the flex is certified for direct burial. Hard pipe the connection to the meter to poly underground to hard pipe riser to flex. More money, more work, most safe. Check the code.

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