Wrenching Thoughts? - 9100 Front Derailleur Adjustment Issue

[bikser]

First of all I have built up many many bikes, and have been working on bikes for 30+ years. Ran into a problem I have not had before.

I have a new Wilier carbon frame that I'm putting on a Dura Ace 9100 group. When the chain (KMC 11) is on the biggest cog (30t) and on small chainring it will rub on the inside cage of the front derailleur (braze-on). After initial installation and adjustment couldn't get it not to rub, so I disconnected everything and loosened High/Low adjustment screws so that the derailleur was as far toward the frame as possible. Still the chain just barely rubs against that plastic plate. My first thought was to move the chainset out a hair with a shim (1mm). That gave me about 1mm of gap between the chain and frt der plate, but then I could tell the chainline to the big cog was a little off. The chain kind of hits the cog at an angle (visibly noticeable) which results in a little noise. Thoughts?

Is it possible the front derailleur is somehow defective? I would doubt the frame has an issue. It came with an Ultegra group that worked fine.

[josephr]

my experience with KMC chain is that its a little chatty for the first 100 miles or so....but i can understand why the chainline is of a concern too...hard to say.

[madsciencenow]

Don’t know that it matters but is the crank also 9100 and what groupo was on before? R8000 or 6800?


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[yetitotheheady]

Is the 2mm support screw backed out far enough to let the derailleur to rest imboard enough to not rub the chain. page 9 of this pfd http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/dm/DM-RAFD001-01-ENG.pdf

[chiasticon]

Originally Posted by bikser

I have a new Wilier carbon frame that I'm putting on a Dura Ace 9100 group.

problem number one: you should put the group on the frame, not vice versa.

problem number two: Shimano with an Italian frame.

(I'll show myself out...)

[rePhil]

I would suggest starting over from the beginning. Coming from Campy 10 was an experience for me. There are plenty of Youtube videos out there. Joey Mesa knows his stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T57glZEeJw8


Here's another: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izth47flvvs

[bikser]

I'll check out the videos. Crank I have installed is the 9100, previous groups was 6800.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by bikser

I'll check out the videos. Crank I have installed is the 9100, previous groups was 6800.

‘Some’ pretty fat tube seat tube bikes just put the front der too far out even with limit screw all the way out. Some Mosaics and Serottas I’ve seen have this issue. ‘Maybe’ a gentle bend? I’m guessing it’s a braze-on, which puts a lot of front ders pretty far out anyway. May need to cant the front der a little ‘tail in’..

[zmalwo]

Originally Posted by chiasticon

problem number one: you should put the group on the frame, not vice versa.

problem number two: Shimano with an Italian frame.

(I'll show myself out...)

Isn't every Italian brand using Shimano Nowadays? Pinarello betrayed Campy around 2010 and Colnago doesn't even show Campy bikes as front page display bikes anymore. anyways I had the same problem with R8000 FD on a 2017 Cervelo S5, the cage won't retract far enough to give the chain enough clearance, loosened every adjustment screw but no luck, so I parted the bike out on ebay.

[NHAero]

Coming back to this thread.
This evening I installed an Ultegra R8000 FD on my Firefly with 9100 shifters. I followed the step by step directions in the Dealers Manual, twice from scratch, and couldn't get it to not rub on the chain guide when in the big ring and the small cogs. Finally I found this thread and watched the Joey Mesa video linked above. It differs in a key area. Shimano's manual has you set the top adjustment with the H screw and the chain set on the big ring and the big cog. Mesa has you using the H screw adjustment with the chain on the big ring and small cog, to set chain clearance to the outer plate of the chain guide - and this makes much more sense, and works!

[bikser]

What I had learned was after the securing the cable step loosen the left “L” adjuster screw. That bought me all the space I needed.

[NHAero]

Yup - and your issue was inside rubbing, and mine was outside rubbing in high gears.
These are really limit stops in the same way that traditional FDs have them. They seem to be more like a jack screw. As I screwed the H screw in the cage moved, whereas pulling cable had no effect. So it seems that the cage moves independently of the base mechanism. I could still be misunderstanding, but the video has different instructions, that work, vs. the Shimano manual.

Originally Posted by bikser

What I had learned was after the securing the cable step loosen the left “L” adjuster screw. That bought me all the space I needed.