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  #1  
Old 04-06-2013, 01:16 PM
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oldpotatoe oldpotatoe is online now
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For you metallurgists-ti galling

Ok, here's the problem.

Legend Ti frame, Record RD with ti fixing bolt. Regular customer, I have taken his RD off and put back on many times...no problem.

He travels with bike, takes RD off..this time when putting it back on..LOTS of resistance(it's not cross threaded, lathered with antisieze)..and when he tried to take it back off..no-can-do.

Brings it to me and to take it off, the typical mucho noise, WACK, Wack, big noise as it comes of in spurts, complete with sparks..obviously galled in there. So I DO finally get it off, swap the ti bolt with another one..re lather with antisieze..put it back on, not a lot of resistance but some..same issue getting it off again...

What is going on? Undoubtedly it's ti to ti galling but why? And what to do?

I'm stumped, never seen this before.
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  #2  
Old 04-06-2013, 01:22 PM
TPetsch TPetsch is offline
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Well, you installed a new bolt, so you know the threads on that are perfect.

How about chasing the threads on the frame to clean it of any debris?
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Old 04-06-2013, 01:25 PM
gemship gemship is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TPetsch View Post
Well, you installed a new bolt, so you know the threads on that are perfect.

How about chasing the threads on the frame to clean it of any debris?
beat me to it...I would suggest a cut type tap with some tap oil if they are thru threads otherwise a roll form tap although the cut type will work either way.
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Old 04-07-2013, 07:00 AM
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beat me to it...I would suggest a cut type tap with some tap oil if they are thru threads otherwise a roll form tap although the cut type will work either way.
Thought of that, try tomorrow but I'm worried I'll get the tape stuck in the der hanger or it will break off.

Also gonna try a steel bolt also.

Thanks for all the posts...
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Last edited by oldpotatoe; 04-07-2013 at 07:02 AM.
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Old 04-07-2013, 02:38 PM
Mikej Mikej is offline
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Originally Posted by oldpotatoe View Post
Thought of that, try tomorrow but I'm worried I'll get the tape stuck in the der hanger or it will break off.

Also gonna try a steel bolt also.

Thanks for all the posts...
Tap will cut its way out. Let us know how it works. I had this happen to an older moots clamp post - it's now a $200 bottle opener. The threads were really creaking in and out. Threads rolled. Re tap and be sure to clean it out and inspect for cracking at the thread root. It's not the bolt. Be sure it's not an npt tap.

Last edited by Mikej; 04-07-2013 at 02:40 PM.
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  #6  
Old 04-07-2013, 04:28 PM
gemship gemship is offline
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Originally Posted by oldpotatoe View Post
Thought of that, try tomorrow but I'm worried I'll get the tape stuck in the der hanger or it will break off.

Also gonna try a steel bolt also.

Thanks for all the posts...
No worries, when you feel the tap doesn't want to go further just back off and clean it with a rag certainly no forcing it. (I always used compressed air and blow it off, my days in the machine shop) eventually you'll chase the galling out. Good luck and keep us posted!
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Old 04-07-2013, 06:51 PM
51mondays 51mondays is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gemship View Post
No worries, when you feel the tap doesn't want to go further just back off and clean it with a rag certainly no forcing it. (I always used compressed air and blow it off, my days in the machine shop) eventually you'll chase the galling out. Good luck and keep us posted!
well said

i use an aluminium bolt - i figure if the bolt gets screwed (excuse the pun) at least its disposable...
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  #8  
Old 04-07-2013, 07:07 PM
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Update

Quote:
Originally Posted by gemship View Post
No worries, when you feel the tap doesn't want to go further just back off and clean it with a rag certainly no forcing it. (I always used compressed air and blow it off, my days in the machine shop) eventually you'll chase the galling out. Good luck and keep us posted!
Bought a new tap, fresh bottle of cutting oil..ran the tap, actually went thru from both sides pretty easy..bolted RD to frame and.........same thing along with some really colorful sparks. So...swapped for a steel bolt. And all seems ok..still not sure *** is going on..I'm gonna blame it on Ben.



Doohhh!!
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Old 04-07-2013, 07:21 PM
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Tony T Tony T is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldpotatoe View Post
Bought a new tap, fresh bottle of cutting oil..ran the tap, actually went thru from both sides pretty easy..bolted RD to frame and.........same thing along with some really colorful sparks. So...swapped for a steel bolt. And all seems ok..still not sure *** is going on..I'm gonna blame it on Ben.



Doohhh!!
Same Ti bolt, or did you try a new Ti bolt?
[Edit: Never mind, I see you used a new bolt]
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  #10  
Old 04-07-2013, 07:55 PM
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AgilisMerlin AgilisMerlin is offline
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Funky design

Merlin decided to put in a top and bottom stainless sleeve on their integrated headsets/head tube design

I am questioning at this point / it is bonded and was never meant to be removed in the first place. These inserts are what the bearings sit on / cane creek is-2


Curious if ti will eat the stainless over time, like it eats the shimano cups 6500. I have had large chunks of bb cups disappear over time?
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  #11  
Old 04-07-2013, 08:10 PM
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AgilisMerlin AgilisMerlin is offline
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maybe i am wrong,

this looks like ti insert. anyone know?

curious

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  #12  
Old 04-07-2013, 09:23 PM
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firerescuefin firerescuefin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AgilisMerlin View Post
Funky design

Merlin decided to put in a top and bottom stainless sleeve on their integrated headsets/head tube design

I am questioning at this point / it is bonded and was never meant to be removed in the first place. These inserts are what the bearings sit on / cane creek is-2


Curious if ti will eat the stainless over time, like it eats the shimano cups 6500. I have had large chunks of bb cups disappear over time?
They (merlin integrated sleeve) were designed to be replaceable. CK inset is a traditional/much better solution.
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  #13  
Old 04-07-2013, 09:25 PM
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AgilisMerlin AgilisMerlin is offline
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Originally Posted by firerescuefin View Post
They (merlin integrated sleeve) were designed to be replaceable. CK inset is a traditional/much better solution.
what specific tools need to pull and push the inserts, curious. King specific?

oh, do you know whether the original sleeves are ti?
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  #14  
Old 04-07-2013, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AgilisMerlin View Post
what specific tools need to pull and push the inserts, curious. King specific?

oh, do you know whether the original sleeves are ti?
They were stainless. Not sure about the tools, but the LBS said the inset install was super easy and gave me back the old cups. They were treated. I can shoot a couple of pics with the inset installed if you want.
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Old 04-07-2013, 09:29 PM
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thankyou
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