OT: It's time to pay college athletes.

[KJMUNC]

While I think something needs changing, I wasn't thrilled to hear that this bill was passed today as it's far too open ended.

As someone who played football for one of the biggest programs in the country (even though I was mostly just practice fodder for the starters and NFL-bound), I feel pretty qualified to offer an opinion here:

I'm not for individual player endorsements as that has all kinds of individual-driven complications in a large team sport that are too hard to untangle.

I AM all for some sort of compensation agreement between the school and athlete based on some combination of # of seasons/years with a binary-trigger bonus for graduation.

I also believe compensation should be designed to enable something useful AFTER you leave school: pay off school debt, down payment on house, start investing, etc.

Case in point: my alma mater's football program brings in roughly >$150M/yr and the athletic programs there in general top $200M with a $40M+ profit margin.

So let's do simple math: say you set-up a fund where you could earn up to $50k if you compete at least 4 seasons and graduate (with decremented step-downs from there if you do less/don't graduate). You're talking about a $7M hit for a team of 140 players......and that's not an annual cost, as the team might turnover 30 players a year, so it's more like $1.5M annually with a 5yr turnover required for the full $7M. That's <1% of annual revenues. Heck, make it $100k....choose any number you want.....it's not making a dent for the large programs.

Obviously things are more complicated for schools that don't bring in $150M/year in football revenue, but why shouldn't the NCAA step in to help? They generated $1B in revenue last year.....

As an NCAA athlete I couldn't hold a job in college, got no official benefits (food, clothing, etc) beyond uniforms and warmups, and was typically busy with school or practice 12hrs a day for most of the year while the university made money hand over fist selling anything they could (or generating donations). It would've been nice to walk away with something to help start life for all that non-class/non-degree investment I put in for the school.

CA's bill isn't perfect, but maybe it will finally force the NCAA to have a realistic dialog about options.

[AngryScientist]

Originally Posted by jtbadge

This thread is already a train wreck. Predictable responses from old white men about how young people of color need to sit down and shut up. Might as well shut it down now.

to me this thread appears to be a civil, thoughtful discussion. throwing racial statements, which are completely baseless are what get's threads shut down, such as the one you posted.

how do you know any responses here are from "old white men"?

i can think of 100 ways you could have presented an opinion on this matter without having to stoop to the level you did.

you have earned a 2-week time out, since you should know better.

[saf-t]

and as a tangentially related issue, how many professors could be hired for the cost of just *one* of these guys?


Disclaimer: I know a whole bunch of folks teaching in colleges as adjuncts who are making a few grand per class because their institutions find "more cost effective" to do it that way than hiring tenured faculty who get benefits.

[fiamme red]

Originally Posted by saf-t

and as a tangentially related issue, how many professors could be hired for the cost of just *one* of these guys?


Disclaimer: I know a whole bunch of folks teaching in colleges as adjuncts who are making a few grand per class because their institutions find "more cost effective" to do it that way than hiring tenured faculty who get benefits.

I have a friend with a PhD who is teaching six college courses this semester (three at one school, three at another) as an adjunct, and he's barely getting by.

But the argument can be made that Saban and Meyer generate many times their salary in revenues for their schools.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by Rada

Maybe it's time for colleges to do what they are meant to do and get out of sports.

Too much money involved, although I agree. Let these athletes ‘major’ in their sport instead of the BS about ‘student athletes’. If they want to take other classes, let them but recognize it for what it is, minor league farm teams training for the pros.

[reconstyle]

Let's be honest here - athletics is only a small part of the problem. The whole college system is the US is a gigantic disaster.

Education is big business, and regardless of the fact that all d1 schools are "non-profit" - the majority of their decisions, whether athletic or academic, are driven by money. Until that changes, we'll continue to have ballooning student debt which will drive the US into an absolutely massive recession.

[beeatnik]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

to me this thread appears to be a civil, thoughtful discussion. throwing racial statements, which are completely baseless are what get's threads shut down, such as the one you posted.

how do you know any responses here are from "old white men"?

i can think of 100 ways you could have presented an opinion on this matter without having to stoop to the level you did.

you have earned a 2-week time out, since you should know better.

Confused by this. As a person of color (ethnically) and, more importantly, someone who has been banned on multiple occasions, I don't interpret James's statement as a violation of the forum's conduct policy. Speculating about demographics and describing a group in developmental terms regardless of intent should be "protected speech." When it comes to the decisions that affect major american athletics, aren't old(er) white men the decision makers? As they represent not just the largest demographic group but the most influential. Interestingly enough, ancestry.com revealed to me that I'm an old(er) white man.

And what about banning the guy who called my thread a "mess" and insulted weird people (we're a class!)

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showp...&postcount=128

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showp...&postcount=156

[akelman]

Originally Posted by reconstyle

Let's be honest here - athletics is only a small part of the problem. The whole college system is the US is a gigantic disaster.

The rest of the world sends its best and brightest to the United States for higher education, and our system is a disaster? I'm genuinely confused.

[reconstyle]

Originally Posted by akelman

The rest of the world sends its best and brightest to the United States for higher education, and our system is a disaster? I'm genuinely confused.

Burden of proof is on you to substantiate that claim.

[Black Dog]

Originally Posted by beeatnik

Confused by this. As a person of color (ethnically) and, more importantly, someone who has been banned on multiple occasions, I don't interpret James's statement as a violation of the forum's conduct policy. Speculating about demographics and describing a group in developmental terms regardless of intent should be "protected speech." When it comes to the decisions that affect major american athletics, aren't old(er) white men the decision makers? As they represent not just the largest demographic group but the most influential. Interestingly enough, ancestry.com revealed to me that I'm an old(er) white man.

And what about banning the guy who called my thread a "mess" and insulted weird people (we're a class!)

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showp...&postcount=128

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showp...&postcount=156

I agree. The two of week ban seems, prima facia, to be heavy handed. Is it not older white men that are making huge profits off primarily black athletes who are never going to be compensated if they are injured and disabled in any way while generating massive revenue for the NCAA and a few schools.

[sjbraun]

"you have earned a 2-week time out, since you should know better."

This is a bit harsh and unwarranted, IMHO

[akelman]

Originally Posted by reconstyle

Burden of proof is on you to substantiate that claim.

I'm totally mystified. You think our system is a disaster? How so? And you don't think the brightest young people come from around the world to study at American colleges and universities? Also, are we in court now? There's a burden of proof that must be met by the...wait, who?

All kidding aside, here are two questions: how's our system a disaster (I well might agree with you)? And do you think people who have the means from around the world don't come to the United States for higher education?

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by beeatnik

Confused by this. As a person of color (ethnically) and, more importantly, someone who has been banned on multiple occasions, I don't interpret James's statement as a violation of the forum's conduct policy. Speculating about demographics and describing a group in developmental terms regardless of intent should be "protected speech." When it comes to the decisions that affect major american athletics, aren't old(er) white men the decision makers? As they represent not just the largest demographic group but the most influential. Interestingly enough, ancestry.com revealed to me that I'm an old(er) white man.

And what about banning the guy who called my thread a "mess" and insulted weird people (we're a class!) gotta admit, that's funny...

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showp...&postcount=128

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showp...&postcount=156

All humor aside, Nick was right on point. jtbadge's comments did nothing to further the dialogue. If he thought the thread was BS (fair enough) he should've articulated it in another manner. Shaming people on their (perceived) pigment is a zero sum game. There are many words at one's disposal for a sentient individual (which, from the postings I've seen from jtbadge, he most certainly is.) He should've used them. I can't speak to the "time-out." But, again, Nick was certainly in the right to point out the response was ill-thought out, at the very least.

[beeatnik]

Originally Posted by XXtwindad

All humor aside, Nick was right on point. jtbadge's comments did nothing to further the dialogue. If he thought the thread was BS (fair enough) he should've articulated it in another manner. Shaming people on their (perceived) pigment is a zero sum game. There are many words at one's disposal for a sentient individual (which, from the postings I've seen from jtbadge, he most certainly is.) He should've used them.

It's shameful to be an older white male? Was my thread locked because fat (for LA) became a punchline?

[Black Dog]

Originally Posted by akelman

I'm totally mystified. You think our system is a disaster? How so? And you don't think the brightest young people come from around the world to study at American colleges and universities? Also, are we in court now? There's a burden of proof that must be met by the...wait, who?

All kidding aside, here are two questions: how's our system a disaster (I well might agree with you)? And do you think people who have the means from around the world don't come to the United States for higher education?

Err ummm. People of means from around the world go to good schools in Canada and Europe not just the USA. Primarily because their countries of origin do not have equivalent schools.