OT: Uniqlo Selling Colnago and Bianchi T-Shirts

[9tubes]

Originally Posted by Burnette

There's not as much uniqueness between brands as there use to be. Most big brands share the same place of origin and hype and tube shapes are the only things you can use to tell a difference.

I dunno about that. I started riding in the 80s when every brand used Columbus tubes, Super Record groups, and Mavic rims. The only thing different was the paint, and for those bikes imported by Ten Speed Drive, not even the paint.

[9tubes]

Originally Posted by robertbb

Yep, on point.

As long as there are people out there willing to drop $5k on a frame comprised of tubes made in Asia, then glued together and painted in Italy, all power to them.

As always, the market decides.

Looking over at the thread here on coffee machines, plus on other forums and on discussion with "coffee snobs", there is an overwhelmingly big bias towards Italian brands. Whether that actually means better coffee is hugely debatable. I honestly reckon I've pulled better shots from my $700 Breville (Sage) dual boiler, than I've had from Italian units priced 10 times that much.

The reason coffee machines are made in Italy is that coffee machines are made in Italy. They have the designers, suppliers, engineers, etc. Any other country could develop a coffee machine industry if they felt it was worth the effort. Recently ECM and Profitec in Germany have started to build very good machines.

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by 9tubes

I dunno about that. I started riding in the 80s when every brand used Columbus tubes, Super Record groups, and Mavic rims. The only thing different was the paint, and for those bikes imported by Ten Speed Drive, not even the paint.

You're right, it's not new, it's just on a macro level now. The same factories pump out frames for so many brands, they have common point of origin and tube shapes are the differentiator. Sometimes even those are the same across some brands.

[kiwisimon]

Ferrari make more money from licensing products than they do from selling cars.
I think I need to get a BMC Team machine shirt or 4

here is the line up
https://favorite-fashion.com/fashion834/

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by kiwisimon

Ferrari make more money from licensing products than they do from selling cars.
I think I need to get a BMC Team machine shirt or 4

here is the line up
https://favorite-fashion.com/fashion834/

That black Peppa Pig tshirt is the best looking design on that site IMO.

[rallizes]

Originally Posted by rallizes

"They aren't selling on quality or engineering anymore. Fit and finish on the Colnago c64's has been rubbish."

anyone care to expand on this?

anyone?

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by rallizes

anyone?

It was explained above, bikes are mass produced plastic blobs, there's not one guy at a bench building your bike, it's coming from Taiwan.

In the past they touted how they were different but that difference was gone along time ago.

Frame makers, wheel makers, whoever will say, "they are making it to our specifications", yeah, a d it's more the same than different than the frame made for another company made right beside it.

[rallizes]

Originally Posted by Burnette

It was explained above, bikes are mass produced plastic blobs, there's not one guy at a bench building your bike, it's coming from Taiwan.

In the past they touted how they were different but that difference was gone along time ago.

Frame makers, wheel makers, whoever will say, "they are making it to our specifications", yeah, a d it's more the same than different than the frame made for another company made right beside it.

is engineering not involved?

and the fit on the C64 is rubbish? how so?

genuinely curious

"there's not one guy at a bench building your bike, it's coming from Taiwan."

not sure the former always beats the latter..

[9tubes]

Before we bash all bikes as mass-produced plastic blobs, let's remember that there are a few hand-laid custom carbon makers in the U.S. Crumpton, Alchemy, Parlee, Hampsten...

[robertbb]

Originally Posted by rallizes

is engineering not involved?

and the fit on the C64 is rubbish? how so?

genuinely curious

"there's not one guy at a bench building your bike, it's coming from Taiwan."

not sure the former always beats the latter..

Sure, there is "engineering" involved. But that is limited to within the constructs of the Colnago C-series design language (which involves lugs primarily, but also requires the tubes to be shaped a certain way to be part of the family).

If one was to approach designing a carbon frame from a purely engineering perspective, it wouldn't use lugs and it certainly wouldn't have tubes shaped like that. It also wouldn't have 300 grams worth of extra paint.

Anyway, what I meant by rubbish fit and finish is simply the quality. Shonky paint jobs, chipped or scratched carbon, improperly fixed/aligned ports/covers... a few BB issues...

They are bikes like any other, things happen. But for the price they command, one would expect better QC. And don't even think about asking Colnago for a warranty. Standard Italian warranty applies there - warranty valid until you walk out the door.

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by rallizes

is engineering not involved?

and the fit on the C64 is rubbish? how so?

genuinely curious

"there's not one guy at a bench building your bike, it's coming from Taiwan."

not sure the former always beats the latter..

Engineering is involved but again it's more about shapes to differentiate than it is about any real gain. Once they got strength and weight in a happy common place they just strive to be noticed for added features.

And if "rubbish" is a hurtful term, maybe try generic and rough in some places, it gets the point across more sensitively.

Does this make them bad? No, in fact some are awesome, it's just that the old romantic image has nothing in common with the modern product and how it's made. Nostalgia is selling the tshirts, Taiwan is making the bikes.

[rallizes]

@robertbb
@Burnette

much thanks for the responses

i am most familiar with a few C40s i have owned and am i big fan of them

i have some C64 cravings but it is interesting for sure to hear some naysayers

who knows you guys may turn out to be the voices of reason

thanks again