ENVE 2.2s: So flexy!

[many_styles]

Originally Posted by jimmy-moots

I have these, and yes you need to wind your brake blocks out pretty far (both in relative and absolute terms given they’re 28mm OD rims).

You need more spokes.

What you are experiencing is not flex, but deflection due to extreme stiffness.

This is the explainer I have found: https://www.slowtwitch.com/Tech/Debu...ness_3449.html

Thanks! I’ll take a look at the article! I have eeBrake calipers, so I have plenty of leeway to space the pads out. Again, it’s very subtle rubbing. I think within a few more rides, it might go away.

[jimoots]

Originally Posted by krooj

I keep wanting to try a set of these wheels and then I read about something like this. I had the same problem with the 3.4 on DT240s and I get the stiffness argument, but at the end of the day, the wheel is not the rim, it's not the hub, it's a complete package that needs to work coherently. For whatever reason, Enve SES rim brake wheels fail to behave properly as a coherent thing. Maybe there are some magical hubs or spokes the rims could be laced up with to avoid these issues?

They do look really nice tho

I have 2.2’s and 3.4’s, the 3.4’s don’t exhibit the same issue.

I suspect it has something to do with the amount of spoke (ie 2cm less with the 45mm rear) but that’s intuition not actual knowledge

Also from a performance perspective, as long as I have enough pad clearance (which is easily doable) the 2.2’s feel fine and climb very fast, I use them as a race wheel for uphill tt’s.

[Hilltopperny]

I have a set of 2.2s with CK hubs and the wheels flex a lot if I get out of the saddle and stomp on the pedals, but I am 210lbs. They are fine when seated and this is less noticeable when pedaling smoothly.

The wheels are sufficient for the riding I do on them, but if I were racing or putting down hard efforts regularly then I would use a different set of wheels.

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[BdaGhisallo]

What spokes are they built with? More spoke material - greater cross section - will make the rear wheel more laterally stiff. If you're going to rebuild them, get some beefy double-butted spokes for the rear.

In my experimenting, I found that beefier spokes were the single biggest factor when it came to achieving lateral stiffness. The effect of the beefier spokes outweighed using hubs with "superior" wheel building geometry.

[many_styles]

Originally Posted by jimmy-moots

I have 2.2’s and 3.4’s, the 3.4’s don’t exhibit the same issue.

I suspect it has something to do with the amount of spoke (ie 2cm less with the 45mm rear) but that’s intuition not actual knowledge

Also from a performance perspective, as long as I have enough pad clearance (which is easily doable) the 2.2’s feel fine and climb very fast, I use them as a race wheel for uphill tt’s.

Thanks again for sharing! I like how they look and if you say they climb well, that’s another reason to stick with them!


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[texbike]

Many_Styles,

What generation are your 2.2s? I have set with Enve's carbon hubs and do get a small amount of rub from the rear wheel occasionally but really need to be standing up and cranking on the bike. I'm 165 lbs and a bit of a smooth, lower-cadence rider.

Texbike

[many_styles]

Text,
According to the serial number, they were manufactured in 2017! Textured brake track with CK R45 hubs with ceramic bearings.

Here’s spoke length based on the different hubs they used for each generation: https://support.enve.com/hc/en-us/ar...-2-Spoke-Chart

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[jimoots]

Originally Posted by texbike

Many_Styles,

What generation are your 2.2s? I have set with Enve's carbon hubs and do get a small amount of rub from the rear wheel occasionally but really need to be standing up and cranking on the bike. I'm 165 lbs and a bit of a smooth, lower-cadence rider.

Texbike

I’m sub-140lbs, gen 2 (textured track) rims and dt240 hubs. Anything out of the saddle will get a zing zing on the pads if they don’t have decent clearance

As another data point that I’d forgot about until now - I rode Zipp 202’s (32mm depth) for a decent amount of time and didn’t have the same issues. They were 18/24 spoke (2.2’s are 20/24).

The more I think about it, the more of a head scratcher is that enve ever released these wheels to public.

When I bought mine it was a bit of an impulse purchase as I got a very good deal and probably wouldn’t buy them again (just as super light non aero is a very limited use case)… And like I said, they climb well and I’m not convinced the deflection has any performance impact…

But jeez, if I paid retail I would’ve been disappointed.

[many_styles]

Yeah, no way I would buy these at retail either. I just brought them recently and they’re in really good condition.

I’ll hold onto them for now and maybe later go with a custom set, silver WI T11 to Astral Veil3s.


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[krooj]

Originally Posted by jimmy-moots

I’m sub-140lbs, gen 2 (textured track) rims and dt240 hubs. Anything out of the saddle will get a zing zing on the pads if they don’t have decent clearance

As another data point that I’d forgot about until now - I rode Zipp 202’s (32mm depth) for a decent amount of time and didn’t have the same issues. They were 18/24 spoke (2.2’s are 20/24).

The more I think about it, the more of a head scratcher is that enve ever released these wheels to public.

When I bought mine it was a bit of an impulse purchase as I got a very good deal and probably wouldn’t buy them again (just as super light non aero is a very limited use case)… And like I said, they climb well and I’m not convinced the deflection has any performance impact…

But jeez, if I paid retail I would’ve been disappointed.

FC/NSW 202s were peak carbon rim brake. I had a set of the FC202s on the cheapie hubs and would kill to get a set of the rims NOS and lace them to something more befitting of that rim.

I nearly bought a set of the 2.2s from John Jones (RIP) back in '16 and kept reading reports of brake rub, which was no bueno since I was almost exclusively into climbing back then.

OP - if you can stomach the loss, I would have those King hubs re-laced to something from BTLOS like the RC-30. They'll be lighter, no brake rub, wider, and stop better - they just come with zero street cred and you won't get any nods from the PAS influencers. I'm pretty sure you can take those 2.2 rims and lace them up again if you feel sore about it.

[Heisenberg]

Alternatively, sell them and buy a set of DA C24s, Campy Bora 35s, or Hyperons.

Profit.

I've ridden the **** out of 2.2s on both ENVE Carbon hubs and DT180s, they're just not very good. The ride pales in comparison to the above named wheels, and the frame/brake rub is just stupid.

[many_styles]

Originally Posted by krooj

FC/NSW 202s were peak carbon rim brake. I had a set of the FC202s on the cheapie hubs and would kill to get a set of the rims NOS and lace them to something more befitting of that rim.

I nearly bought a set of the 2.2s from John Jones (RIP) back in '16 and kept reading reports of brake rub, which was no bueno since I was almost exclusively into climbing back then.

OP - if you can stomach the loss, I would have those King hubs re-laced to something from BTLOS like the RC-30. They'll be lighter, no brake rub, wider, and stop better - they just come with zero street cred and you won't get any nods from the PAS influencers. I'm pretty sure you can take those 2.2 rims and lace them up again if you feel sore about it.

That’s the real reason I bought these, PAS street cred!

Originally Posted by Heisenberg

Alternatively, sell them and buy a set of DA C24s, Campy Bora 35s, or Hyperons.

Profit.

I've ridden the **** out of 2.2s on both ENVE Carbon hubs and DT180s, they're just not very good. The ride pales in comparison to the above named wheels, and the frame/brake rub is just stupid.

If I had a DA groupset, or Campy, I’d consider either. For now, I’ll keep them. I did a punchy climb yesterday after adjusting the preload on the rear hub. Unsure if that helped, or also maybe the brake pads have worn down enough, but I didn’t hear much rub.

Again, later on, I might delace the CK hubs and pair them up to some Astral Veil 3s.


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