ot: is it too controversial to discuss Daytona crash?

[Mr. Pink]

It's actually shrunk, especially after the 08 recession. I guess they're happy with the Yahoo market. But they don't have any money. Reminds me of a thing that happened a long time ago, when the NY Post was trying to sell advertising space to Saks Fifth Avenue, and the comeback in that meeting was, sirs, your readers are my shoplifters.

[el cheapo]

I'm old school and think stock car racing was ruined by Nascar. All the cars are the same except the engines. Who are they trying to kid calling them Camrys or Ford whatever? Look at the races of the 60's and 70's where you could buy the cars they raced at dealerships. As for crashes...isn't that the draw? Most of the highlights televised are the wrecks.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by Clancy

I actually had to Google “pushing” to better understand it. I don’t get it. With that said, I can only imagine the comments NASCAR fans might make after watching a transition stage of the Tour.

From what I gather, what we're talking about here is referred to in racing circles as "bumping", not "pushing". "Pushing" is what happens when you draft too close, and the draft causes a loss of down force and traction on the front of your car, reducing your ability to turn; your front wheels are "pushing" in the turns due to the draft.

[FlashUNC]

Originally Posted by Mark McM

From what I gather, what we're talking about here is referred to in racing circles as "bumping", not "pushing". "Pushing" is what happens when you draft too close, and the draft causes a loss of down force and traction on the front of your car, reducing your ability to turn; your front wheels are "pushing" in the turns due to the draft.

Not it at all.

Pushing is reducing the downforce at the rear of the front car with the follow car so you're both traveling faster than you would otherwise solo.

Less downforce == more faster, but also squirrelly since you're reducing the downforce on the car.

It's one area where I'll give NASCAR drivers credit, their ability to manage already a pretty small amount of downforce and try to eek out every aero advantage is pretty incredible car handling.

Here's a sample of some two car push testing from a few years ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FM7yZAE_0Vo

[bthomas515]

Watching a nascar race live with the pit headphones is actually fascinating. A race can be won and lost in a fraction of a second.

[unterhausen]

NASCAR isn't just not growing, they are bleeding fans at a rate that doesn't seem sustainable. I think Daytona has half the seating it did 10 years ago, and I wonder if they filled it. When POTUS took off, I guess fans might have left the stands due to rain, but there were a lot of empty seats

It's back to where you need an extended basic cable subscription to see many of the races.

[Doug Fattic]

I am never interested in anything about NASCAR except Ryan Newman the guy that crashed yesterday is a local boy from South Bend, Indiana. As I understand it he is one of the few drivers that has graduated from college. He got his degree in engineering from Purdue (located in Indiana) known for it engineering department. The crash just added to his troubles because a few days before he and his attractive wife Krissie separated after being married a long time.

[bthornt]

NASCAR isn't the only form of racing with issues. At least there's constant passing and position shuffling in a NASCAR race. Look at Formula (or Boremula) 1, it's almost always Hamilton as the victor nowadays, just like Vettel before him, just like Schumacher before him, and so on. The worst formula 1 race is Monte Carlo, where earning pole position is equivalent to winning the race. And what about sports car/endurance racing? Look at the stands during the Rolex 24 or Sebring, two of the most historic sports car races. Tons of empty seats. And what about Indy car, or whatever it's being called now.

I think the bottom line is that all forms of motorsport are of declining interest to most people in the US.

[mistermo]

Originally Posted by bthornt

NASCAR isn't the only form of racing with issues. At least there's constant passing and position shuffling in a NASCAR race. Look at Formula (or Boremula) 1, it's almost always Hamilton as the victor nowadays, just like Vettel before him, just like Schumacher before him, and so on. The worst formula 1 race is Monte Carlo, where earning poll position is equivalent to winning the race. And what about sports car/endurance racing? Look at the stands during the Rolex 24 or Sebring, two of the most historic sports car races. Tons of empty seats. And what about Indy car, or whatever it's being called now.

I think the bottom line is that all forms of motorsport are of declining interest to most people in the US.

Fully Agreed. I think Formula E is now the only series where true automotive development is still occurring. Last century was the heyday of ICE development in Indycar and F1. No more. Now it's e-vehicles turn.

[Mr. Pink]

Originally Posted by bthornt

NASCAR isn't the only form of racing with issues. At least there's constant passing and position shuffling in a NASCAR race. Look at Formula (or Boremula) 1, it's almost always Hamilton as the victor nowadays, just like Vettel before him, just like Schumacher before him, and so on. The worst formula 1 race is Monte Carlo, where earning poll position is equivalent to winning the race. And what about sports car/endurance racing? Look at the stands during the Rolex 24 or Sebring, two of the most historic sports car races. Tons of empty seats. And what about Indy car, or whatever it's being called now.

I think the bottom line is that all forms of motorsport are of declining interest to most people in the US.

Yeah, used to be a huge fan in the sixties and seventies, almost all forms of the sport. Back then you could walk through the paddock at the Glen and practically steal a wrench, you were so close. Not any more. But, admittably, the sport is much much safer these days.

[gemship]

I never watch Nascar but I did enjoy watching that accident if you could call it that on the morning news. It amazes me that the tech on all levels is good enough to survive that.

Is this too controversial a topic? I don't know depends on this forum's amount of censorship. I do believe the sport is deceptive much like pro football. To me they both have in common a wicked lot of money poured into an elaborate twist on some kinda gladiator like events that take place, read carnage into that. They also contribute if not at least celebrate man's carbon footprint on this earth which indeed maybe the elephant in the room. To that end I believe these pro sports, participation there of can be a test of morality and or good sense even as a paying spectator.

[BdaGhisallo]

Originally Posted by mistermo

Fully Agreed. I think Formula E is now the only series where true automotive development is still occurring. Last century was the heyday of ICE development in Indycar and F1. No more. Now it's e-vehicles turn.

Modern F1 hybrid power units are marvels of engineering, achieving almost unfathomable levels of efficiency for ICEs. It's unbelievable that F1 has never marketed touted this fact.

[tomato coupe]

Originally Posted by BdaGhisallo

Modern F1 hybrid power units are marvels of engineering, achieving almost unfathomable levels of efficiency for ICEs. It's unbelievable that F1 has never marketed touted this fact.

I think the last thing auto racing wants is to have is a discussion about fuel efficiency.

[BobO]

Hoping that Ryan recovers completely.

NASCAR has an issue that they're going to have to deal with because of this crash. It has exposed a weakness in the safety design of the roll cage. The upper portion of the cage called the halo, and most likely the main bar that is just behind the driver, both deformed with the impact of the car while it was inverted. Along with that the entire chassis appears to have bent in the middle of the drivers compartment. The driver is fixed in position, both body and head by the seat that is attached to the lower portions of the cage and the main hoop. From the pictures available, the roll bar structure may have come in contact with his helmet. I certainly hope I am wrong about this. But that doesn't change the fact that NASCAR dictates chassis specifications to the teams, this design belongs to them and it did fail quite badly. Hopefully this lights a fire under them to make an improvement.

[josephr]

Originally Posted by Mr. Pink

It's actually shrunk, especially after the 08 recession. I guess they're happy with the Yahoo market. But they don't have any money. Reminds me of a thing that happened a long time ago, when the NY Post was trying to sell advertising space to Saks Fifth Avenue, and the comeback in that meeting was, sirs, your readers are my shoplifters.

hahaha exactly...NASCAR is certainly getting lost in the market for entertainment and you can only find the big money sports on broadcast TV these days...sports on TV is dying just like shopping malls and movie theaters, theme parks, bowling alleys...I really miss the days when you could randomly kick on the TV and catch NHRA drag racing or down-hill skiiing Howard Cosell and ABC's Wide World of Sports.