The 'Un-Official' Campagnolo Ekar thread

[quacker2000]

The extra sound with the matching crankset vs the mismatched crankset is odd. Unless the chain line is just better? I have Ekar on my bike and get a bit of noise in the low gear as well but I figure it's just the reality of a 1x13 setup.

Fwiw this is the best resource for finicky campy setup info that I've found anywhere: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1176127782723445

[vespasianus]

Originally Posted by Hindmost

Yes. The chain disengaging and angling outward toward the chainring. Under load the chain sticks then releases. When riding makes a slight grinding sound and vibration. On the stand that is the only irregularity I can see. Was pretty annoying in the two biggest cogs with Ekar GT crank Only slighty noticeable in biggest cog with Ekar crank.

Maybe it goes away with wear?

Maybe it will go away but I would not want to wait for that. The vibration is what is odd to me - as that is generally associated with the jockey wheel rubbing.

Any way you can check the hanger alignment - even new bikes can be bad.

And the limit screws are good? I personally like to set the high limit screw (for the smallest cog) just at the point that it will shift down but as close to not shifting down as possible.

I then set the low limit screw (biggest cogs) so that it will shift up from the second biggest cog to the biggest cog quickly and nicely.

After that, I will have poor downshifts (to small cogs) until I set the B-tension to be just right. After that, shifting is all good.

[Hindmost]

Thanks for the suggestions.

I adjusted the hanger once and am getting a better gauge tool to recheck.

The rear wheel, Ritchey, came with two spacers. Appear to be cassette spacers about 1.0 and 2.0 mm. (Not obvious why they were included.) Would it make sense to space the cassette outward?

(Update: not really enough frame clearance for spacers.)

[vespasianus]

Originally Posted by Hindmost

Thanks for the suggestions.

I adjusted the hanger once and am getting a better gauge tool to recheck.

The rear wheel, Ritchey, came with two spacers. Appear to be cassette spacers about 1.0 and 2.0 mm. (Not obvious why they were included.) Would it make sense to space the cassette outward?

No. The N3W is back compatible with 11 and 12 speed Campag cassette and I think those spacers are for those.

The more I think about it, I would pay a little more attention to the limit screws.

[MXLeader]

Originally Posted by vespasianus

No. The N3W is back compatible with 11 and 12 speed Campag cassette and I think those spacers are for those.

The more I think about it, I would pay a little more attention to the limit screws.

If the noise/vibration is in both of the two largest cogs, how do the limit screw adjustments play a role in this? I can see how this would be the case if the noise/vibration was limited to the largest cog, but why the second largest cog?

[vespasianus]

Originally Posted by MXLeader

If the noise/vibration is in both of the two largest cogs, how do the limit screw adjustments play a role in this? I can see how this would be the case if the noise/vibration was limited to the largest cog, but why the second largest cog?

Something is not right and if the sound is from the chain being wrong position, the limit screws can impact that in the largest cog - I am not sure what is going on with the second to largest cog!

The most common thing with noise from the two biggest cogs is b-tension but that is not involved here. Wish I could see it.

[Hindmost]

Here is an attempt at static representation. Roll the wheel backwards, one sees the chainlink interfering with the cog tooth coming into engagement. Imagine forward pedaling, the disengaging link has to 'climb' over the disengaging cog tooth. While peddling the EGT crank, applying the brake, I was able to create this on the stand.

The effect is influenced by chain line, chain stay length, and cog size I imagine.

Here I am running the Ekar crank and the effect in use is minor and may be reduced by cog wear.

I may try the EGT crank again soon. (Things are working OK as is and the weather has been super nice.)

I will continue to fiddle with B screw and re check hanger alignment.

Thanks for your attention.

[vespasianus]

Originally Posted by Hindmost

Here is an attempt at static representation. Roll the wheel backwards, one sees the chainlink interfering with the cog tooth coming into engagement. Imagine forward pedaling, the disengaging link has to 'climb' over the disengaging cog tooth. While peddling the EGT crank, applying the brake, I was able to create this on the stand.

The effect is influenced by chain line, chain stay length, and cog size I imagine.

Here I am running the Ekar crank and the effect in use is minor and may be reduced by cog wear.

I may try the EGT crank again soon. (Things are working OK as is and the weather has been super nice.)

I will continue to fiddle with B screw and re check hanger alignment.

Thanks for your attention.

That looks all wrong. There could be so many things going on here it is hard to diagnose. If your limit screws are wrong, all your cable tension and even indexing will be wrong.

[Hindmost]

Overall the shifting and drive train are working quite well after a minor adjustment to the hanger. The noise associated with the 48 under load is slight and I believe reducing with break in of the cog teeth.

I think the angle to the chain line is the factor. I'll try the EGT crank next.

[vespasianus]

Originally Posted by Hindmost

Overall the shifting and drive train are working quite well after a minor adjustment to the hanger. The noise associated with the 48 under load is slight and I believe reducing with break in of the cog teeth.

I think the angle to the chain line is the factor. I'll try the EGT crank next.

That is good news.

[SonicBoom]

Originally Posted by vespasianus

.

And the limit screws are good? I personally like to set the high limit screw (for the smallest cog) just at the point that it will shift down but as close to not shifting down as possible.

I then set the low limit screw (biggest cogs) so that it will shift up from the second biggest cog to the biggest cog quickly and nicely.

After that, I will have poor downshifts (to small cogs) until I set the B-tension to be just right. After that, shifting is all good.

Can you help me understand the correct interpretation of your process?

High limit: I typically would shift to the lowest cog and have the limit hit the frame. You're suggesting press a bit more in so it's truly at the limit of the shift.

Low limit: I'm not clear how to think of this.

B Screw: I assume this is get to the closest possible distance that allows shifting up and down.

[vespasianus]

Originally Posted by SonicBoom

Can you help me understand the correct interpretation of your process?

High limit: I typically would shift to the lowest cog and have the limit hit the frame. You're suggesting press a bit more in so it's truly at the limit of the shift.

Low limit: I'm not clear how to think of this.

B Screw: I assume this is get to the closest possible distance that allows shifting up and down.

The true process is to set the limit screws without the cable attached and just looking at the pulley and how it lines up with the high and low gears. I generally start with that but find that sometimes, I need to adjust things with the cable attached.

I have my high limit set so that it just shifts to the smallest cog. You probably could turn it a little more but I have always liked to have it set so that it just allows the RD to put the chain into that cog.

For the low limit, I just have it set so that the it will shift to the biggest cog without much issue but not go to far after that.

Of course, cable tension is used to ensure that it shifts into the big cog and back down. The one thing I noticed very early on was that if the beta tension was not set correctly - shifting from the biggest cog to the second biggest cog was poor.

This might be a bad was to set up gears, but I have been doing this for all my bikes for 30+ years and seems to work OK for me.

[Gwerziou]

I had a high-speed downtown collision with a jaywalking pedestrian on my commute home a couple of weeks ago. Totally lost in her cell phone, she walked right in front of me at just the wrong moment - too late to miss her. I'm somewhat surprisingly not hurt much since she took the brunt of the impact (thanks?) but my shifter (and helmet, and handlebar) got messed up. Her latte got spilled.

So I'm taking this opportunity to change to an Ekar drivetrain. I got the updated Ekar GT shifters to go with an Ekar derailleur, and a 9-36 cassette. I'm running an Easton EC90 SL crankset through a Chris King T47 bottom bracket using a 36 tooth Brackish Cycles Ekar direct-mount chainring. Just for hopefully fun I'm trying out Hopetech RX4+ brakes in the +20 configuration, so no adapters needed for 160mm rotors.

I can confirm that for the Ekar GT shifters, the steel pin that prohibits multiple downshifts on the original has been replaced by a built-in 'resin' or whatever the body is made of, bar. It can still be removed. Since my use-case is more 'all road' than gravel per se I wanted to make it work like my other Campy shifters. I just used a fingernail clipper and a small Japanese chisel to remove the material in a few minutes. It's pretty easy to do; the main challenge is getting the hood out of the way - which is quite difficult with the C-shaped shift lever.

It will probably take a couple/three weeks for this amateur mechanic to stumble through setting it up, bleeding the brakes, etc etc. I look forward for the slog to be over and to hit those rough Seattle roads. Then it's look out, cell-phone zombies!

[vespasianus]

Originally Posted by Gwerziou

I had a high-speed downtown collision with a jaywalking pedestrian on my commute home a couple of weeks ago. Totally lost in her cell phone, she walked right in front of me at just the wrong moment - too late to miss her. I'm somewhat surprisingly not hurt much since she took the brunt of the impact (thanks?) but my shifter (and helmet, and handlebar) got messed up. Her latte got spilled.

So I'm taking this opportunity to change to an Ekar drivetrain. I got the updated Ekar GT shifters to go with an Ekar derailleur, and a 9-36 cassette. I'm running an Easton EC90 SL crankset through a Chris King T47 bottom bracket using a 36 tooth Brackish Cycles Ekar direct-mount chainring. Just for hopefully fun I'm trying out Hopetech RX4+ brakes in the +20 configuration, so no adapters needed for 160mm rotors.

I can confirm that for the Ekar GT shifters, the steel pin that prohibits multiple downshifts on the original has been replaced by a built-in 'resin' or whatever the body is made of, bar. It can still be removed. Since my use-case is more 'all road' than gravel per se I wanted to make it work like my other Campy shifters. I just used a fingernail clipper and a small Japanese chisel to remove the material in a few minutes. It's pretty easy to do; the main challenge is getting the hood out of the way - which is quite difficult with the C-shaped shift lever.


It will probably take a couple/three weeks for this amateur mechanic to stumble through setting it up, bleeding the brakes, etc etc. I look forward for the slog to be over and to hit those rough Seattle roads. Then it's look out, cell-phone zombies!

Will be interesting to hear your take on the EKAR GT shifters versus the OG. I have a new build coming that will run a mix like you described.