OT: Olympics chatter

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by Bob Ross

But I have never heard anyone even insinuate that Katie Ledecky is doping.

Why the disparity?

There is a particular generation of cycling fans, generally Americans, who believed at the time that Lance Armstrong was clean. These fans subsequently felt betrayed, and compelled to accuse every subsequent successful cyclist of doping to assure themselves that they'll never make that particular mistake again.

If Michael Phelps were stripped of all his gold medals for doping, swimming fans would probably develop similar behavior, but until that happens, those fans don't have that particular pathology.

[ERK55]

Re Katie Ledecky:
I wouldn’t know anything about PEDS use
But I heard an interview the other night in which she stated (at age 27) that’s never even TASTED beer or wine.
I can’t compete with that.

[Alistair]

Originally Posted by Bob Ross

But I have never heard anyone even insinuate that Katie Ledecky is doping.

Why the disparity?

Because she's American.

Originally Posted by benb

1) Katie Ledecky hasn't won every race she entered, but she is far and away the best at 1500m.

Neither has Pogacar.

Edit - I have no opinion on whether or not she, or any other swimmer, dopes. I don't follow the sport outside the Olympics. I am appalled at the giant pass WADA gave the Chinese on their systemic doping program over the last few years.

[openwheelracing]

oh we are talking about doping?
I am guessing someone got WR or Gold but doesn't look like they belong?

[benb]

Cycling continues to get suspicion because the entire show is still being run by dopers and the fact that the "requires a team but only one person on the team wins" format encourages/rewards systematic doping by the whole team.

Every team in the world tour has staff and/or management that have been implicated in doping scandals or were personally caught doping. They've never even come close to cleaning everyone out and there are tons of clean cycling management guys who are super hypocrites.

Most of these other sports have never had anything close to that level of systematic doping and then continued to let the dopers manage everything.

[Alistair]

Originally Posted by benb

Most of these other sports have never had anything close to that level of systematic doping and then continued to let the dopers manage everything.

Wut?

Entire nations have been banned (or not if they pay off the right people) because of doping.

[smontanaro]

Re: Katie Ledecky, a few points...

Her work ethic is pretty much unmatched. Katie currently swims with the Florida Gators men's squad (coached by Anthony Nesty), where it seems she pretty routinely puts the hurt on them. That includes Olympian distance swimmer Bobby Finke.

American swimmers (athletes in general?) are subject to very intrusive random drug tests. As I understand it, they have to report their whereabouts multiple times a day on an app, so testers can find them. FINA apparently delegates drug testing to the national swimming sports associations. This is a part of reason there has been so much uproar about the failed drug tests of a bunch of Chinese swimmers.

She's been at this a long time. She first set the American record for the 500-yard free in high school. Her first Olympics were in 2012. She was 16 at the time. This is her fourth Olympics.

She absolutely loves to swim. In a recent interview (probably on the NBC Olympics broadcast), in response to the question (paraphrasing), Q: "How does it feel to be out of the water for a few days?" A: "I have to get back in the water." Sounds kinda like Lael Wilcox.

As others have noted, technique is much more important for an inefficient activity like swimming. Her technique looks pretty flawless to me.

[peanutgallery]

Olympics...doping...corruption...nationalism...geo politics?

It's all intertwined and the truly innocent are at the back of the field. Taxpayers get the bill and a bunch of useless facilities. For the affluent...what a party

But the spectacle and the drama is why we all watch

I will admit I always track the medal count. USA, baby!!!

[reuben]

Originally Posted by smontanaro

She absolutely loves to swim. In a recent interview (probably on the NBC Olympics broadcast), in response to the question (paraphrasing), Q: "How does it feel to be out of the water for a few days?" A: "I have to get back in the water." Sounds kinda like Lael Wilcox.

On one of the broadcasts they mentioned that a typical competitive swimmer swims Monday through Saturday, with Sunday off. Katie's coaches noticed that Mondays were almost always her worst day. So they gave her a key to the facility, and she started swimming every day, although on Sundays she didn't necessarily train hard. Her Monday practices were immediately much better, and the other days didn't suffer.

It seems like she's so mentally and physically in tune with swimming that she actually needs it in order to function at her best. 48 hours out of the pool was too long.

[buddybikes]

I was attempting a business call with Simone doing her floor exercise, didn't remember much of what was said for those few minutes....

[XXtwindad]

The issue that just won’t go away: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/08/01/w...ne-khelif.html

I truly don’t know what to think. Rushing to judgement is easy. Nuance is much harder.

[jlwdm]

Originally Posted by smontanaro

...

As others have noted, technique is much more important for an inefficient activity like swimming. Her technique looks pretty flawless to me.

I imagine technique is really important in distance races. She has only won individual medals in freestyle and only once in a race under 400m.

I get so tired of all of the talk about Ledecky breaking the US women's Olympic count. Jenny Thompson, had 12 medals and 7 golds, but she never won an individual gold! She swam during a time when the US women were dominant. Natalie Coughlin had 12 medals but only won 3 individual golds - 5 bronze. No comparison.

Jeff

[fa63]

History of sports is full of athletes who have had big advantages over their competitors due to specific gene mutations, and of no fault of their own. This raises eyebrows in endurance sports when those athletes beat the competition by a significant time margin, but gets even trickier in a strength-focused sport like boxing where there is a safety concern.

I am not really sure what I would do if I were put charge of deciding who gets to compete and who doesn't...

Originally Posted by XXtwindad

The issue that just won’t go away: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/08/01/w...ne-khelif.html

I truly don’t know what to think. Rushing to judgement is easy. Nuance is much harder.

[Fat Cat]

Originally Posted by XXtwindad

The issue that just won’t go away: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/08/01/w...ne-khelif.html

I truly don’t know what to think. Rushing to judgement is easy. Nuance is much harder.

It may be that finally the absurdity of the invasion/corruption of women's sports has simply reached a level of stupidity that will be difficult to ignore. Who cares if three males finish 1-2-3 in a woman's bicycle race, but a male beating up a female for sport ?

And this has absolutely nothing to do with politics, religion, or societal tolerance. It is high school biology.

[fa63]

What makes you say so conclusively that it was a male who beat a female in that match? The governing body, IBA, that declared her ineligible (without providing any specifics) is led by a Russian and was most recently funded by Gazprom, so I don't think they are exactly the beacon of integrity (not that IOC is either).

Is it not possible for one female to be much much stronger than another female? Would we be having the same conversation if it was two men in the same situation? She might have a genetic mutation that gives her an advantage; does that mean we start banning other athletes who are genetically gifted?