OT: Electric Vehicles--anyone driving them or seriously looked at them?

[Polyglot]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

I remember driving to Lost Vegas..either out of St George, or Overton, NV..there's a sign, 'last gas for 260 miles' or some such..Maybe driving to Salt Lake(?)...wonder if there's a 'last chance for trons' signs there now?

What's coming..now in Europe and other places. Any other mega-oil companies seeing the future besides Shell?

Here on Vancouver Island, we have three different chains of gas stations that are already equipping their forecourts with chargers, plus the local power company and every municipality. When we first moved here, we were shocked to see so many chargers and even more by the fact that most were free of charge. We had a moment of hesitation as to whether would install an EVSE in our garage or not, but the local power company subsidized 50% of the cost of installation, so we went ahead (in reality the ease of use of an EVSE at home is well worth the cost of installation.)

[jimcav]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

I remember driving to Lost Vegas..either out of St George, or Overton, NV..there's a sign, 'last gas for 260 miles' or some such..Maybe driving to Salt Lake(?)...wonder if there's a 'last chance for trons' signs there now?

What's coming..now in Europe and other places. Any other mega-oil companies seeing the future besides Shell?

I head up to St George area to MTB--goal is at least once a year. There are lots of gas stations between Barstow and St George (which is just under 300 miles).
Last time I went it was a bit desolate after Baker, CA. But then there are ginormous fuel/food places like Terrible's right at the border. I like to not stop in Vegas, so on different trips I've stopped in Mesquite for gas, and also at an ARCO a bit south of that.

No idea where Overton is though...

[paredown]

An article in the NYTimes (gift so no paywall) about the growth in electric vehicle adoption in the NY metro area. In actual numbers--158,000 vehicles. And this:

Various factors are propelling drivers in New York, New Jersey and Connecticut to convert to electric: more varied models, including trucks and S.U.V.s; more public charging stations; and significant government incentives. And for the first time, the prices of some electric cars are competitive with those of gas-powered vehicles — without the expense of gas.

Yet there is also hesitation. Some drivers have concerns over the vehicles’ range. It can be hard to lay hands on an electric vehicle because carmakers cannot keep up with demand. And while electric vehicles have become cheaper, they still cost about $60,000 on average.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/05/n...smid=url-share

[Ralph]

EV's also bring up a lot of new business opportunities. If it takes 2-3 times longer to get a super charge than a gasoline fill up....then you need something to do while this is occurring. Assuming most people will be charging at home or work, and maybe grocery stores for apt dwellers, for shorter trips, the highway travelers will need some place to charge, go to bathroom, eat a meal, do some simple shopping, etc. Imagine some nicer travel plazas will be popping up on Interstates. In Central Florida we are seeing several new buc-ee's coming to our area. Expect more of this.

[dmitrik4]

Originally Posted by 72gmc

Big opening for someone to develop and sell adapters, like all of those global outlet adapters you can buy at the airport.

I don’t think it’s as simple as plugging in a hair dryer. The charger and the car need to recognize and communicate with each other. A Tesla station isn’t going to charge a Nissan even if you do get them connected. Otherwise this would have been solved 5+ years ago.

[CAAD]

Tesla now has opened up some of their charging network to other brands. This is a big move. Has it's own set of issues but I'm sure they will iron it out.

https://youtu.be/W-oaVLRH-js

[72gmc]

Originally Posted by dmitrik4

I don’t think it’s as simple as plugging in a hair dryer. The charger and the car need to recognize and communicate with each other. A Tesla station isn’t going to charge a Nissan even if you do get them connected. Otherwise this would have been solved 5+ years ago.

Yeah, I’m speaking from a lack of experience and oversimplifying. But I can imagine a day when some sort of “adapter” exists out of necessity, because that feels more likely than all EV makers in alignment. Maybe a third party masters the car-side hardware business across all makers and solves it that way.

[jimcav]

The hardware to make plugs compatible can't be that limiting. I have to think the slower issue may firmware patches type of thing. Other car makers have used 3rd party solutions, so they have had to develop firmware/software to work with those chargers. I can't imagine the hard wiring that gets the electrons from the plug into the car is something difficult to design adaptors, and once that is done, then it is just the firmware patch.

A place I stop to grab food--small strip mall type of place is in the process of adding 10 Tesla charging stations, none of which are right in front of the businesses, but instead out in the 2nd and 3rd row parking.

Tesla had no motivation to making charging possible for competitors, but now they do. Where I live, most EV's seem to be charging overnight at home, and most people use them for local driving--to work and local errands. Range anxiety isn't a factor there, and there are more and more Tesla competitors on the road. It think Tesla is smart to expand their charging network, both in # of new stations and to other makes. Whatever compatibility issues exist, I'm sure they will solve it quickly now that they have a financial motivation to do so.

The fact that this parking lot has put chargers away from the store fronts makes me think it will allow for workers to use it. The more that happens, the more folks who live in apartments with no easy at home charging option can buy EV. The shopping center has several thousands of square feet of roof space that could be solar down the road too, which could fuel more chargers.

I remember riding my bike into Walter Reed and seeing people sleeping or having coffee in cars well over an hour before anyone needed to be at work--they were there to get a good parking spot, of which there were far fewer close or even "walkable" spots than employees. For some period of time, that sort of thing may occur for workers wanting charging slots.

[lzuk]

We have a Chevy Bolt EUV purchased in January to replace our 18 yo Honda Civic. The Bolt is a perfect fit. We live in a rural area and charge at home. We have taken advantage of our local utility EV pilot program to charge off peak hours of 5 thru 8pm. Our electrical rate has gone from .095 per kwh to .05 kwh. Our 40 mile commute cost about 1 gallon of gas in the Civic @3.50 per gallon to 10 kwh @.05 so .50. It's shocking how much more efficient the EV is compared to gas. What really makes me smile is our electric bill has gone down! I get it EV's don't work for everyone but for those that do, they are worth a long look.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by Ralph

EV's also bring up a lot of new business opportunities. If it takes 2-3 times longer to get a super charge than a gasoline fill up....then you need something to do while this is occurring. Assuming most people will be charging at home or work, and maybe grocery stores for apt dwellers, for shorter trips, the highway travelers will need some place to charge, go to bathroom, eat a meal, do some simple shopping, etc. Imagine some nicer travel plazas will be popping up on Interstates. In Central Florida we are seeing several new buc-ee's coming to our area. Expect more of this.

E-Stuckys?

[bikinchris]

Originally Posted by lzuk

We have a Chevy Bolt EUV purchased in January to replace our 18 yo Honda Civic. The Bolt is a perfect fit. We live in a rural area and charge at home. We have taken advantage of our local utility EV pilot program to charge off peak hours of 5 thru 8pm. Our electrical rate has gone from .095 per kwh to .05 kwh. Our 40 mile commute cost about 1 gallon of gas in the Civic @3.50 per gallon to 10 kwh @.05 so .50. It's shocking how much more efficient the EV is compared to gas. What really makes me smile is our electric bill has gone down! I get it EV's don't work for everyone but for those that do, they are worth a long look.

66% of the energy in a gallon of gas is WASTED. After all of that work to explore for oil, drill it out, transport it to a refinery (sometimes by supertanker, which are the worst polluting vehicles ever built), refine it, transport it to a gas station, then to have it wasted. Most of the energy in a gallon of gas is wasted through not being burned completely and just making heat instead of horsepower.

On the other hand less than 33% of electric energy being produced is lost making EV wheels turn. That loss comes from impedance in the wires to the home and in charging. If you use solar charging, almost nothing is lost.

[David Kirk]

Originally Posted by bikinchris

66% of the energy in a gallon of gas is WASTED. After all of that work to explore for oil, drill it out, transport it to a refinery (sometimes by supertanker, which are the worst polluting vehicles ever built), refine it, transport it to a gas station, then to have it wasted. Most of the energy in a gallon of gas is wasted through not being burned completely and just making heat instead of horsepower.

On the other hand less than 33% of electric energy being produced is lost making EV wheels turn. That loss comes from impedance in the wires to the home and in charging. If you use solar charging, almost nothing is lost.

Exactly - this is one of the things that seems to get lost. We accept the fact that 2/3 of the gas we burn produces nothing but waste heat because it's always been that way. It's a baseline if you will.

If ICE cars were just being developed and we were all told that 2/3 of the money we spend, and 2/3 the emissions we breathe, is for nothing the idea would never make it past the prototype phase.

dave

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by bikinchris

66% of the energy in a gallon of gas is WASTED. After all of that work to explore for oil, drill it out, transport it to a refinery (sometimes by supertanker, which are the worst polluting vehicles ever built), refine it, transport it to a gas station, then to have it wasted. Most of the energy in a gallon of gas is wasted through not being burned completely and just making heat instead of horsepower.

On the other hand less than 33% of electric energy being produced is lost making EV wheels turn. That loss comes from impedance in the wires to the home and in charging. If you use solar charging, almost nothing is lost.

https://www.longitude-engineering.co...-every-vessel/

[saab2000]

Originally Posted by David Kirk

Exactly - this is one of the things that seems to get lost. We accept the fact that 2/3 of the gas we burn produces nothing but waste heat because it's always been that way. It's a baseline if you will.

If ICE cars were just being developed and we were all told that 2/3 of the money we spend, and 2/3 the emissions we breathe, is for nothing the idea would never make it past the prototype phase.

dave

Dave, I’m definitely curious about your experiences with public charging. I’ve only once used a non-Tesla charger and that was a Volta free charger at a Walgreens and then only to see if it worked. It did. But it’s a level 2 AC charger, like you’d have at home, in other words, too slow to be of significant use during a short Walgreens stop. I have yet to use an Electrify America or ChargePoint charger.

An update on my experience: home charging is stupid easy. At just over 6000 miles so far this is the clear highlight of EV ownership. It’s also far cheaper but that’s moot because I spent many thousands of dollars to save money on energy! Hopefully it will eventually pay off but that’s probably decade out.

But as mentioned above, there are things I don’t like about the Tesla. It’s a piece of technology that doubles as a car. I strongly dislike the emphasis on form over function with regards to operating various functions of the car, especially climate control and the infotainment. The UI is way less intuitive than Apple CarPlay and often has the driver diverting attention from driving. This kind of thing is a Tesla problem though, not an EV problem.

[zap]

edited

Originally Posted by saab2000

I strongly dislike the emphasis on form over function with regards to operating various functions of the car, especially climate control and the infotainment. The UI is way less intuitive than Apple CarPlay and often has the driver diverting attention from driving. This kind of thing is a Tesla problem though, not an EV problem.

Alas, it is not just Tesla. MB and BMW among others have followed. I have yet to see a YouTube reviewer of automobiles who like this trend.

We test drove some current Mercedes and have to say.....as an exclusive Mercedes household.....we are looking at other manufacturers....manufacturers that continue to use buttons for oft used functions.