I hate chain whips...

[marciero]

Originally Posted by oliver1850

I like the looks of the Stein tool but wonder why they don't offer an 11-12-13 tooth model. Universal cycles has the 11-12 listed for $19 but they are out of stock.

The manufacturer has a ebay store. The current models do 10, 11, and 12 but apparently not 13

[OtayBW]

First world problem, IMO.

[benb]

One thing that sets you up for failure is putting any tool on the smaller cogs.

Whatever tool you use you want it on a cog large enough that every single slot on the tool is engaged on a tooth on the cassette. And the larger the cog is the more leverage you have to hold the cassette steady. More leverage means less physical force applied and less chance when you slip your hand flies into something hard/sharp.

I am surprised even Park's own marketing tools show the whip mounted to a small cog with a bunch of the chain links hanging unused. Pedro's does too, but their tool secures the chain back on to the tool to try and avoid slippage.

When you put your lockring tool in a vise and the grab the wheel you're giving yourself a huge lever arm, that's why that is easy.

[NHAero]

Originally Posted by benb

One thing that sets you up for failure is putting any tool on the smaller cogs.

Whatever tool you use you want it on a cog large enough that every single slot on the tool is engaged on a tooth on the cassette. And the larger the cog is the more leverage you have to hold the cassette steady. More leverage means less physical force applied and less chance when you slip your hand flies into something hard/sharp.

I am surprised even Park's own marketing tools show the whip mounted to a small cog with a bunch of the chain links hanging unused. Pedro's does too, but their tool secures the chain back on to the tool to try and avoid slippage.

When you put your lockring tool in a vise and the grab the wheel you're giving yourself a huge lever arm, that's why that is easy.

Also, if you put the whip on the largest cog, there's no interference with other cogs so even an old whip with wider chain links works.

[ridethecliche]

How do folks bloody up their knuckles doing this?

I use one of the pin type ones with a ratcheting socket wrench. A long lever arm really helps. I pulled the wrench from my automotive tools. It's a big boi.

[benb]

Originally Posted by ridethecliche

I use one of the pin type ones with a ratcheting socket wrench. A long lever arm really helps. I pulled the wrench from my automotive tools. It's a big boi.

I think the issue is if you never do anything but bikes you end up with undersized tools and then there's this tendency to buy small tools even for stuff that should be done with big tools.

And the tool manufacturers seem to love to sell us undersized tools too.

I attached a picture, I need to change a cassette right now. Park tools PW-4 for scale. I was mistaken, my whip and lock ring tool are Pedro’s. 24mm socket goes over the lock ring tool. 16” bar is used for loosening. I use the big torque wrench for the lock ring with the adapter. The only other thing I recall using the big torque wrench for on a bike is some older style BBs and cranks.

Removing a cassette with this setup is significantly easier than removing a pedal. At this point most stuff on bikes is so delicate I use the 5Nm torque key way more than these wrenches.

[DRietz]

Originally Posted by benb

One thing that sets you up for failure is putting any tool on the smaller cogs.

Whatever tool you use you want it on a cog large enough that every single slot on the tool is engaged on a tooth on the cassette. And the larger the cog is the more leverage you have to hold the cassette steady. More leverage means less physical force applied and less chance when you slip your hand flies into something hard/sharp.

I am surprised even Park's own marketing tools show the whip mounted to a small cog with a bunch of the chain links hanging unused. Pedro's does too, but their tool secures the chain back on to the tool to try and avoid slippage.

When you put your lockring tool in a vise and the grab the wheel you're giving yourself a huge lever arm, that's why that is easy.

Agree to disagree, at least partially:

I remove lots of cassettes at work that have been used far past their prime, leading to the chain whip slipping off of worn out cogs, even big ones.

In that scenario, I will actually wrap the tail of chain from the whip all the way around a smaller cog, with the "cradle" of the tool resting on top of the rest of the chain - extremely secure, even for very worn cogs.

But, suffice to say, in over a decade of professional wrenching, I've never used anything for the purpose of removing a cassette other than a chain whip and my knuckles are unscathed.