Campagnolo Ekar with Bar End Shifter????

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by nighthawk

I’m in the middle of a move, but once the bike stuff is accessible I have a spare Ekar shifter I could send you. You can take it apart and experiment with it assuming it comes back functional.

Certainly, Thank you.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by darkmother

13s EKAR mechanical brake might be interesting. 2 chain rings as well, if it works.

Good question. Campagnolo is more keen to modify existing shifter bodies rather than making a whole new one. I'm 'guessing' the LH EKAR disc brake lever is just a stripped 12s, 2by, LH shifter. So, maybe...13s RH rim brake shifter(guts outta EKAR RH shifter into a rim brake body) and any LH, rim brake, 2by shifter....

[witcombusa]

Originally Posted by mechkbfan

Cheers.

I'll be honest, I'm confused and curious about your choice of setup

I thought the main reason someone would go Ekar was you could run 13 speed + 9 tooth cog

So what was the appeal over the SRAM/Shimano mountain bike offerings in this case?

Certainly has a good look to it

Why would anyone want a 9t, 10t or even 11t cogs? They are very inefficient because of the severe chain wrap. And don't get me started with the equally ridiculous 'pie plates' on the low end at 40+ teeth. Put a damn 2x up front and it all goes away.

[carlucci1106]

Originally Posted by mechkbfan

Excellent, thanks for those numbers and link

It's interesting, it seems the 2.5mm is commonly referenced yet that seems to contradict Shimano's website

GRX 1x is 49.7mm

https://bike.shimano.com/en-US/produ...C-RX810-1.html

GRX 2x is 47mm

https://bike.shimano.com/en-US/produ...C-RX810-2.html

If I decided to convert that 2x to a 1x setup

Using the 7.5mm
- Outer ring is 50.75mm
- Inner ring is 43.25mm

Interesting enough, other sites I had seen 5mm C-C
- Outer ring is 49.5mm
- Inner ring is 44.5mm

(If it is 5mm, could 2x crankset just be identical to 1x but with an inner ring?)

I actually did put a 2x GRX crankset onto a 130mm bike, and now I need to go check I used the inner ring...
I could see about confirming the C-C too

------------

I'm only running 130mm, so we do assume that 43.5mm is the optimal chainline for 1x due to Shimano having that for their 2x?
i.e. Pick whatever crankset has chainline closest to that

But key thing is I should consider swapping my 1x GRX crankset -> Ekar for a better chainline

Yeah, I didn't check/verify that the Shimano 1x was the same chainline as 2x. This was the one thing I didn't get a reference for, and mighty careless on my part. But that confirms my suspicion that the GRX of any guise shouldn't be run with 130mm.

I'm so sensitive to these things, that the increase in chainline of the Potenza HO parts bother me for chainline (only 1.2mm outboard), so going to the low gear would be unbearable on a 1x GRX setup for me- my bicycle OCD is alive and well.

As for Chainline on 1x (130mm spacing), there is a little wiggle room, but I think anywhere between 43 and 45.5 is probably just fine.

On a double, the large chainring usually aligns with the 4th or 5th cog position. So if you set your 1x chainring on the inner seat of the GRX 2x crank, you'd be at what... between 43.5 and 44mm? Sounds legit for a 130mm rear end.

The Ekar, at 45.5mm native for 1x, may be slightly outboard of this- but not any more extreme a chain angle in the largest sprocket than any other 1x system, I don't believe.

As a corrolary, on a build I helped plan for a friend, he kept the Force 1 crank with 45.5 Chainline, and just changed the ring to work with AXS flattop chain. The AXS wide Force crank now has a 47mm Chainline, I believe. Both were created with wider rear spacing in mind. Works just dandy, so I believe there is a margin for error with 1x gravel gearing.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by witcombusa

Why would anyone want a 9t, 10t or even 11t cogs? They are very inefficient because of the severe chain wrap. And don't get me started with the equally ridiculous 'pie plates' on the low end at 40+ teeth. Put a damn 2x up front and it all goes away.

Yup, since aesthetics is mentioned here all the time, I think sram has sold 'a bill of goods', convincing the 'market' that a single teeny CR up front and a gigantic cogset in rear is somehow 'better'. There is no doubt you get better cogset spacing, and a better range of gearing with a double...at little or no 'expense' when adding a front derailleur. And THEN, you see these on GRoad bikes for riding around on dirt roads. If that 50t gearing was really needed on that dirt road, a car wouldn't even be able to get up it.

BUT, marketing...another example of the marketeers creating demand..not the other way around.

[Gwerziou]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Somebody send me an EKar RH shifter and I'll see if the guts fit into an otherwise 11s or 12s, rim brake, lever body..

Yay! Great idea. See if the Ekar paddle can be moved over, while you're at it.

[Gwerziou]

Originally Posted by darkmother

13s EKAR mechanical brake might be interesting. 2 chain rings as well, if it works.

The Ekar rear derailleur will definitely not work with 2 chain rings. It's specifically engineered for only 1 chain ring, much like the SRAM derailleurs.

[tomato coupe]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

If that 50t gearing was really needed on that dirt road, a car wouldn't even be able to get up it.

Since you live in the Republic, you'll get this ... but others likely won't. Model T Road in Sunshine Canyon was named that because, back in the day, it was reputed to be the highest you could drive in a Model T, due to the steepness.

*For those of you not from the Republic, you can check Phil Gaimon's video of trying to break the Strava record for the climb.

[witcombusa]

Originally Posted by tomato coupe

Since you live in the Republic, you'll get this ... but others likely won't. Model T Road in Sunshine Canyon was named that because, back in the day, it was reputed to be the highest you could drive in a Model T, due to the steepness.

*For those of you not from the Republic, you can check Phil Gaimon's video of trying to break the Strava record for the climb.

What about Lick Skillet or the Boulder end of Magnolia?

[tomato coupe]

Originally Posted by witcombusa

What about Lick Skillet or the Boulder end of Magnolia?

Lickskillet might have a good story behind it, but I haven't heard it.

[witcombusa]

Originally Posted by tomato coupe

Lickskillet might have a good story behind it, but I haven't heard it.

Not the story, the steepness!

[72gmc]

Originally Posted by d_douglas

The mismatched tires challenge my OCD tendencies...

It’s the skidder on the front and the gripper on the rear that makes me twitch. But I’m not saying he’s wrong—I’m a bemused strategist, not an angry scientist.

[AngryScientist]

It's all matchy matchy now, sleep tight obsessive compulsives.

[tomato coupe]

Originally Posted by witcombusa

Not the story, the steepness!

What about the steepness?

[mechkbfan]

Originally Posted by witcombusa

Why would anyone want a 9t, 10t or even 11t cogs? They are very inefficient because of the severe chain wrap. And don't get me started with the equally ridiculous 'pie plates' on the low end at 40+ teeth. Put a damn 2x up front and it all goes away.

Everyone is different, so I'll share my perspective

I can't notice the difference between 11 and 12t with regards to feel but I've heard a lot of people are. Chain wrap hasn't been an issue for me
Hence I'd be curious to trying a 10t or 9t before deciding.

The massive appeal of the 1x system is it's mental simplicity.
Need easier gear? I don't need to look down or remember what chainring I'm in. I just shift. It's noticeably improves how much I enjoy riding.

So how do I get the range I want for all day riding + 1x?
I've run a 46T chainring + Advent X 11-48T and it's pretty good

Two things I'd like to improve
- Replicating the topend and range of 34/50 + 11-34 setup
- With my long chain stay, I had to use two chains to make it work

How to solve those two issues?

Quite possibly a 44T + 10-44T with Campy's Ekar, but that requires 13 speed.

I'm not turned off the 13 speed if it works (would strongly prefer 10 or 11 though, I'm also looking at SRAM on the side but that's not for this thread) but I certainly don't want to convert to discs. Hence here I am