Campagnolo Ekar with Bar End Shifter????

[carlucci1106]

Angry, always nice riding adventures in VT, looks like you've been a gaggle of times. Sweet.

Old P,

So, so you're saying just the detent piece near/attached to the thumb button, and the assembly right under the axle screw in the front-- might be all that's needed to retrofit?

[mechkbfan]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

Hi there and welcome to the forum.

As Carl pointed out, yes, that's my bike and I've got a pile of miles on it now, works great

Ekar crank and RD, friction bar end shifter to 10sp cassette.

If you have any specific questions, feel free to ask.

Here we are bikepacking across Vermont.

Cheers.

I'll be honest, I'm confused and curious about your choice of setup

I thought the main reason someone would go Ekar was you could run 13 speed + 9 tooth cog

So what was the appeal over the SRAM/Shimano mountain bike offerings in this case?

Certainly has a good look to it

[carlucci1106]

Originally Posted by mechkbfan

I thought the main reason someone would go Ekar was you could run 13 speed + 9 tooth cog

So what was the appeal over the SRAM/Shimano mountain bike offerings in this case?

I don't want to speak for Nick's decisions on this, but for technical reasons/preferences, there are many reasons not to go with a GRX setup.

-You don't like hood ergonomics of Shimano
-GRX has a lower wrap capacity (11-42T) than Ekar RD, so it looks like he can fit minimum what an Ekar is (44t)
- You like Ekar/Campy better
- GRX cranks are optimized for 142mm TA Chainline, not road
-I'll think of more.

[AngryScientist]

Originally Posted by carlucci1106

Angry, always nice riding adventures in VT, looks like you've been a gaggle of times. Sweet.

Thanks. If you ever get the itch to come out this way let me know!

Originally Posted by mechkbfan

Cheers.

I'll be honest, I'm confused and curious about your choice of setup

I thought the main reason someone would go Ekar was you could run 13 speed + 9 tooth cog

So what was the appeal over the SRAM/Shimano mountain bike offerings in this case?

Certainly has a good look to it

Ha, there is certainly no "good" logic to my setup. I just like Campag kit and appreciate friction shifting. I didnt research it much, but I dont know if you could do it with the 13 speed cassette, that requires a different freehub body, that probably isnt available to work with a 130 spaced, QR wheel...

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by carlucci1106

Angry, always nice riding adventures in VT, looks like you've been a gaggle of times. Sweet.

Old P,

So, so you're saying just the detent piece near/attached to the thumb button, and the assembly right under the axle screw in the front-- might be all that's needed to retrofit?

Like I said, I don't really know but for UltraShift 10s to 11s to 12s, all that is needed is the actual shift disc in the rear of the lever..and the toothed bushing in the shifter blade assembly..is all.

[nighthawk]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Somebody send me an EKar RH shifter and I'll see if the guts fit into an otherwise 11s or 12s, rim brake, lever body..

I’m in the middle of a move, but once the bike stuff is accessible I have a spare Ekar shifter I could send you. You can take it apart and experiment with it assuming it comes back functional.

[jtakeda]

Originally Posted by nighthawk

I’m in the middle of a move, but once the bike stuff is accessible I have a spare Ekar shifter I could send you. You can take it apart and experiment with it assuming it comes back functional.

I am eagerly awaiting the verdict of this experiment... If I can get a clutch derailleur and ekar on my gravel bike I will be a happy camper

[carlucci1106]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

I didnt research it much, but I dont know if you could do it with the 13 speed cassette, that requires a different freehub body, that probably isnt available to work with a 130 spaced, QR wheel...

Therein potentially is a problem. Some of you might have remembered that I was working on putting the Ekar cassette on an Industry 9 Classic (Torch centerlock) hub where the bolts were hitting the spokes.

Eventually I retrofitted low profile ti H20 cage bolts to the cassette spider (which worked awesome, btw), and got me the clearance needed to clear the DS spokes. PM me if you need a link for these bolts to hack something like this, anyone.

But before this, I tried a 1mm cassette spacer behind, and the lockring rubbed the dropout on a 142mm TA bike. Logic would say that on a 130mm bike, the lockring may interfere, end of conversation.

[robt57]

Lots of nuts here, I'd sure be one...

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

who'd be crazy enough to try that?

[d_douglas]

The mismatched tires challenge my OCD tendencies...

[robt57]

Originally Posted by d_douglas

The mismatched tires challenge my OCD tendencies...

But you are willing to say it out loud. You are 1/2 way there...


Where ever 'there' might be.

[mechkbfan]

Originally Posted by carlucci1106

I don't want to speak for Nick's decisions on this, but for technical reasons/preferences, there are many reasons not to go with a GRX setup.

-You don't like hood ergonomics of Shimano
-GRX has a lower wrap capacity (11-42T) than Ekar RD, so it looks like he can fit minimum what an Ekar is (44t)
- You like Ekar/Campy better
- GRX cranks are optimized for 142mm TA Chainline, not road
-I'll think of more.

Yeah, it was more specific to Nick's specific setup with the barend shifter + 10sp

- Yes GRX is 42T, but SRAM GX claims 52T, and Shimano's XT is 51T (I've never run these or checked how they run with friction to be clear)
- Thanks for that info on GRX cranks. Was unaware of that, IIRC the 1x is pushed out 2.5mm more than a typical 2x Shimano crankset inner chain ring. I've never thought too much about this though

[darkmother]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

I think the only things 'needed' out of a EKAR shifter is the actual shift disc in the rear and the toothed bushing in the front..I think all else, the thru bolts, springs, etc, will convey.

BUT, haven't taken an EKAR shifter apart, so don't know.

13s EKAR mechanical brake might be interesting. 2 chain rings as well, if it works.

[carlucci1106]

Originally Posted by mechkbfan

- Thanks for that info on GRX cranks. Was unaware of that, IIRC the 1x is pushed out 2.5mm more than a typical 2x Shimano crankset inner chain ring. I've never thought too much about this though

Close. The chainline on a typical road (or any 2x) crankset is the midway point between the centerline of the two rings. On Shimano it's 43.5mm for road, and about 47mm on GRX. Assuming a 7.5mm c-ring spacing, that would put the GRX 1x ring outboard of the 2x big ring by roughly .5mm.

On Campy, new 12 speed 2x Chainline is 44mm and Ekar is 45.5mm.

I'm not sure if Angry has a 130mm or 135mm on the Rock Lobster pictured, but if 135mm-- the chainline would play fine in the back with the 47mm of GRX, or the 45.5 of Ekar.

If it was 130mm, it would play nicer with the Ekar.

MOre nerdy reading on this here: https://www.velonews.com/gear/techni...c-brake-bikes/

[mechkbfan]

Originally Posted by carlucci1106

Close. The chainline on a typical road (or any 2x) crankset is the midway point between the centerline of the two rings. On Shimano it's 43.5mm for road, and about 47mm on GRX. Assuming a 7.5mm c-ring spacing, that would put the GRX 1x ring outboard of the 2x big ring by roughly .5mm.

On Campy, new 12 speed 2x Chainline is 44mm and Ekar is 45.5mm.

I'm not sure if Angry has a 130mm or 135mm on the Rock Lobster pictured, but if 135mm-- the chainline would play fine in the back with the 47mm of GRX, or the 45.5 of Ekar.

If it was 130mm, it would play nicer with the Ekar.

MOre nerdy reading on this here: https://www.velonews.com/gear/techni...c-brake-bikes/

Excellent, thanks for those numbers and link

It's interesting, it seems the 2.5mm is commonly referenced yet that seems to contradict Shimano's website

GRX 1x is 49.7mm

https://bike.shimano.com/en-US/produ...C-RX810-1.html

GRX 2x is 47mm

https://bike.shimano.com/en-US/produ...C-RX810-2.html

If I decided to convert that 2x to a 1x setup

Using the 7.5mm
- Outer ring is 50.75mm
- Inner ring is 43.25mm

Interesting enough, other sites I had seen 5mm C-C
- Outer ring is 49.5mm
- Inner ring is 44.5mm

(If it is 5mm, could 2x crankset just be identical to 1x but with an inner ring?)

I actually did put a 2x GRX crankset onto a 130mm bike, and now I need to go check I used the inner ring...
I could see about confirming the C-C too

------------

I'm only running 130mm, so we do assume that 43.5mm is the optimal chainline for 1x due to Shimano having that for their 2x?
i.e. Pick whatever crankset has chainline closest to that

But key thing is I should consider swapping my 1x GRX crankset -> Ekar for a better chainline