Long term reviews of Chorus 12 speed versus 11?

[DfCas]

You are right i dont have a 48/32. I have a 46/30.

[shinomaster]

I decided to stick with Chorus 11 on my Cx bike. I got the group really cheap and the 12 speed stuff weighs the same as circa 2000 centaur stuff which seems odd to me, plus as stated earlier it's not quite as attractive, I also have a bunch of wheels and 11 speeds cassettes.

[mcteague]

I have Chorus 11 on my back-up bike and Record 12 on the primary one. When I first installed it I didn't think it that much better, if at all, compared to Chorus. Funny thing is, once you ride it for a while and then go back to the older group, it is then you really notice the differences. I now am more aware how much more precise the rear shifts are on the Record 12 setup. Up front started off not as good as the 11s but after lots of miles it seems to have gotten smoother.

The 12s brakes are much better IMO, more power but every so often a bit grabby up front. That too seems to have mostly gone away over time.

However, I do think the RD on the 12s is plain ugly!

Tim

[boywander]

Originally Posted by shinomaster

I decided to stick with Chorus 11 on my Cx bike. I got the group really cheap and the 12 speed stuff weighs the same as circa 2000 centaur stuff which seems odd to me, plus as stated earlier it's not quite as attractive, I also have a bunch of wheels and 11 speeds cassettes.

Interesting point on the weight.

[Dave]

Originally Posted by DfCas

You are right i dont have a 48/32. I have a 46/30.

Me too, but with a SRAM 10-36 cassette.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by mcteague

I have Chorus 11 on my back-up bike and Record 12 on the primary one. When I first installed it I didn't think it that much better, if at all, compared to Chorus. Funny thing is, once you ride it for a while and then go back to the older group, it is then you really notice the differences. I now am more aware how much more precise the rear shifts are on the Record 12 setup. Up front started off not as good as the 11s but after lots of miles it seems to have gotten smoother.

The 12s brakes are much better IMO, more power but every so often a bit grabby up front. That too seems to have mostly gone away over time

I've read many similar comments on older vs. newer component groups, but I wonder how much of the difference in performance is due to different design/construction/materials, and how much of it is due to normal degradation in performance with age for the older component group? If the components were identical, you'd certainly wouldn't expect the components with more usage to perform as well as the components with less usage.

I actually had a similar experience, where a newer component group installed on one bike performed notably better than an older component group installed on another bike. Only in this case, the newer components were actually NOS parts of the same vintage as the older components. Less worn parts just perform better than more worn parts.

[Velocipede]

Actually one of the big selling features when Chorus 12 was coming out was it would be cheaper than the Chorus 11.

[boywander]

Originally Posted by Velocipede

Actually one of the big selling features when Chorus 12 was coming out was it would be cheaper than the Chorus 11.

That’s a great buying for quicker adoption!

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by Velocipede

Actually one of the big selling features when Chorus 12 was coming out was it would be cheaper than the Chorus 11.

Surely there would need to be trade off, between cost and _____?

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by Mark McM

Surely there would need to be trade off, between cost and _____?

Carbon. Lack of carbon on Chorus 12 is the tradeoff.

[Velocipede]

Originally Posted by Mark McM

Surely there would need to be trade off, between cost and _____?

Originally Posted by prototoast

Carbon. Lack of carbon on Chorus 12 is the tradeoff.

Correct. Lack of carbon the front and rear derailleurs and lever blades. But, that just makes it the same as Ultegra and that's what the kit is geared towards, the Ultegra buyer. Yes, the Ultegra has carbon levers, but nothing else. The Chorus, carbon cranks. Trade offs. But with Chorus you also get something that's repairable.

[shinomaster]

Originally Posted by mcteague

I have Chorus 11 on my back-up bike and Record 12 on the primary one. When I first installed it I didn't think it that much better, if at all, compared to Chorus. Funny thing is, once you ride it for a while and then go back to the older group, it is then you really notice the differences. I now am more aware how much more precise the rear shifts are on the Record 12 setup. Up front started off not as good as the 11s but after lots of miles it seems to have gotten smoother.

The 12s brakes are much better IMO, more power but every so often a bit grabby up front. That too seems to have mostly gone away over time.

However, I do think the RD on the 12s is plain ugly!

Tim

Good to hear, I am conflicted about building up a different bike (new Zank) with the SR-11 I have.. I kind wish it was 12, but 12 is so expensive..

[shinomaster]

Originally Posted by prototoast

Carbon. Lack of carbon on Chorus 12 is the tradeoff.

A new chorus 12 RD, and a record 12 RD are almost identical in weight which puzzling to me.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by Velocipede

But with Chorus you also get something that's repairable.

What parts of new Chorus are repairable (that for other groups are not)? It seems like fewer spare parts are available then there used to be. Are 12spd shifter spare parts available (like they used to be and still are for most 10spd shifters)? Are 12spd derailleur spare parts available?

It used to be that one of the advantages of Campagnolo shifters over Shimano shifters was that Campagnolo shifters were repairable - or at least they used to be 8/9/10spd. That stopped with 11spd, due to lack of spare parts.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by shinomaster

A new chorus 12 RD, and a record 12 RD are almost identical in weight which puzzling to me.

I don't know what their brand strategy is, but Chorus seems to be a great value and Record... less so.