The New Yorker article on Grant Petersen and Rivendell

[prototoast]

I showed the article to my wife, and I also showed her Rivendell's bikes on their website. She said she thought he was trying too hard to be different. She also said the Roadeo model looked the best of all their bikes, but the cable routing was ugly and made the bike look outdated.

[NHAero]

Originally Posted by prototoast

I showed the article to my wife, and I also showed her Rivendell's bikes on their website. She said she thought he was trying too hard to be different. She also said the Roadeo model looked the best of all their bikes, but the cable routing was ugly and made the bike look outdated.

Isn't the cable routing pretty normal for bikes before the aero era we're in? Or is it the bikes with the barcon housing emerging from the drops that is problematic? I use this routing on my Bob Jackson because there is less cable friction, but maybe it doesn't bother me because the handlebar bag covers the housing, at least from the cockpit position. Or maybe it's just that I'm an engineer with no aesthetic chops whatsoever!

[EB]

The current issue finally came in the mail and I read the article. It's a good story, within the New Yorker tradition of profiling eccentrics, though I do think she took the comments about the Bridgestone MB-1 a wee bit too much at face value. I wonder how the fact checking went on those quotes.

The only thing Grant needs to watch out for is that the New Yorker has a real knack for profiling people at the maximum of their influence and prestige - after the New Yorker profile, always the inevitable decline.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by NHAero

Isn't the cable routing pretty normal for bikes before the aero era we're in? Or is it the bikes with the barcon housing emerging from the drops that is problematic? I use this routing on my Bob Jackson because there is less cable friction, but maybe it doesn't bother me because the handlebar bag covers the housing, at least from the cockpit position. Or maybe it's just that I'm an engineer with no aesthetic chops whatsoever!

I think the cable routing with the bar-end shifters was what jumped out to her, though she probably wouldn't have been able to specify what it was she was seeing other than excessively protruding cables.

[Mark Davison]

Too my eyes the more serious aesthetic problem with these bikes is the very tall Technomic stems used to get the drop from the saddle to the bars to zero inches or even negative 1 inch. I think this is a generic problem with tall frames and horizontal top tubes. There are work arounds that, in my opinion, create better looking frames: gently sloping top tubes, perhaps without lugs, more head tube extension, a little less standover clearance. Other than that, I think the Roadeo is a particularly beautiful bicycle.

The visual weight of the cables for barcons can be offset by using lighter colored housing.

You can also, of course, run the cables under the handlebar tape. Just be aware that in larger frames, you will need an extra long shift cable for the rear derailleur, and quite possibly a rear shift cable for the front dearilleur.

[marciero]

Originally Posted by Mark Davison

Too my eyes the more serious aesthetic problem with these bikes is the very tall Technomic stems used to get the drop from the saddle to the bars to zero inches or even negative 1 inch.

Its ridiculous, and not just visually. Its going to flex like crazy. That frame is too small for the rider with that saddle height. You could get away with horizontal top tube with a seat tube and head tube about 4cm longer and longer with that same saddle height. Or, a sloping top tube and possibly a dirt drop type stem (thought the latter will flex just as much but visually better). But no. Its just Grant being contrarian.

[lorenbike]

Originally Posted by Mark Davison

Too my eyes the more serious aesthetic problem with these bikes is the very tall Technomic stems used to get the drop from the saddle to the bars to zero inches or even negative 1 inch. I think this is a generic problem with tall frames and horizontal top tubes. There are work arounds that, in my opinion, create better looking frames: gently sloping top tubes, perhaps without lugs, more head tube extension, a little less standover clearance. Other than that, I think the Roadeo is a particularly beautiful bicycle.

The visual weight of the cables for barcons can be offset by using lighter colored housing.

You can also, of course, run the cables under the handlebar tape. Just be aware that in larger frames, you will need an extra long shift cable for the rear derailleur, and quite possibly a rear shift cable for the front dearilleur.

I think most of their other frames have a sloping top tube and lack lugs? See the Roadini which is far cheaper and has a more modern design. The Roadeo is their custom spec road bike.

[Xrslug]

Originally Posted by marciero

Its ridiculous, and not just visually. Its going to flex like crazy. That frame is too small for the rider with that saddle height. You could get away with horizontal top tube with a seat tube and head tube about 4cm longer and longer with that same saddle height. Or, a sloping top tube and possibly a dirt drop type stem (thought the latter will flex just as much but visually better). But no. Its just Grant being contrarian.

FWIW, the particular Roadeo in the photo above (great color) does look ridiculous (ATMO) but the stem is at max extension because it hasn’t been adjusted for the owner yet. Rivendell leaves the threaded fork builds (Roadeo is available threaded or threadless) like that until the owner picks the bike up (or it’s partly disassembled to ship) to avoid scratching the stem, etc. Arguably just having that be the photo used on the Roadeo page of the website is contrarian .

[holliscx]

GP designed MB-1 review

[ColonelJLloyd]

Originally Posted by marciero

Its going to flex like crazy.

Agree.

Originally Posted by marciero

That frame is too small for the rider with that saddle height.

Disagree. It's French fit and it's fine to prefer that aesthetic.

I'd ride that bike with a threadless fork and stem.

[marciero]

Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd

Disagree. It's French fit and it's fine to prefer that aesthetic.

I'd ride that bike with a threadless fork and stem.

I'm thinking French fit would be like half to two thirds that amount of seatpost showing.

[dana_e]

Modern, featherweight, super-short wheelbase carbon road bikes are too twitchy. When you watch even pros ride them, you can see them tilt too much with every pedal stroke, and yes, they can be tamed, but they respond too much to body English, wind, and rough surfaces. On fast descents, they’re simply unsafe.

Safety

A steel frame and fork is safer on your first ride and maintains its safety much longer than carbon does. Failures are rare, grow to total failure slowly, and are on the surface where you can see them. Failures in carbon bikes often originate between the layers, where they're undetectable until the tube snaps.

And in response to trauma, steel bends and dents. It doesn't snap, as carbon does. Steel is the safest frame material, no question about it.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Originally Posted by marciero

I'm thinking French fit would be like half to two thirds that amount of seatpost showing.

Okay. I'm still not seeing why you think the bike doesn't fit based on the seatpost.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Originally Posted by dana_e

Modern, featherweight, super-short wheelbase carbon road bikes are too twitchy. When you watch even pros ride them, you can see them tilt too much with every pedal stroke, and yes, they can be tamed, but they respond too much to body English, wind, and rough surfaces. On fast descents, they’re simply unsafe.

Safety

A steel frame and fork is safer on your first ride and maintains its safety much longer than carbon does. Failures are rare, grow to total failure slowly, and are on the surface where you can see them. Failures in carbon bikes often originate between the layers, where they're undetectable until the tube snaps.

And in response to trauma, steel bends and dents. It doesn't snap, as carbon does. Steel is the safest frame material, no question about it.

Sup, Grant. Nice of you to chime in.

[MikeD]

Originally Posted by NHAero

Isn't the cable routing pretty normal for bikes before the aero era we're in? Or is it the bikes with the barcon housing emerging from the drops that is problematic? I use this routing on my Bob Jackson because there is less cable friction, but maybe it doesn't bother me because the handlebar bag covers the housing, at least from the cockpit position. Or maybe it's just that I'm an engineer with no aesthetic chops whatsoever!

I run my barcon cables under the bar tape. The cables are longer that way, but the bike shifts great. IMO it is unnecessary with low friction cables and housings these days to route shift cables the old way.

That bike does look rediculous and the frame should be larger. In the old days, frames were fit larger and there was very little seatpost exposed. Sloping top tubes improve stand over height.