Has the vintage steel market crashed?

[Fat Cat]

I'm cheap. I'm also old, fat, and slow. I've ridden steel almost exclusively for about fifty years. My two latest purchases are both post-2000 steel. Both tig welded. One is a 2005 Specialized Allez Comp and the other a 2004 (Haro) Masi. Both are 9spd Ultegra. Both ride as fine as anything that I have had. I couldn't buy a set of hotrod modern wheels for what I have in them.

[GParkes]

Interesting how Daccordi continues to make rim brake, steel, lugged steel, etc bikes. While not classic/vintage steel, I dig what they're doing. Perhaps this market is much more prevalent in Europe, and Italy in particular. The caption "F-thediscbrakecollective" says it all.

https://www.instagram.com/p/C65n7Z4MDFI/?img_index=1

[Old School]

Originally Posted by GParkes

The caption "F-thediscbrakecollective" says it all.

Must be going viral.

Same hashtag on the Huffy 'gram.

[spoonrobot]

That's not a caption or a hashtag, it's the name of an Instagram account that mostly does collaboration posts.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

That's not a caption or a hashtag, it's the name of an Instagram account that mostly does collaboration posts.

.

[fourflys]

Originally Posted by 5oakterrace

I ponder what this says about human nature. Are we "taken" so easily by marketing hype?

1000% YES!

there is a reason why manufacturers, etc spend millions (billions?) on marketing.. marketing often has a strong psychological base to it, people get paid a lot of money to study how, as humans, will react to xxx.. so yes, we are easily "taken" by marketing.. does anyone here doubt a Porsche Cayman is a better sports car than a Mazda Miata? my guess is few would disagree.. will most people EVER get to the limits of a Miata? I highly doubt it, but Porsche has certainly convinced plenty of folks that the Cayman is the car they need to step up to if they are "serious".. there are thousands of other examples of this..

I 100% believe that today's bikes are better bikes than ones from 10, 15, 20+ years ago.. does that mean I can "outride" a bike from 15 yrs ago? nope.. but I might be more comfy on a bike with geo better suited for me as a 50 y/o, "husky" guy.. just my .02

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by fourflys

I 100% believe that today's bikes are better bikes than ones from 10, 15, 20+ years ago.. does that mean I can "outride" a bike from 15 yrs ago? nope.. but I might be more comfy on a bike with geo better suited for me as a 50 y/o, "husky" guy.. just my .02

While the performance benefits for a racer are real, I think this might actually be the more important point for the median rider. Stiffer frames and wheels, wider tires, and better brakes are a huge benefit for the 200+ lb rider relative to the 130lb rider, and a new carbon gravel bike is cheaper than a year on ozempic.

[mhespenheide]

Originally Posted by fourflys

1000% YES!

there is a reason why manufacturers, etc spend millions (billions?) on marketing.. marketing often has a strong psychological base to it, people get paid a lot of money to study how, as humans, will react to xxx.. so yes, we are easily "taken" by marketing.. does anyone here doubt a Porsche Cayman is a better sports car than a Mazda Miata? my guess is few would disagree.. will most people EVER get to the limits of a Miata? I highly doubt it, but Porsche has certainly convinced plenty of folks that the Cayman is the car they need to step up to if they are "serious".. there are thousands of other examples of this..

I 100% believe that today's bikes are better bikes than ones from 10, 15, 20+ years ago.. does that mean I can "outride" a bike from 15 yrs ago? nope.. but I might be more comfy on a bike with geo better suited for me as a 50 y/o, "husky" guy.. just my .02

Strong agreement.

While there are some riders who will genuinely benefit from the advancements in road bikes over the last 10-15 years, there are many more riders to won't really benefit. But the bike industry as a whole has not done a great job getting new riders into the sport, so if they want to continue to sell bikes, they have to convince existing riders that a new bike will be "better" and that their existing bike isn't "good enough".

[GParkes]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

That's not a caption or a hashtag, it's the name of an Instagram account that mostly does collaboration posts.

Correct, but if you see Daccordi's offerings, they still believe in steel, lugged steel, and rim brake. Granted the materials aren't 30 year old technology, but there is still some segment of the population that craves the look and ride feel.

[vespasianus]

Originally Posted by GParkes

Correct, but if you see Daccordi's offerings, they still believe in steel, lugged steel, and rim brake. Granted the materials aren't 30 year old technology, but there is still some segment of the population that craves the look and ride feel.

Daccordi makes great bikes and honestly, modern steel bikes that are really fantastic.

[fourflys]

Originally Posted by vespasianus

Daccordi makes great bikes and honestly, modern steel bikes that are really fantastic.

totally agree that modern steel bikes are fantastic.. and, IMHO, better than steel bikes from 20 yrs ago (as a whole, there are certainly exceptions)..

for me, it's not about the material, but the design.. and, yes, that design can include discs, e-shifting, but doesn't have to in order to make a great bike.

[alexihnen]

I dove into the vintage steel market about four years ago, have a collection of a few dozen and have sold a few dozen. In my experience the high-end excellent condition stuff has been pretty stable. This is probably similar to other collectible markets - cars, motorcycles, coins, stamps, etc. However, I've had to learn that many marquees just aren't in much demand. Anecdotally, a 60s Cinelli, a 50s René Herse, a pristine Paramount, Eisentraut, Della Santa, Columbine, an authentic 7-Eleven team bike etc. still command good money. The same goes for components. Finding a nice Dura Ace 7402 rear derailleur, let alone STI levers isn't cheap. More obscure names such as small American builders have a small following and can sometimes be had for very little (lucky me). A large swath of collectors are certainly aging out - they already have the bike they wanted in the shop window as a teenager - and there may not be a market for a good part of their collections. Vintage bikes from the 80s and before are becoming less for riding and more for collecting, restoring, and a displaying. It's a shift that every category of collectibles and antiques experiences.

[glepore]

Originally Posted by alexihnen

I dove into the vintage steel market about four years ago, have a collection of a few dozen and have sold a few dozen. In my experience the high-end excellent condition stuff has been pretty stable. This is probably similar to other collectible markets - cars, motorcycles, coins, stamps, etc. However, I've had to learn that many marquees just aren't in much demand. Anecdotally, a 60s Cinelli, a 50s René Herse, a pristine Paramount, Eisentraut, Della Santa, Columbine, an authentic 7-Eleven team bike etc. still command good money. The same goes for components. Finding a nice Dura Ace 7402 rear derailleur, let alone STI levers isn't cheap. More obscure names such as small American builders have a small following and can sometimes be had for very little (lucky me). A large swath of collectors are certainly aging out - they already have the bike they wanted in the shop window as a teenager - and there may not be a market for a good part of their collections. Vintage bikes from the 80s and before are becoming less for riding and more for collecting, restoring, and a displaying. It's a shift that every category of collectibles and antiques experiences.

Totally agree with this. The bikes that have "crashed" are the very nice but not "special" bikes. Normal C40s vs Mapei paint c40s. Merckx with normal paint vs 7 11 reps and Motorola Max's. Small builders vs Sachs and Dario. Etc. The upside for riders vs collectors is obvious.
Be careful what you wish for. I have a 85 911, and the jump in value of these cars has actually made it somewhat less enjoyable for me. It was easy to drive a 15-20k car when I wanted to or not feel guilty about not driving it. Now that its a 50k asset, I fret. And the rebuild cost on the motor has gone up 3-4x along with the bubble.

[jimbolina]

Originally Posted by alexihnen

I dove into the vintage steel market about four years ago, have a collection of a few dozen and have sold a few dozen. In my experience the high-end excellent condition stuff has been pretty stable. This is probably similar to other collectible markets - cars, motorcycles, coins, stamps, etc. However, I've had to learn that many marquees just aren't in much demand. Anecdotally, a 60s Cinelli, a 50s René Herse, a pristine Paramount, Eisentraut, Della Santa, Columbine, an authentic 7-Eleven team bike etc. still command good money. The same goes for components. Finding a nice Dura Ace 7402 rear derailleur, let alone STI levers isn't cheap. More obscure names such as small American builders have a small following and can sometimes be had for very little (lucky me). A large swath of collectors are certainly aging out - they already have the bike they wanted in the shop window as a teenager - and there may not be a market for a good part of their collections. Vintage bikes from the 80s and before are becoming less for riding and more for collecting, restoring, and a displaying. It's a shift that every category of collectibles and antiques experiences.

This.

[93KgBike]

Originally Posted by alexihnen

... A large swath of collectors are certainly aging out - they already have the bike they wanted in the shop window as a teenager - and there may not be a market for a good part of their collections. Vintage bikes from the 80s and before are becoming less for riding and more for collecting, restoring, and a displaying. It's a shift that every category of collectibles and antiques experiences.

Nailed it