Shimano vs. SRAM on product recalls

[Andrevich4]

Been looking at buying a couple of new Shimano 11 cassettes and ran across some reviews saying the early models broke. Shimano apparently fixed the problem but hasn't to my knowledge issued a recall.

http://www.bikerumor.com/2014/06/06/...nate-creaking/

Contrasting that with what SRAM did last year when they pulled their hydraulic brake systems and gave generous replacements. Not that I follow the industry too closely but I did notice SRAM is down to one world tour team (not sure if that's because of the losses associated with the recall though some on the forum have suggested it).

Anyone have any insights?

[Mr_Gimby]

I heard about the creaking/cracking issues on the DA cassettes, but I bought a DA group right around the time the complaints were surfacing and mine was the updated design. I think they caught it fairly early in the production run.

[RacerJRP]

The creaking and spider cracks on the gen1 DA9000 cassettes are unrelated to one another. The creaking is from Ti cogs and the original 9000 chain surfaces not playing nice. The new HG900 chains have remedied this issue with increased Sil-tec treatments.

The carbon spider cracks seemed to be isolated to certain riders having multiple issues rather than single instances over many riders for whatever that is worth.

I wouldnt hesitate to buy a 9000 group ( I have a few )

[RedRider]

The cassette that had problems were purchased online. The ones from your local bike shop are fine.

[John H.]

In my experience Shimano will replace any part that is defective.
So far I have warranted 3 sets of 9000 shifters (for 9001), 1 9000 cassette (carrier broke), and one braze on 9000 front derailleur.
They had parts in stock and immediately replaced.

But if you are talking about recall- none of the 9000 stuff has been recalled per se.
They are just quietly replacing the ones that fail.
It depends on the customer service rep that the shop gets on the phone as well. Some think it is there job to act like they have seen zero failures, some admit that they have seen failures or a pattern of failures.
It is up to your shop to be firm and demand a warranty.

[RacerJRP]

Originally Posted by RedRider

The cassette that had problems were purchased online. The ones from your local bike shop are fine.

BOOM!

[unterhausen]

you would have to find a situation that is similarly dangerous between the two companies. I'd be annoyed if my cassette folded, but it's not life-threatening like the brake issue.

[bikinchris]

Originally Posted by Andrevich4

Been looking at buying a couple of new Shimano 11 cassettes and ran across some reviews saying the early models broke. Shimano apparently fixed the problem but hasn't to my knowledge issued a recall.

http://www.bikerumor.com/2014/06/06/...nate-creaking/

Contrasting that with what SRAM did last year when they pulled their hydraulic brake systems and gave generous replacements. Not that I follow the industry too closely but I did notice SRAM is down to one world tour team (not sure if that's because of the losses associated with the recall though some on the forum have suggested it).

Anyone have any insights?

Japanese companies don't recall unless they are sued. American companies for the most part, recall when they feel the defect deserves it.
Honda was recently fined a record amount for not reporting deaths. I worked at foreign car dealerships for many years and saw that pattern in the 80's.

[firerescuefin]

Originally Posted by bikinchris

Japanese companies don't recall unless they are sued. American companies for the most part, recall when they feel the defect deserves it.
Honda was recently fined a record amount for not reporting deaths. I worked at foreign car dealerships for many years and saw that pattern in the 80's.

You're right...domestic auto makers have no history of covering up defects that were killing people

Did you really post that.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by Andrevich4

Been looking at buying a couple of new Shimano 11 cassettes and ran across some reviews saying the early models broke. Shimano apparently fixed the problem but hasn't to my knowledge issued a recall.

http://www.bikerumor.com/2014/06/06/...nate-creaking/

Contrasting that with what SRAM did last year when they pulled their hydraulic brake systems and gave generous replacements. Not that I follow the industry too closely but I did notice SRAM is down to one world tour team (not sure if that's because of the losses associated with the recall though some on the forum have suggested it).

Anyone have any insights?

Subject of a previous thread. 'Some' suggested they got their $ worth by sponsoring many teams, got their foot in the door, now don't 'need' to sponsor. Doubt it. 'Win on Sunday, sell on Monday', still alive and well in bike stuff.
Their OEM sales are shrinking(watch shimano-BIG $), their cost to do biz(warranty world) is high(poor design, materials, poor Asian factory monitoring), plus add 2 major recalls(brakes and wifi red rear ders), so they are financially being careful, ie, want to lose less $.

shimano has had some 'running changes', like the DA cogset carrier, but nothing of the scale as 'hydraulic discs don't work in the cold', type stuff.

But who knows. Their focus seems to be US cross(small market) and US road(see the number of small US teams sponsored), plus MTB in general. Altho I think XTR/XT+ series is far better designed and built than sram anything, IMHO.

Now a 'false start' with their electronic, not ready for prime time..so we'll see.

[BumbleBeeDave]

Originally Posted by John H.

In my experience Shimano will replace any part that is defective . . . But if you are talking about recall- none of the 9000 stuff has been recalled per se. They are just quietly replacing the ones that fail.
It depends on the customer service rep that the shop gets on the phone as well. Some think it is there job to act like they have seen zero failures, some admit that they have seen failures or a pattern of failures.
It is up to your shop to be firm and demand a warranty.

. . . there would be a multi-page flame spewing thread here with more anger than you can shake a frame pump at.

BBD

[soulspinner]

Originally Posted by bikinchris

Japanese companies don't recall unless they are sued. American companies for the most part, recall when they feel the defect deserves it.
Honda was recently fined a record amount for not reporting deaths. I worked at foreign car dealerships for many years and saw that pattern in the 80's.

I worked for Toyota for years and they regularly recalled parts they didn't have to. Not all Japanese companies are the same. GM? Another story. I had a GM car with the interlock problem and it was a 2001.

[Mark McM]

As mentioned, recalls (and stop use notices) are primarily instituted for safety issues. That's why most bicycle recalls we see are for brakes, forks, handlebars, stems, cranks, and other components whose failure could result in a crash. I'm sure there have been other defective parts, like handlebar tape, waterbottle cages, cyclometers, etc. that have never been recalled.

[bikinchris]

Originally Posted by firerescuefin

You're right...domestic auto makers have no history of covering up defects that were killing people

Did you really post that.

Yes, I can only post from what I see. I am not talking about every company. GM has their problems, but they are just a poor company all around IMO. Another poster quoted Toyota not doing that> I worked at a Toyota dealership and saw that they had problems also.

[soulspinner]

Originally Posted by bikinchris

Yes, I can only post from what I see. I am not talking about every company. GM has their problems, but they are just a poor company all around IMO. Another poster quoted Toyota not doing that> I worked at a Toyota dealership and saw that they had problems also.

Every manu has problems. Some are far more forthcoming than others. . Did grad work on GM. They knew of problems resulting in fatalities and did nothing till they had to and so much more....YMMV