Firefly ebike prototype
 

I was cruising reddit and noticed “some guy” building up a new electric commuter. Turns out it’s an owner of Firefly. Bosch 3D printed some mounts and he(I’m assuming?) was building it up.

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https://reddit.com/r/ebikes/comments...muter_project/

It appears that FF has a Rapha party or something last weekend where they were going to show a prototype, so this make sense. If anyone here reads this and can post would be interesting.

I'm in Switzerland riding as we speak
 

ebikes ubikquitus.

Ebikes are the next big thing after gravel.

Interesting to see the news outlet coverage of Eurobike this year. Lots of ebikes.

Makes sense to dip their toes in and see where it goes

I spoke briefly with Tyler at D2R2 and he mentioned that Jamie was working on this. As the kids would say, that bike will have the drip. Love the Skunkworks covering of the bottom bracket. I’ll hold off for the folding version—imagine a 20lb folding titanium Firefly e-bike...

Yup! Finally out of the prototype stage and into production. Instead of focusing on making a specific eModel, we have instead focused on making an eUpgrade to any of our existing models. This one is a commuter.

eBikes are kind of polarizing to the cycling community but they do serve a purpose. They are efficient transportation. In this case, don't think of it as replacing a bike, but like replacing a car. Boston traffic can suck hard in a car. An eBike commuter makes it tolerable. Gotta run errands after work? No problem. Gotta find parking in Cambridge? No problem. All this during rush hour? No problem.

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Riding home yesterday..along 26th street..bike lane..very slight uphill..got dusted off by some guy on an ebike, fatbike, thing..he's not pedaling at all..but going almost the speed limit(25mph), in the bike lane..he stops at stoplight..looks both ways, pedals about 3 times and off he goes..not pedaling..and he ran the red light too..

geez..electric scooters..:bike:

Isn't it nice that at least he wasn't driving a car? He even stopped at the stoplight :-)

Tyler and Jamie...awesome new development. Thank you both for all your great thinking.
We all have pals that we would love for them to be able to join us on our rides.
This is something that would see frequent use in my household for all the reasons mentioned.

:hello:

When do they become scooters?
At a certain speed they should travel on the road.

As i'm sure other members can attest, non-ebikes are mostly a US thing. Ebikes are all over europe.

@Tyler, can you talk about that bosch mid-drive? That doesn't look like other Boschs.

100% agree.. e'assist', sure, why not..but e'drive'? I see motorized scooters in the bike lane all the time too...

The retro ( of our investment) plan (I assume for FF customers) is great. Someday I will probably need it.

A very reasonable question.

Hey Tyler,

Great work as usual. A bunch of Qs...

Was this a customer project? Do I recall a prior Bosch bike from FF? If yes, what's different this time? Have you looked at the Superpedestrian solution (aka "Copenhagen Wheel") - any thoughts there?

Rock on...

I'm on the record as absolutely hating e-bikes, but this argument negates all of that.
We are never going to get the vast majority of lazy, corpulent couch toads out of their cars and onto bikes unless the bike does the riding for them.
I live 13.5 miles of dead flat road from work. I can ride that in 45 minutes including lights w/o breaking much of a sweat, yet friends at work completely freak out that I commute by bike. Even more so when I tell them that I do a 29 mile route with hills instead because the 13.5 is way too short.
For most folks, riding three miles would be a physical hellscape. E-bikes (or an apocalypse) are the only way they will ever choose to ride rather than drive to the neighborhood store.
...and yes, I got passed by an e-bike this morning on my way to work. Wanted to strangle the fat ***ker.
Gonna have to work on that.

Makes gas $7 a gallon and I suspect you'll find some new converts to this cycling thing, e-bike or no.

Anecdotally, I was riding my eBike to work this morning and while stopped at a light an older (elderly) gentleman pulled up next to me on his eBike. We had enough time to chat. We both have the same commute, 10 miles each way by bike which takes us each about 30 minutes by eBike and from experience and about 40 minutes by car. He said that before eBikes he just couldn't physically ride every day, now he is a daily rain-or-shine eCommuter. I think that is super rad on many levels.

Nope..make gas scarce and you 'might' but there will be lotsa other issues going on..Gas has been that range in Europe for a log time and yes, Europe is different(smaller) but people drive in Europe just like they always have.

Sign me up. For the right application, they’re great! I went out for dinner in Seattle with my wife and two friends and it was amazing. No car, no gas, another beer ;)

Yes and yes. You make the case for eBike transportation perfectly.

Another case for the eBike: an acquaintance of mine is largely responsible for maintaining 100+ miles of trail and woodland paths on Martha's Vineyard. He relies heavily on a couple 27.5+ eMTBs to regularly inspect all of the trails and to haul in equipment (chainsaws, etc) to work sites. The eMTB makes this volume of trail management possible and relatively low-impact. Joining a trail inspection a borrowed eMTB is also a lot of fun.

honestly I don't know a ton about them so this could be a dumb comment... but my confusion rests with seeing people blast around on them going downhill or on the flats. seems you'd want to save the battery and, you know, get some exercise in by actually pedaling on the flats/coasting downhill, then use the e-assist for uphills. but I only ever see people going full tilt on them.

I never said it would eliminate driving. But you would see a more distributed mix of transit usage than you do today (a la Europe) if gas were priced more as it is elsewhere than here and people consider making different choices.

It would force us to reconsider all the knock-on decisions we've made as a result of cheap gas over the last few decades, and that would include some folks who we thought we couldn't pry out of their cars suddenly thinking this whole bike thing ain't such a bad idea.

I don't have much to add to the ebike discussion, but that is one kick-ass base for work stand!

The difference is, in Europe, they actually are e-bikes. European regulations limit electric assist to 25 kph (15.5 mph). "E-bikes" sold in the US have electric assist to much higher speeds (20 mph for Class 1&2, 28 mph for class 3), and many of these also have throttle modes (no pedaling required).

Let's face it - if the vehicle can be driven without the rider providing the power, then it is a motor scooter, not a bicycle. I'm not against motor scooters at all - the US would probably be a better place if more people rode motor scooters and less drove automobiles. But motor scooters shouldn't be lumped together with bicycles.

Here in Massachusetts, regulations allow e-bike in on-street bike lanes, but not off-street recreation paths. This seems reasonable to me, but I suspect that there will be little to no enforcement on the many rail trails here in Massachusetts. Earlier this year, there was collision death on the Minuteman Bikeway rail trail in Lexington, MA, largely due to a rider going faster than appropriate for the conditions. As it is now, the number of riders on recreation paths that can and do ride too fast is limited. But if e-bike users start riding the paths, there will be no double be more of these collisions.

that looks great, SVEN has been making some nice hand made electric frames recently. I think these are a great addition to the bicycle family.

Gravel bikes are a blip on radar compared to the e-bike market.

This argument has nothing to do with ebikes. Was the accident you cited even involving an ebike? The same false logic could be applied to cars, but is not. The speed limits are enough legislation, as is for MUPS. The last thing I want is more legislation regarding bicycle sales.

High power cars are 'penalized' in two ways: Both only affect the owner of the car: luxury tax and insurance rates.
Insurance rates determined by several factors, but leave gov legislation out of it.
If we were to apply the same standard to bicycles, road racing bikes would be heavily taxed and most expensive to insure due to speed, likelyhood of crash and accidents as well as high maintenance.

The vast majority of ebikes are 'work' utility bikes.

The only legislation that should be out there is taxpayer funds allocated to segregated bike lanes and making more of them.

Awesome! And one thing is guaranteed, we’re all getting older.

Very nice, but Oy!......

Are there fat slobs riding ebikes - Yes - but better than just sitting

Are there lazy millenials that think it is cool to buzz you on their ebike - Yes and deserve the pump in the wheel treatment

Are there former good cyclists whose bodies are falling apart and these can get them home from their former circuit - Yes
- am I in this crowd - yes - but just slowing down, shortening rides, hoping for that blast of 20something energy in my legs again....

But are we carbon neutral YES!!!!!!!!!

I've met more than a few people like this.

I used to ride from Boston Harbor over to Trader Joes on Beacon and Harvard after work regularly.
Boston on bicycle is so much easier. Even a quick grocery or dinner meetup in Cambridge was much, much faster by bike. Parking alone makes a bike worth it.

The people who made the regulations think it does. Why else would they expressly prohibit e-bikes from recreational bike paths, if not for concerns of speed differentials (on narrow, crowded multi-use paths)?

Do you charge your e-bike with your own solar cells or wind turbine? If not, it is probably not carbon neutral. In the US, 65% of electricity is generated from fossil fuels (and we have a highly inter-linked power network, so odds are that wherever you are in the US, you're getting some of your power from carbon sources). Not even pedal bikes are carbon neutral.

Oh my goodness...
All things being equal, my preference is to see a bicycle, a tricycle, or a unicycle next to me while pedaling on a roadway.
Incremental little steps all help with making everyday bicycle life a bit nicer.

I do wish we had regulations requiring them to make you pedal a little bit.

Most of what I see is flat out eMotorcycles. Looks like a bike but you see a fat guy doing 15-20mph up a hill without pedaling. It's a motorcycle, call it what it is and take the pedals off and put pegs on it. Make them get a license and have plates and registration. A lot of the eBikes cost more than your entry level 250cc motorcycles as well! I'm not knocking them here, gas motorcycles are a big improvement over SUVs and 4000lb sedans with one person riding in them. eMotorcycles are an improvement over gas motorcycles for all the around town trips as well.

The thing with the death on the bike path here whether it had anything to do with an eBike is they're in the progress of deciding on a 15mph speed limit. That's kind of annoying. It's easy to average > 15mph on that path safely during the morning commute in particular. The MUPpets & Pathletes are not out there for morning commute, nor are the dog walkers and families. I would be mad about someone ruining it for everyone if I was still using the path for commuting into Cambridge like I did years ago.

because of ignorance.

Speed is the only factor that should be legislated.
If safety is the real concern, enforce the speed limit.

Should we make road racing bikes and riding in groups illegal as well?

It's a slippery slope of red tape and expense when personal responsibility and enforcement of current laws are being neglected. The answer is not to add more legislation.

Haters gonna hate, but as said, the aging population is going to buy. I've witnessed a number of spouses/SO's riding with their fit "cyclists" and having a great time. Also opens up significantly more territory for unfit and fit together.

Wonder what the completed Firefly shown would cost....