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-   -   Serial Numbers Decoded (https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=99078)

monarchguy 08-27-2018 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oliver1850 (Post 2415993)
I didn't read through it either to be honest but fairly sure about the CR model designation. Colorado Legend/Colorado CRL was the other lugged frame at the time ('93-'94). It's in the list as CRL.

Just guessing that your frame may have an unusual paint job or has been repainted, as CRs normally have the model name on the top tube. Even if painted as a new frame at the factory someone may have specified a decal color that they didn't stock for every model. That typically resulted in frames with either a small Serotta decal in place of the model name, or nothing at all.

Saw that, but the name on the TT says "Colorado Legend CR" -- no "L" to be found. I went thru the 1993 cartalog that was scanned, believe that the paint job on the bike is in there (purple/turquoise/yellow accent), so looks original to me. The serial is definately CR, not CRL. I need to get some pics of it so better minds than mine can judge. Do appreciate all of the feedback.
-- Dan

monarchguy 08-27-2018 07:21 PM

Pics (hopefully)
 
3 Attachment(s)
Apologies in advance -- I am not a photographer.

-- Dan

Stevendavid75 08-31-2018 06:24 AM

Have been doing some online trawling and I know not purely serial number related, but my frame has a Columbus fork, looks to be a carve but not entirely sure.
Fork is color matched to frame also (orange copper) so may be re spray?
Or were frames provided with Columbus forks or did they stick to the f1 forks only?
Ta in advance

dave thompson 08-31-2018 11:25 AM

While Serotta was a production house, it was also a custom shop. They offered a variety of forks as options for their bikes, see the 2000 catalog as an example and I’d bet they would put most anything a customer wanted on their front ends.

oliver1850 08-31-2018 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by monarchguy (Post 2417060)
Saw that, but the name on the TT says "Colorado Legend CR" -- no "L" to be found. I went thru the 1993 cartalog that was scanned, believe that the paint job on the bike is in there (purple/turquoise/yellow accent), so looks original to me. The serial is definately CR, not CRL. I need to get some pics of it so better minds than mine can judge. Do appreciate all of the feedback.
-- Dan

Yes, CRL was the slightly lighter weight frame, otherwise the same as your CR. Your frame is almost certainly original, and only made in 1993. "Legend" was dropped from the name in 1994, so 1993 frames are the easiest of all years to pin down.

monarchguy 09-04-2018 07:12 PM

Great info
 
Thanks for the update on my frame, good to hear. I'm really liking it and was curious about the history.

OT -- like your avatar as well. The farmers working my back 10 acres run a couple of Olivers and they must like them, based on the stckers and tats.

-- Dan

oliver1850 09-05-2018 12:18 AM

Thanks Dan, you are one of maybe three here to get the reference. Let me know where you are (PM?). Always good to make Oliver contacts.

DavidLorenzoni 12-04-2018 03:38 PM

HI. I'm trying to validate the authenticity of a serial number on a Legend Titanium built in either 2012/2013. The serial number is:
LS A 0167

oliver1850 12-13-2018 10:31 AM

Sorry, I don't have any knowledge about serial numbers that recent. Perhaps someone else will chime in.

Hardlyrob 01-24-2019 11:54 AM

Coming over here from the CSI serial number / picture thread.

Ordered in late May or early June 1996, and delivered about 6 weeks later in the middle of July.
CS 55L 747

Stock 55 CSI
Rob

oliver1850 01-31-2019 11:15 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Just discovered an alternate serial number location, this on an early to mid 80s Club Special. It's on the inside of the drive side dropout. I knew that some TriColorados (possibly other frames with Ritchey dropouts) had the serial number on the inside of the dropout, but the Ritchey dropouts have a big area above the axle nut interface that is protected from damage by the axle nuts. It's a pity that I can't read more of this one, as I've wondered for years about its vintage. Not much to go on as it has been repainted.

Anyone with a Club, Nova, etc. from the early 80s with a readable serial number in this location? I'm pretty sure I've seen Clubs and Novas from 1983 on with serial numbers on the BB shell, so I'm guessing that this Club is older.

oliver1850 01-31-2019 11:35 PM

Couple of other random serial numbers:

1983 Nova Series: 83823

1989 Nova Special X: 90190

I would like to know if 823 is the 823rd frame built in 1983 or the 23rd frame built in August.

Same with the 89 frame: 190th frame built in 1989 or 90th frame built in January?

I'd love to find a frame with a serial number such as 91302 to resolve this question.

jseski 02-02-2019 03:54 PM

year help please??
 
serial as follows:

C TI57 2045

It's a 57cm CTI, that certainly seems to be newer than my '97 CSI (by groupset age anyway; a slight contrarian piece is that I've got a paint-matched carbon F1 on the CTI but a fatty F3 on my '97 CSI - but the F3 wasn't even made 'til '06, correct? so, that was added as an upgrade later for the previous owner, I'm sure), anyway, I would sure appreciate a "Serotta-expert" 's opinion on the 2045 part of the s# to help me figure out the yr.

45th built in 2000? 5th built in 2004? I'd think for consistency they'd want to go to 00 for 2000. ?? (then they could do 01,02,...10,11,12, etc not that it makes a difference now, unfortunately!)

Thanks, all! appreciate the advice in advance!
Jeff

dave thompson 02-02-2019 09:54 PM

I don’t think your bike is a CTI, I think it’s a legend Ti with custom geometry. The ‘2045’ is the production number of your bike: the 2045th one made.

Dating a bike by its groupset is always a crapshoot, unless you’re certain it was purchased with the installed components.

oliver1850 02-03-2019 03:24 PM

I agree with DT: your frame is a custom "Legend", though in some years Serotta simply called them "Ti". Best way to figure out the year is to look at frame details and paint. If you are lucky you might locate one with a close serial number and an owner who is sure when his was built. Searching classifieds and gallery posts might turn something up.

jseski 02-04-2019 10:36 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Thanks for your responses, Dave & Oliver...
The ride in question here has "TI" on the top tube & has (as close as I can measure) seemingly identical geometry to my CSI. Which would seem to me to make sense as the "titanium" version of the superlight steel framed ride, right?
So am I thinking this correctly...was the "Legend" essentially the Colorado geometry??
I know trying to use the groupo as an indicator is not too reliable:bike:, just trying to use it as one of the clues, since the serial # doesn't seem to be too helpful! It (again,) seems like original equipment - 10spd DuraAce... soooooo...possibly '03???
thanks again!!
Jeff

oliver1850 02-05-2019 04:00 PM

Yes, geometry was exactly the same for CSI and Legend in the 1998-2000 range. I think that's about the right vintage for your frame. If you look at the 1998 catalog, the Ti is painted just like yours, only in red. Yours looks to be Big Boy Blue, very common on Serottas in mid to late 90s.

ChainNoise 03-18-2019 05:02 PM

Can anyone help me with this one? Just making sure it's a Classique but can't find much about it. And the serial number and orientation matches nothing here...

55 LG A0192 is the serial.

Link to pics:
https://flic.kr/s/aHsmwGMoMf

sipmeister 04-23-2019 10:04 PM

My latest, and final, Serotta has only numbers: 66024.

It's my 3rd one (after a Nova and CSi) and my favorite of all. :banana:

Columbus tubing. Flat crown fork. Fast back seat stays.

Says Serotta on the chainstays...

And Murray on the seat and down tubes. :cool:

I'll post a pic one day. :)

oliver1850 05-07-2019 05:17 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by sipmeister (Post 2531564)
My latest, and final, Serotta has only numbers: 66024.

It's my 3rd one (after a Nova and CSi) and my favorite of all. :banana:

Columbus tubing. Flat crown fork. Fast back seat stays.

Says Serotta on the chainstays...

And Murray on the seat and down tubes. :cool:

I'll post a pic one day. :)

I'd say that's a 1986 model. I'm kind of surprised by the fastback stays. It appears that the one pictured in the catalog has side track stays.

oliver1850 05-07-2019 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChainNoise (Post 2515564)
Can anyone help me with this one? Just making sure it's a Classique but can't find much about it. And the serial number and orientation matches nothing here...

55 LG A0192 is the serial.

Link to pics:
https://flic.kr/s/aHsmwGMoMf

Are the logos bead blasted into the tubing? Certainly must be a Classique.

ChainNoise 05-08-2019 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oliver1850 (Post 2537833)
Are the logos bead blasted into the tubing? Certainly must be a Classique.

Yes! Every single logo is (head tube, inside NDS seat stay, top tube, down tube, etc). Does this indicate it's the newer 'relaunch' of the Classique? Were the newer ones offered with semi-custom geometry? I ask because the head tube is a different size than indicated, and a few other measurements did not match the 'race' or 'percormance' geometries given...

I've been riding it a few hundred miles now and it is STIFF as stiff can be. I absolutely love it, wouldn't be as happy with it if it was my only bike though.

oliver1850 05-09-2019 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChainNoise (Post 2537972)
Yes! Every single logo is (head tube, inside NDS seat stay, top tube, down tube, etc). Does this indicate it's the newer 'relaunch' of the Classique? Were the newer ones offered with semi-custom geometry? I ask because the head tube is a different size than indicated, and a few other measurements did not match the 'race' or 'percormance' geometries given...

I've been riding it a few hundred miles now and it is STIFF as stiff can be. I absolutely love it, wouldn't be as happy with it if it was my only bike though.

That would be my guess. I would think that Serotta would have modified the geometry for anyone who was willing to pay for it. You might ask Brian Smith about it.

oliver1850 05-09-2019 01:46 PM

Here's a Wayback Machine page from 2011. Doesn't show the bead blasted logos. Maybe looking at other Wayback pages will turn up more info.

http://web.archive.org/web/201107030...d/ClassiqueTI/

ChainNoise 05-12-2019 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oliver1850 (Post 2538684)
Here's a Wayback Machine page from 2011. Doesn't show the bead blasted logos. Maybe looking at other Wayback pages will turn up more info.

http://web.archive.org/web/201107030...d/ClassiqueTI/

Great find. So on the decals, you can select "ti charcoal" or "charcoal ti." I wonder if one of them is bead blasted, since it is I guess a charcoal color. And it looks like they can be made in full custom geometry. Thank you for the assistance and link!!!

oliver1850 05-12-2019 12:10 PM

I didn't spend a lot of time there, but couldn't seem to get the finish options to work. You might ask in general discussion when Serotta started bead blasting logos. I didn't see any examples in the last print catalog I have (2008).

Brian Smith 05-13-2019 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChainNoise (Post 2515564)
Can anyone help me with this one? Just making sure it's a Classique but can't find much about it. And the serial number and orientation matches nothing here...

55 LG A0192 is the serial.

Link to pics:
https://flic.kr/s/aHsmwGMoMf

Yes, that is a titanium Classique. It appears to be of the final iteration produced with that model name. The American Craftsmen affectation gives it away, as the blasted logos were a mainstay of the late 2000s Classiques and not unique to the year. The A in the serial number serves to identify it as a post-2011 model. I'm not sure what you're referring to as the orientation, but the bottom bracket location of the serial number was a Serotta mainstay for...decades. There was used a real Rube Goldberg-esque contraption, inherited from another enterprise, employed to impression the BB "shells" with the identification numbers in that location.

oliver1850 05-14-2019 11:07 AM

Thanks Brian. I think the poster was referring to the number itself, which doesn't conform to either the traditional system (ST 56 xxxx) or the one introduced in (I think) 2010 (CL X00959).

The bead blasted logos had to start some time. Do you have an idea when they were first done?

oliver1850 05-29-2019 04:44 PM

La Corsa was designated LC. I saw it on one with a full Titanium main triangle, but I'm guessing that it may have also been used for the carbon tubed version.

oliver1850 05-30-2019 05:10 PM

1996 Colorado 10th anniversary CSIs were stamped LE for Limited Edition (of 100 I think). They had special CSI decals overlaid with "Limited Edition", and a fairly large 1986/1996 commemorative decal on each side of the TT near the seat tube. Ben signed the chainstay of the one I saw.

konaman 06-01-2019 06:06 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Hi, I am trying to track down information and history about a Serotta I just bought. It is a MTB. The Serial number is CSP 16 083. I tried searching for it and the closest I found are road bikes and even track. It does not like a Singolo?

The paint is not original.

Any help much welcome.

thanks.

rickbb 06-02-2019 02:57 PM

Hi, Previous active member of years ago. I have a relatively modern repainted (JB) titanium Serotta of unknown provenance that, after years of storage, I'm planning to sell. I'd like to be as accurate as possible in describing it. Its serial # is TI57 LOC 348.
Can anyone help with model designation? Thanks so much!

Edit: It appears to be a 1993 Colorado Legend TI. Any validation would be welcomed. Thanks!

oliver1850 06-02-2019 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickbb (Post 2548087)
Hi, Previous active member of years ago. I have a relatively modern repainted (JB) titanium Serotta of unknown provenance that, after years of storage, I'm planning to sell. I'd like to be as accurate as possible in describing it. Its serial # is TI57 LOC 348.
Can anyone help with model designation? Thanks so much!

Edit: It appears to be a 1993 Colorado Legend TI. Any validation would be welcomed. Thanks!

Ti indicates Legend, 57L is the size. I'm guessing it's actually 00348, so the 348th Legend produced. Could be 1993 or 1994, I'm not sure how many were made the first year. Top tube decal for a 1993 should read "Colorado Legend Ti" but repaints often got later "Legend Ti" or "Ti" decals. See the 1993 catalog for geometry.

oliver1850 06-02-2019 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by konaman (Post 2547642)
Hi, I am trying to track down information and history about a Serotta I just bought. It is a MTB. The Serial number is CSP 16 083. I tried searching for it and the closest I found are road bikes and even track. It does not like a Singolo?

The paint is not original.

Any help much welcome.

thanks.

Just a guess but it looks a lot like the TiMax shown in the 2006 catalog. Brian Smith might be able to tell you something about it. Perhaps searching the site for TiMax would turn up another serial number. Only problem is that they made the model for a long time and you're going to have to look through a lot of posts.

oliver1850 06-03-2019 04:14 PM

Nove = NV

konaman 06-03-2019 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oliver1850 (Post 2548148)
Just a guess but it looks a lot like the TiMax shown in the 2006 catalog. Brian Smith might be able to tell you something about it. Perhaps searching the site for TiMax would turn up another serial number. Only problem is that they made the model for a long time and you're going to have to look through a lot of posts.



Thanks ! It certainly looks like it.

ChainNoise 06-05-2019 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oliver1850 (Post 2540539)
Thanks Brian. I think the poster was referring to the number itself, which doesn't conform to either the traditional system (ST 56 xxxx) or the one introduced in (I think) 2010 (CL X00959).

The bead blasted logos had to start some time. Do you have an idea when they were first done?

That is absolutely correct...the size and model stamps are opposite of what ive seen so far. Huge thank k you for all of the info guys!!!

oliver1850 06-06-2019 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChainNoise (Post 2549334)
That is absolutely correct...the size and model stamps are opposite of what ive seen so far. Huge thank k you for all of the info guys!!!

I wish that I had time to run down more details. Best resource is probably the classifieds. Somewhere in the listings there is probably a similar frame, sometimes posted with model year and serial number.

roguedog 06-29-2019 10:49 AM

Hello all,

Wondering what year this might be from? CTI50.5 3703. Bike has a Reynolds fork. Custom Legend Ti. What year is from and wondering if its 1in or 1.125?

Thanks!

oliver1850 06-30-2019 03:55 PM

I'm guessing 2001 based on a couple of threads. If it has holes in the 3D dropouts that are roughly 2 mm in diameter, it's a 2000. The 3D XL dropouts were introduced in 2001 and the holes were much bigger - 10 mm or so. I believe that was also the first year for 1 1/8" head tubes, but they were optional. I have a 2002 Concours that has a 1" head tube. The 2003 catalog states 1 1/8" head tubes only, but the Legend picture shows an F1 fork which was only made with a 1" steerer. See the 2001 and 2002 catalogs and this thread for a 2000 Legend (#2225) for sale:

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showt...ht=2000+Legend

See also this one for a discussion about #3136:

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=193502

Since it appears both of those frames are from 2000, Serotta must have been building around 1,000 Legends a year at that point. Seems likely that the one in question is a 2001.


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