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-   -   2021 Andy Gilmour Medium Reach Brake (https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=265120)

Bici-Sonora 02-16-2021 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by v531xc (Post 2882824)
Hmm, I couldn't find an article by Lennard that outlined that specific issue

I'll ask Andy--I think he mentioned that it was in one of Zinn's books. I read the articles you linked to which were also interesting. I did get hung up on his crank length calculations--21.5% of your inseam--so for me 195mm cranks! I rode 180s for awhile, and while I could climb out of the saddle like a beast with those, my knees had other things to say about long cranks.

Also, with 195mm cranks, our 80mm bb drop dreams are out the window!

Clean39T 02-16-2021 05:05 PM

I don't know how I didn't see that Ellis interview/blog until now.. so much good info in there and fodder for future conversations with Dave about build and design choices - and for this thread.

The 6-deg slope on this one surely doesn't look bad at all:

https://overthebarsinmilwaukee.files...0175.jpg?w=768

So I'll back off my position and say - do whatever makes sense!

v531xc 02-16-2021 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bici-Sonora (Post 2882842)
I'll ask Andy--I think he mentioned that it was in one of Zinn's books. I read the articles you linked to which were also interesting. I did get hung up on his crank length calculations--21.5% of your inseam--so for me 195mm cranks! I rode 180s for awhile, and while I could climb out of the saddle like a beast with those, my knees had other things to say about long cranks.

Also, with 195mm cranks, our 80mm bb drop dreams are out the window!


Exactly. I think it’s more than just crank length or bb drop, but I used to measure pedal drop for customers to get a good fit. 175 works, IMO.

The again I would guess either of us isn’t tall enough for Lennard’s tall-person advice to apply.

Bici-Sonora 02-16-2021 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 8aaron8 (Post 2882544)
This is a fun thread, nice to read the thought process of prospective custom frame owners. I just want to add that with the TRP 957 mid reach brakes you can indeed get a 38mm tire under it if the slots are set up at their max height. Here's a photo of the brakes with Steilacooms underneath.https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...dd0ce208_b.jpg

Aaron, I think I remember from your photos that this bike has a steel fork. Do you have a specific crown you like to use for max clearance or do you modify an off the shelf crown?

mhespenheide 02-16-2021 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bici-Sonora (Post 2882719)

If I were going fully custom, I think this is the route that I would go. 73 degree angles, top tube slope to match the slope of the stem. 75mm bottom bracket drop; I like 177.5mm cranks. Personally, I'm interested in a longer seatpost to try to maximize its "suspension" effects -- so using one of Cannondale's 25.4mm carbon posts, or a Ritchey FlexLogic, or something similar.

Also, if you're going for a breakaway frame, a slope in a XL frame can help a lot in terms of fitting it into the box. So a functional argument against the aesthetics of a level top tube.

mhespenheide 02-16-2021 06:24 PM

And as long as we're talking about/ogling bikes in this genre and size, I'd feel remiss in not bringing back up Dan's former Boulder Road Sport:

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...ace092a95b.jpg

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=218075

hollowgram5 02-16-2021 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mhespenheide (Post 2882895)
And as long as we're talking about/ogling bikes in this genre and size, I'd feel remiss in not bringing back up Dan's former Boulder Road Sport:



https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...ace092a95b.jpg



https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=218075

Which was once Scott's and Ryan's as well if my memory is correct?

Bici-Sonora 02-16-2021 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mhespenheide (Post 2882891)
Personally, I'm interested in a longer seatpost to try to maximize its "suspension" effects -- so using one of Cannondale's 25.4mm carbon posts, or a Ritchey FlexLogic, or something similar.

Also, if you're going for a breakaway frame, a slope in a XL frame can help a lot in terms of fitting it into the box. So a functional argument against the aesthetics of a level top tube.


Both of these are excellent points. I have to say that on my Ritchey Ascent, with like a ~13 degree TT slope—I can really feel the seat post comply and I like it.

Also, this is absolutely going to have to fit into a suitcase and so there’s a good argument to be made for the sloping top tube.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bici-Sonora 02-16-2021 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hollowgram5 (Post 2882932)
Which was once Scott's and Ryan's as well if my memory is correct?


Yes, I ordered it and all three of us owned it. Of the three of us, I believe dan was the only one that rode it. I think that the consensus among us is that the standard diameter tubes were at the limit of their spec in this big of a frame bike, which was probably a little bit on the small side for all of us. Maybe dan will weigh in, but he has remarked that it was plenty flexible.

On my custom—I guess I’m unwilling to roll the dice on the super skinny tubes in a frame of this size. Regular OS or double OS seems a safer bet.

I could do a RH-style “mule” tube set with an OS down tube, but standard skinny tubes elsewhere.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

bicycletricycle 02-16-2021 07:57 PM

Another thought about brakes. The direct mount racer mediums on my first Chapman are the best rim brakes I have ever used. They do make a bike like this more complicated to build ( clean cable routing, nice low profile pivots, etc), but they work considerably better than medium reach calipers IMHO.

Fenderless bikes with mafac style brakes are rare these days but used to be very common.

mhespenheide 02-16-2021 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bicycletricycle (Post 2882970)
Another thought about brakes. The direct mount racer mediums on my first Chapman are the best rim brakes I have ever used. They do make a bike like this more complicated to build ( clean cable routing, nice low profile pivots, etc), but they work considerably better than medium reach calipers IMHO.

Fenderless bikes with mafac style brakes are rare these days but used to be very common.

If I can find the right donor Lemond Poprad frame, I totally want to commission a custom steel fork for it, dimple the chainstays, and add direct mount racer mediums. Or save up enough to do a custom of the same idea.

But for a travel frame, it might be easier to go with sidepull brakes that you can just unscrew and detach from the rear portion of the frame?

bicycletricycle 02-16-2021 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mhespenheide (Post 2883022)
If I can find the right donor Lemond Poprad frame, I totally want to commission a custom steel fork for it, dimple the chainstays, and add direct mount racer mediums. Or save up enough to do a custom of the same idea.

But for a travel frame, it might be easier to go with sidepull brakes that you can just unscrew and detach from the rear portion of the frame?

if all the stops have slots and the straddle cable carrier doesn’t trap the straddle cable (like a moon unit) then you can just undue the cable to the rear brake with no tools.

mhespenheide 02-17-2021 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bici-Sonora (Post 2882944)
Yes, I ordered it and all three of us owned it. Of the three of us, I believe dan was the only one that rode it. I think that the consensus among us is that the standard diameter tubes were at the limit of their spec in this big of a frame bike, which was probably a little bit on the small side for all of us. Maybe dan will weigh in, but he has remarked that it was plenty flexible.

On my custom—I guess I’m unwilling to roll the dice on the super skinny tubes in a frame of this size. Regular OS or double OS seems a safer bet.

I could do a RH-style “mule” tube set with an OS down tube, but standard skinny tubes elsewhere.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I assume that was also a factor of the thickness of the walls of the tubes? I know you and Dan have both ridden steel frames with standard-diameter tubes.

AngryScientist 02-17-2021 08:30 AM

This is a cool thread and i'm excited to see this come together.

the discussion is largely lost on my since the size in question is at the opposite end of the curve from the one's i ride, and the performance of different tubesets is definitely different from size 50 to size 60, but enjoying the ride none the less, just my style of bicycle.


having owned both, i can tell you that if i were commissioning another travel bike and was interested in the ritchey breakaway system, i would absolutely go with an S&S coupler on the downtube vs the Ritchey flanged coupler. i always found that to be a little under-designed and never fully trusted the clamp down there, though in reality it never gave me any issues, but they do rust up pretty quickly. just a thought.

bicycletricycle 02-17-2021 09:22 AM

6 degree
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...d93d81d5_c.jpgbici sonora V.1 assembly quarter view by bicycletricycle666, on Flickr
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...9b338d93_c.jpgbici sonora V.1 assembly by bicycletricycle666, on Flickr


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