View Full Version : I have a fantastic opportunity...
fourflys
10-04-2011, 03:37 PM
so I've mentioned before that we have a former Tour rider that works in the Performance I work part time at... well, I was talking to him the other day about this and that and asked if he wouldn't mind going for a couple rides with me to give me some tips... he said sure, no problem... :banana:
so next week sometime, I'm going to get the opportunity to ride with and get coaching from a former professional cyclist... :D and one on one at that!
can't wait!
Pete Serotta
10-04-2011, 03:52 PM
Have a wonderful time.
and let us know what you learn.....
PETE
BillG
10-04-2011, 04:21 PM
Totally cool. And remember "rode in Tour" is quite a few steps higher than "Pro cyclist". Very few pro cyclists ride in the Tour.
Just go have some fun.
Sounds like a blast.
pass some knowledge back to us
onekgguy
10-04-2011, 09:26 PM
Great for you. Let me ask what we're all wondering...who is it?
Kevin g
fourflys
10-04-2011, 11:00 PM
His name is Bernard Croyet, here is some info on him...
http://www.cyclingarchives.com/coureurfiche.php?coureurid=19550
interesting sidenote... I was looking at the Bic team he raced on at the '74 Tour... he raced with Johny Schleck, the Schleck brother's father...
rice rocket
10-04-2011, 11:46 PM
Interesting. Do you know why he fled France?
fourflys
10-04-2011, 11:54 PM
Interesting. Do you know why he fled France?
not real sure... I know he's been here for a while... his son is around 15 and rides with the San Diego Bike Club and I guess on the "A" ride he has a habit of making the "elites" hurt... he is definitely a wealth of knowledge...
BillG
10-05-2011, 05:50 AM
Dude, that's a serious cyclist. Won a stage of the Dauphiné and rode in the peloton with Merckx. You are in for a treat!
LesMiner
10-05-2011, 07:00 AM
not real sure... I know he's been here for a while... his son is around 15 and rides with the San Diego Bike Club and I guess on the "A" ride he has a habit of making the "elites" hurt... he is definitely a wealth of knowledge...
The guy must be in his 60's if he rode in the '74 Tour.
The guy must be in his 60's if he rode in the '74 Tour.
:confused: This always confuses/make me laugh!
Because he is 60, does that mean he forgot how to ride? Forgot the tips that helped him along the way?
Not to me it doesn't.
Anyway, Go and have a great time. Then report back!
Chance
10-05-2011, 08:17 AM
.
fourflys
10-05-2011, 09:56 AM
The guy must be in his 60's if he rode in the '74 Tour.
I learned the hard way when I first started riding to never discount someone because of age... I had my azz handed to me on one of the local hills around here because the I thought the guy was "old" (around 60 I think)... and this wasn't even a Tour rider... and yes I believe he's 63...
coylifut
10-05-2011, 03:39 PM
This guy is likely the most valuable resource ever. He was fast before the advent of the cycling computer.
I can hear his advice now.
"you need to be able to turn the 53x15 at 100 rpms for an hour un interupted. Once you can do that, give me a call and I'll teach you how to climb."
Ti Designs
10-05-2011, 03:59 PM
This guy is likely the most valuable resource ever. He was fast before the advent of the cycling computer.
Most of my "it's the rider, not the bike" attitude comes from being coached by John Allis (who is the most valuable cycling resource ever). He had a computer on his bike, but he never put the battery in it. He had STI shifters 'cause Shimano gave him a set - I rode with him for 20 years, saw him shift maybe a dozen times. Being a tour rider doesn't make one a great resource, being able to relate your knowledge to someone who doesn't have the same natural talent of ability does...
Tim Porter
10-05-2011, 05:10 PM
Ed, you often mention John Allis. Here's a pic of me racing next to him over 37 years ago. He won that race, the National Road championships. Tom Officer, who shows up across the hall these days, was second. It was the men against the boys when Allis, Howard, et al, showed up on the Raleigh/CRC team. I was on the Wolverine Sport Club team out of Detroit, in my second year of racing. John Howard attacked at one point and exploded the peloton. I was just . . . gone. For the gearheads, that was my California Masi, one of the first handful built.
http://gallery.me.com/timporter1/100283/Untitled-1_2/web.jpg?ver=13178521310001
To OP, sorry for the drift. Enjoy that ride and please report back.
Tim
Ti Designs
10-05-2011, 06:45 PM
Ed, you often mention John Allis. Here's a pic of me racing next to him over 37 years ago. He won that race, the National Road championships. Tom Officer, who shows up across the hall these days, was second.
About a year ago I did the doc ride in Hannover NH and Tommy Officer's brother showed up. I was wearing a Harvard jersey where John was the head coach for 30 years. As soon as he saw me he said "we don't trust John Allis" because of what happened in that race. John's position hasn't changed much over the years. We went to Serotta Fit School together, what the other students learned by doing a fitting on John was if someone has been in the same position for 40 years, don't try to change it...
tannhauser
10-05-2011, 06:53 PM
About a year ago I did the doc ride in Hannover NH and Tommy Officer's brother showed up. I was wearing a Harvard jersey where John was the head coach for 30 years. As soon as he saw me he said "we don't trust John Allis" because of what happened in that race. John's position hasn't changed much over the years. We went to Serotta Fit School together, what the other students learned by doing a fitting on John was if someone has been in the same position for 40 years, don't try to change it...
Would you care to give us the scuttlebutt?
coylifut
10-06-2011, 05:19 PM
Most of my "it's the rider, not the bike" attitude comes from being coached by John Allis (who is the most valuable cycling resource ever). He had a computer on his bike, but he never put the battery in it. He had STI shifters 'cause Shimano gave him a set - I rode with him for 20 years, saw him shift maybe a dozen times. Being a tour rider doesn't make one a great resource, being able to relate your knowledge to someone who doesn't have the same natural talent of ability does...
The guy comes up through the French club system in the 60s, rides 7 years pro during the golden era of French cycling with a couple tours thrown in and he's still engaged enough to work part-time in a bike shop.
Yup. He's a resource.
johnnymossville
10-06-2011, 05:40 PM
What a great opportunity. Have fun riding with the guy.
To a point Ti is correct.
It really doesn't matter, the OP and the rider in question know each other and are going for a ride. If the OP learns something, GREAT, if not it's still fun to ride with someone with his chops.
It's not like it's a coach type ride.
Go have fun. it's just a ride.
Ed, you often mention John Allis. Here's a pic of me racing next to him over 37 years ago. He won that race, the National Road championships. Tom Officer, who shows up across the hall these days, was second. It was the men against the boys when Allis, Howard, et al, showed up on the Raleigh/CRC team. I was on the Wolverine Sport Club team out of Detroit, in my second year of racing. John Howard attacked at one point and exploded the peloton. I was just . . . gone. For the gearheads, that was my California Masi, one of the first handful built.
http://gallery.me.com/timporter1/100283/Untitled-1_2/web.jpg?ver=13178521310001
To OP, sorry for the drift. Enjoy that ride and please report back.
Tim
CRC of A in the house! (now back to your regularly scheduled thread)
ckamp
10-06-2011, 06:33 PM
His name is Bernard Croyet, here is some info on him...
http://www.cyclingarchives.com/coureurfiche.php?coureurid=19550
interesting sidenote... I was looking at the Bic team he raced on at the '74 Tour... he raced with Johny Schleck, the Schleck brother's father...
Ask him if he has those glasses still. I want them.
:)
fourflys
10-06-2011, 08:50 PM
thanks all... I'm really looking forward to it... I've talked quite a bit in the shop with him and can only imagine I'll pick up a thing or two on a ride...
as an aside, he did coach for a while... I know he coached locally here in San Diego for a while and one of my co-workers said he worked with one of the US Cycling women's teams... He told me he quit coaching locally for the most part because too many people thought they knew better than when it came to how to train... it amazes me that someone would pay a coach and then not listen to them... :confused:
laupsi
10-07-2011, 07:29 AM
He told me he quit coaching locally for the most part because too many people thought they knew better than when it came to how to train... it amazes me that someone would pay a coach and then not listen to them... :confused:
not a dig at your pro but actually very few expros, from any sport that is, make good coaches. in many ways they have a difficult time relating to the average athlete.
fourflys
10-07-2011, 09:59 AM
not a dig at your pro but actually very few expros, from any sport that is, make good coaches. in many ways they have a difficult time relating to the average athlete.
not arguing that point... but, why would anyone pay someone to teach them and basically tell them to eff off when the teacher teaches... I will say (not that it's the same), as I mentioned earlier his son is only 15 or so and already ripping the legs off the "A" ride... and the "A" ride in SoCal is something...
not arguing that point... but, why would anyone pay someone to teach them and basically tell them to eff off when the teacher teaches... I will say (not that it's the same), as I mentioned earlier his son is only 15 or so and already ripping the legs off the "A" ride... and the "A" ride in SoCal is something...
It sounds funny, but it happens all the time. Most of all at the local level.
People seem to think that no one local can know what they are talking about.
I'm not a cycling coach, so I am speaking of coaching in general coaching terms. They would rather hire a cheerleader as a coach, then somebody that will coach them.
I do agree that not all great pros make great coaches. Just like life, some do, some don't.
I would suggest not asking him to coach you, but asking him to ride with you. I feel sure that you will learn a great deal just by doing this. Just the smoothness of his pedal stroke will help you.
Good luck and I hope you two get along great and ride many, many times together.
Fixed
10-07-2011, 12:00 PM
make a new friend who just happens to be really strong on the bike.
enjoy the day
cheers
make a new friend who just happens to be really strong on the bike.
enjoy the day
cheers
EXACTLY! Very solid plan ! :banana:
fourflys
10-07-2011, 12:29 PM
I would suggest not asking him to coach you, but asking him to ride with you. I feel sure that you will learn a great deal just by doing this. Just the smoothness of his pedal stroke will help you.
that's my plan... and what Fixed said....
binxnyrwarrsoul
10-08-2011, 04:33 AM
After a bit of riding, he'll inevitably say, "try this, or shift here, etc.", it won't be a coach telling you to do something, but a fellow rider suggesting something that has worked/helped them. Big difference. I've done it and had bros do it for me, and is always welcome/welcomed. Unique experience you've got there, enjoy it, and pass along the "insight".
Ti Designs
10-09-2011, 12:04 PM
not arguing that point... but, why would anyone pay someone to teach them and basically tell them to eff off when the teacher teaches...
It happens all the time - I've always thought it happens so often in cycling because it's viewed as the sport without skills, but it really happens with anything where people assume the subject is simple. With cycling a lot of people are given the advice to get a coach, but they really view it as a pure test of strength and effort. In their minds, if they can ride faster than the coach just by trying harder, they've proven that they don't really need a coach. When I start with new clients there's often a "test the coach" period - it's my top reason to stay close to race fitness in season and not pick up new clients on the road in the fall when I'm fat and slow. What I've always found a bit amusing is how these people can overlook the obvious. They're killing themselves and riding ugly, I'm spinning along next to them and talking - shouldn't that tell them anything? I give riders their own short test period to see if they can be coached. If they can't slow down and learn within the first two weeks, I'm probably wasting my time (and their money). The true will to learn is like gold to any good coach.
BillG
10-09-2011, 03:33 PM
If they can't slow down and learn within the first two weeks, I'm probably wasting my time (and their money). The true will to learn is like gold to any good coach.
So that's why you stopped riding with me!
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