What is this titanium bike?

[Andrewlcox]

My buddy is shopping for a titanium bike ever since he saw a Seven on our Century ride. That means I am scouting for him and I came across this in his size, but what is it? (http://www.ebay.com/itm/140608626100?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649) ? I see they guess at a Fuji or Litespeed but does anyone here know?

Also, I found this one. (http://www.ebay.com/itm/280741187022?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649) Any info on it?

Thaks,
Andy

[Pegoready]

Both of those frames you reference are interesting collectors items, but ride nothing like modern Ti.

That Fuji/Litespeed is built with anemic tubing diameters and a 1" threaded head tube setup. These are the frames that gave Ti a reputation for being noodly.

I don't even know what to say about the bizarre lugged Ti Havnoonian.

If your buddy is looking for the magic Ti ride on a budget, I'd scour the classified and ebay for a used Serotta, Seven, recent Litespeed, Moots, etc. A good frameset can be had for $1k if you're saavy. I'd stick with a big maker, made within the last 10 years.

[tugrul]

I couldn't find good photos of a Sandvik Fuji Titanium road bike, but here is a Fuji pursuit bike (http://forums.roadbikereview.com/bikes-frames-forks/titanium-fuji-pursuit-frame-215141.html), and the dropout joints and BB stamps seem pretty similar.

The last Titanium Fuji that went on eBay was north of $1k, but it was a Sumitomo frame.

[Peter P.]

The first one COULD be a Litespeed, but the welding, particularly the dropouts, doesn't look like that of the older Litespeeds I'm familiar with.

I wouldn't buy that bike anyway. The nature of titanium calls for larger diameter tubes vs. steel tubes, to resist frame flex. While the top tube looks like it's 28.6mm, the down tube is hardly oversized. Your friend might find it doesn't possess the qualities he imagined when he was lovestruck by the Seven. It also looks like that frame has an aluminum fork. Aluminum forks aren't known for their longevity.

Harry Havnoonian had a strong reputation a decade or two ago. He ventured into bonded frames, i.e., gluing the tubes together to mix and match various frame tube materials. That frame you're looking at has titanium tubes bonded titanium lugs. For some reason, that construction method never caught on. What does that tell you?

I wouldn't recommend either frame for a friend because if he's dissatisfied, it could taint your friendship and put into question your reputation and knowledge. Keep your eyes peeled for a genuine Litespeed, Merlin, or Lynskey Performance.

[Andrewlcox]

Thats some good knowledge. I've told him to look for the big names and a more current frame.

Here is a picture of the HH built up. (http://www.campyonly.com/images/modbikes/2008/bike%202.jpg)

Thanks for the help.

Andy

[jr59]

Here is one that may work for you;

http://www.ebay.com/itm/260857652005?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

[bicycletricycle]

first one reminds me of an old diamond back racing frame. they made road and mountain frames. here is some pics of mountain frame with a serial number shot, the made in usa looks pretty close

http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro-classic/dbr-titanium-frameset-build-up-big-pics-sorry-706426.html

[oliver1850]

The stays ends don't have the bullet ends that were typical of Litespeed in the early 90s. Most of the popular Litespeeds didn't have a seat clamp, had windowed dropouts, had the brake cable routed low on the top tube, and a used braze FD. Decent deal at the current price for the DA group and wheels.

I would agree with tugrul that it's probably a TiSport built frame. I don't remember what all they made, Sampson and Dean possibly?

[Andrewlcox]

first one reminds me of an old diamond back racing frame. they made road and mountain frames. here is some pics of mountain frame with a serial number shot, the made in usa looks pretty close

http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro-classic/dbr-titanium-frameset-build-up-big-pics-sorry-706426.html

I agree. Even the rear dropout welds look similar. Good call.

Andy

[fogrider]

not sure about the litespeed. most litespeeds have a cut a way rear dropout. the Havnoonian looks interesting. I've heard of his bikes and his turn around rear brake. I wouldn't mind have one...but then these are not on par with a seven.

[Louis]

Tell your buddy to get a used Legend and be done with it.

[buldogge]

Hey Mark...FWIW, my 2000 Sampson is Litespeed built...It's a Z7 and is basically a Palmares with straight stays.

-Mark in St. Louis

The stays ends don't have the bullet ends that were typical of Litespeed in the early 90s. Most of the popular Litespeeds didn't have a seat clamp, had windowed dropouts, had the brake cable routed low on the top tube, and a used braze FD. Decent deal at the current price for the DA group and wheels.

I would agree with tugrul that it's probably a TiSport built frame. I don't remember what all they made, Sampson and Dean possibly?

[zennmotion]

first one reminds me of an old diamond back racing frame. they made road and mountain frames. here is some pics of mountain frame with a serial number shot, the made in usa looks pretty close

http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro-classic/dbr-titanium-frameset-build-up-big-pics-sorry-706426.html

This indeed looks like my Diamondback, made by Sandvik, sadly crushed in an encounter with a car. The Sandvik division that made Ti bike frames later became Titanium Sports Technologies (TST) in Kennewick WA. They only do Ti, and they do it as well as anyone if not better. Framebuilding didn't fit their business model so they got out of it, but they still produce other Ti products as well as manufacture tubing, all US made. I loved my bike enough that I replaced it with another that was sold directly from the factory, un-decaled surplus stock that sold under various names (eg Mongoose, Diamondback, built for Dean for awhile, and Douglas for Colorado Cyclist among others). My TST is a sweet riding frame, basic straight gauge but definitely not junk, just missing the decals.

[oliver1850]

Hey Mark...FWIW, my 2000 Sampson is Litespeed built...It's a Z7 and is basically a Palmares with straight stays.

-Mark in St. Louis


Wasn't the Kalispell the older Sampson Ti frame? May have been Litespeed too, I have the catalog here buried somewhere.

[Gothard]

The Fuji is an exact carbon copy of my Dean MTB. Bullet ends of stays, BB stamping, dropout shape.

[gdw]

"The Fuji is an exact carbon copy of my Dean MTB. Bullet ends of stays, BB stamping, dropout shape. "

Sandvik made the early Deans and the frame in question.

[oldpotatoe]

My buddy is shopping for a titanium bike ever since he saw a Seven on our Century ride. That means I am scouting for him and I came across this in his size, but what is it? (http://www.ebay.com/itm/140608626100?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649) ? I see they guess at a Fuji or Litespeed but does anyone here know?

Also, I found this one. (http://www.ebay.com/itm/280741187022?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649) Any info on it?

Thaks,
Andy

Check these, decent Chinese frames.

http://www.habcycles.com

Mark Hickey, good guy.

[buldogge]

Yeah...The Kalispell was very similar to a Litespeed 'Classic' I believe...

Z7 here: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=942924

-Mark



Wasn't the Kalispell the older Sampson Ti frame? May have been Litespeed too, I have the catalog here buried somewhere.

[biker72]

The seller of the first bike is having it packed at my LBS, (where I work),.
Nice clean bike but no decals anywhere. A "made in USA" on the bottom bracket housing would eliminate a Fuji of that vintage.

[rpm]

I used to own one of those Havnoonian ti frames before I got my current Strong ti and Serotta CDA. The stainless lugs made it a little heavier than a welded frame but not by that much. And it was no noodle. The construction is very solid, and it was a good sprinter. I replaced the aluminum fork with a carbon wound up, and it had a good ride.

I donated mine to a local shop run by urban teens. They were thrilled to get it. I bet some kid is racing on it now. It had a fast geometry, and it would make a great cheap, unbreakable criterium bike.

[Andrewlcox]

The Harry Havnoonian sold for only $265.00 tonight. I am shocked by the low price but what do I know.

Andy

[Andrewlcox]

The titanium Fuji (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fuji-titanium-road-used-61cm-Shimano-Dura-ace-collector-bike-bicycle-/140612941529?_trksid=p4340.m1374&_trkparms=algo%3DPI.WATCH%26its%3DC%252BS%26itu%3D UCC%26otn%3D15%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D325527646688103 4267) is back up for auction. Maybe biker72 knows why the seller relisted it.

Andy

[shankldu]

I have the same frame guy says it was made for giordana back in the day by light speed







































saw a Seven on our Century ride. That means I am scouting for him and I came across this in his size, but what is it? (http://www.ebay.com/itm/140608626100?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649) ? I see they guess at a Fuji or Litespeed but does anyone here know?

Also, I found this one. (http://www.ebay.com/itm/280741187022?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649) Any info on it?

Thaks,
Andy[/QUOTE]