Brake (der) anchor bolt rusting.

[boywander]

Any one find this annoying? I found my record bolts rusting out.
If it did not say Titanium on the brakes and dérailleurs, it may not have bother me that much. It's sad to see it at this component level vs Shimano.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-aORb6IgX9gI/TmkOnIdLo3I/AAAAAAAAA78/ZmLE9VRW4X8/s720/20110825229.jpg

[ultraman6970]

I would be pissed if it suppose to be titanium.

[konstantkarma]

The brake is Ti, not the bolts. It looks like surface corrosion forming where the hex wrench has nicked the chrome. No major problem to wipe off with a greasy rag. Or swap out for Ti bolts.

[boywander]

The brake is Ti, not the bolts. It looks like surface corrosion forming where the hex wrench has nicked the chrome. No major problem to wipe off with a greasy rag. Or swap out for Ti bolts.

Thanks for the explanation. Though I'm a little skeptic about the Ti part.
If the brake is literally titanium, then under that black paint is Ti??
I don't understand why Campagnolo paint them. Anyone ever scape of the paint to see if it's actually titanium?

[ultraman6970]

Is easy to know, just put a magnet it should not stick to it. Hmmm never tried a magnet in AL tho...

[boywander]

Is easy to know, just put a magnet it should not stick to it. Hmmm never tried a magnet in AL tho...

Magnet does not attract Al (aluminum). Ti is an alloy. There goes that test!

[Ralph]

It's a piece of cake to clean up.....WD40 and a rag or Q tip etc. Almost everything corrodes with some sweat.

[rustychisel]

clean regularly and keep an oily rag on hand. Use an end of the rag like a Q tip to clean and smear inside bolts like that, no more problems...

FWIW, and there is debate on this, WD 40 is great - much better than Pledge or Mr Sheen - for keeping a clean bike in good condition due to the lubricant left behind when the carrier evaporates*

* not for wheels, braking surfaces, obviously

[kramnnim]

...are the bolts on some older, non skeleton Record calipers ti?

[rustychisel]

...are the bolts on some older, non skeleton Record calipers ti?

Yes, my partners 10 speed Record with black finish has Ti bolts

[oliver1850]

I agree with the OP. Should be stainless if not Ti. I don't expect it on Veloce, but would if I was paying Record prices, especially when the catalog says "titanium hardware". Arms are aluminum, but the pivot bolt might be Ti.

[kramnnim]

Maybe the pivoting thing the anchor bolt threads in to is still ti...?

[boywander]

clean regularly and keep an oily rag on hand. Use an end of the rag like a Q tip to clean and smear inside bolts like that, no more problems...

FWIW, and there is debate on this, WD 40 is great - much better than Pledge or Mr Sheen - for keeping a clean bike in good condition due to the lubricant left behind when the carrier evaporates*

* not for wheels, braking surfaces, obviously
It's not difficult to clean and do a little preventive maintainance.
But I'm still curious of where the "Ti" label actually means.

[boywander]

...are the bolts on some older, non skeleton Record calipers ti?
Yes, that rings true on and in the previous gen.
Why did Campagnolo has "Record titanium" printed on the brake? Calling campy expert :help:

[boywander]

Maybe the pivoting thing the anchor bolt threads in to is still ti...?
Confirmed not one this gen.

[Peter B]

Yes, that rings true on and in the previous gen.
Why did Campagnolo has "Record titanium" printed on the brake? Calling campy expert :help:


marketing: ti center pivot bolt. on the current skeleton version arms, spacers, pad holders and misc fasteners are AL. others are plated steel. return spring is steel. pads are organic friction material. and there's some synthetic in the adjusters.

they're brakes. do 3 or 30 grams matter?

oldpotatoe will correct me as needed.

[Ralph]

For a part where you put a tool to, and some way over tighten, steel is the better choice.

[AngryScientist]

i agree with the OP sentiment. looks like those bolts are chromed steel. that almost has to be heavier than stainless.

it's unbelievable that they dont use stainless hardware on a brakeset that retails for as much as record stuff does. shameful IMO.

also, for those of you who are saying its simple to clean up, use a Q-tip and grease, etc etc, c'mon, should we have to take better care of our bikes than children?

record is supposed to be pro level stuff, ridden hard for training day in, day out, in whatever the weather has in store. cheap chrome plated bolts? really?

hopefully this problem will become evident and hardware will be switched to stainless in the future.

[ultraman6970]

If the OP did not get the brakes brand new and sealed then u have a chance that the bolt was swapped at some point. The other caliper looks the same?

[boywander]

If the OP did not get the brakes brand new and sealed then u have a chance that the bolt was swapped at some point. The other caliper looks the same?

It did not occur to me that may be what happen. But my other one is the same exact bolt. These were brand new in sealed box 2007-08.

This is not from sweat corrosion. It's just plain humidity (not from direct water damage ie rain etc...).

[Mike748]

I have silver Record-D brakes on two bikes. Some of the pivot hardware and the brake pad nuts are Ti. The anchor bolt is black, I think also Ti. Everything else is Al. These Ti bits are the only difference to the almost identical Chorus-D.

I think the "Titanium" moniker just suggests that there is at least one Ti part in there somewhere...

I haven't seen plated anchor bolts on Record since 90's 8-spd group. Maybe someone swapped them out on you?

[boywander]

I have silver Record-D brakes on two bikes. Some of the pivot hardware and the brake pad nuts are Ti. The anchor bolt is black, I think also Ti. Everything else is Al. These Ti bits are the only difference to the almost identical Chorus-D.

I think the "Titanium" moniker just suggests that there is at least one Ti part in there somewhere...

I haven't seen plated anchor bolts on Record since 90's 8-spd group. Maybe someone swapped them out on you?

It's hard to say that's the case because I've seen this problem with not only brake anchor bolts but also FD, a RD as well.
Are your brakes pre skeleton Gen 2006-older?

[champ]

+1 on the WD-40 to remove the rust. It wont get all of it but it will help.

The Record Ti brakes should have Ti bolts for the brake cables. Whoever you bought them from must have swapped the bolts with the steel bolts that come on all the other brakesets, including current Record. Only SR has TI bolts now but all the Record Skeleton brakesets prior to the introduction of SR had Ti cable anchor bolts.

[boywander]

+1 on the WD-40 to remove the rust. It wont get all of it but it will help.

The Record Ti brakes should have Ti bolts for the brake cables. Whoever you bought them from must have swapped the bolts with the steel bolts that come on all the other brakesets, including current Record. Only SR has TI bolts now but all the Record Skeleton brakesets prior to the introduction of SR had Ti cable anchor bolts.

According to PeterB that isn't so. Am I reading it right?
marketing: ti center pivot bolt. on the current skeleton version arms, spacers, pad holders and misc fasteners are AL. others are plated steel. return spring is steel. pads are organic friction material. and there's some synthetic in the adjusters.

they're brakes. do 3 or 30 grams matter?

oldpotatoe will correct me as needed.

[Peter B]

I have 3 bikes with 2007 Record 10, all running Record 10 skeleton calipers with the 'Record titanium' logo. All came from the facotory with plated steel brake cable fixing bolts.

YMMV

[champ]

None of the Record Ti skeleton brakes are supposed to have steel cable anchor bolts - they should have either Ti or alu depending on the year and all should have alu bolts post SR11. Chorus and below have steel bolts in this location from the factory.

[boywander]

I have 3 bikes with 2007 Record 10, all running Record 10 skeleton calipers with the 'Record titanium' logo. All came from the facotory with plated steel brake cable fixing bolts.

YMMV

Would you please post some pics for us? I am skeptical about this whole issue now.

[boywander]

None of the Record Ti skeleton brakes are supposed to have steel cable anchor bolts - they should have either Ti or alu depending on the year and all should have alu bolts post SR11. Chorus and below have steel bolts in this location from the factory.

Where did you get this info from? If possible, is there a way to proof it?
I am overly curious and skeptical at this point.

[Pete Serotta]

Internet can not validate nor can the pictures. There are folks on the forum that have knowledge to make an assumption but it will
need to be taken to someone that can validate the material of each component and then the hardware can not be 100% validated that it came from CAMPY. :crap:


Go for a bike ride and/or have a some red wine, or both and enjoy the day.


I do not mean to be crabby here but the thread is sliding in the wrong direction.


Pete :crap:

[champ]

I got the info from the Campy catalogs and group specs over the past few years - they claim alu and ti hardware, not steel. I was also a bike mechanic for about 4 years and never saw Record differential or skeleton brakes with steel brake cable bolts. A few years ago they had ti bolts with an alu plate then alu bolts more recently.

[lonoeightysix]

I use Boeshield T9 on my winter bike's exposed steel surfaces (bolt heads, brake return springs, etc), just before salt season starts. Just a touch, and then wipe off the excess a day later. One treatment lasts the majority of the winter riding season.

[jemoryl]

I wouldn't want Ti or Al parts for that particular application . Stainless would be better IMO, but most screws and bolts on Campy stuff are chromed steel and suffer from rust where the tool damages the plating. Maybe the Campy engineers are looking for a particular property of steel over stainless in a critical place?

[christian]

Agreed. I would never ride a bike with a Ti (let alone Al) brake fixing bolt, unless it was upsized appropriately from a standard steel piece.

[AngryScientist]

Agreed. I would never ride a bike with a Ti (let alone Al) brake fixing bolt, unless it was upsized appropriately from a standard steel piece.

however stainless should be a no brainer here IMO

[christian]

Nothing much to add, but....

My (2005ish) Chorus 10 speed dual-pivots and my (2010ish) Chorus 11 speed skeleton brakes all appear to use stainless hardware for the brake cable fixing bolt.

So I'd be surprised if Record didn't too.

[Joachim]

Agreed. I would never ride a bike with a Ti (let alone Al) brake fixing bolt, unless it was upsized appropriately from a standard steel piece.

It that case I'm going to throw away my BNIB Super Record 2010 brakeset (the brake fixing bolt must be Ti I think).

[christian]

Ok, let me re-phrase. I'm a mechanical luddite. Being forced to use a torque wrench to tighten my brake cable fixing bolts because I'm afraid they might shear seems like way more work than I want. Really, of the things on my bike I don't want to shear, the seat rail clamp and the brake fixing bolts would top the list.

[Joachim]

I agree, some things just need to be tightened the old fashioned way without cringing at every turn of the wrench.

[boywander]

Internet can not validate nor can the pictures. There are folks on the forum that have knowledge to make an assumption but it will
need to be taken to someone that can validate the material of each component and then the hardware can not be 100% validated that it came from CAMPY. :crap:


Go for a bike ride and/or have a some red wine, or both and enjoy the day.


I do not mean to be crabby here but the thread is sliding in the wrong direction.


Pete :crap:

After a little bit of searching around online I found images in articles in cyclyingnews. The bolts are the same exact one, not the dark grey Ti bolt on previous non-skeleton brakes (2006- older).

This is from cyclingnews.com (http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/photos/2007/tech/probikes/index.php?id=/photos/2007/tech/probikes/tom_boonen_specialized_tarmacsl2/Tom_Boonens_Quickstep-Innergetic_Specialized_S-Works_Tarmac_SL2_brake_and_pads)
http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/photos/2007/tech/probikes/tom_boonen_specialized_tarmacsl2/Tom_Boonens_Quickstep-Innergetic_Specialized_S-Works_Tarmac_SL2_brake_and_pads.jpg

another from cyclingnews.com (http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=/photos/2007/tech/reviews/ridley_noah07/Ridley_Noah_front_brake)

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/photos/2007/tech/reviews/ridley_noah07/Ridley_Noah_front_brake.jpg

cyclingnews.com (http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/tech/2007/probikes/?id=calzati_btwin07)
http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/photos/2007/tech/probikes/calzati_btwin07/CalzatiBike013.jpg

i agree with the OP sentiment. looks like those bolts are chromed steel. that almost has to be heavier than stainless.

it's unbelievable that they dont use stainless hardware on a brakeset that retails for as much as record stuff does. shameful IMO.

also, for those of you who are saying its simple to clean up, use a Q-tip and grease, etc etc, c'mon, should we have to take better care of our bikes than children?

record is supposed to be pro level stuff, ridden hard for training day in, day out, in whatever the weather has in store. cheap chrome plated bolts? really?

hopefully this problem will become evident and hardware will be switched to stainless in the future.

I feel like many others (ie AngryScientist) that this level of component deserves better than chrome plated steel. I don't think this is sliding in the wrong direction at all. In fact it's the reason why I posted this problem on this forum knowing that there are lots of campy users that noticed this rust problem. Not trying to start any fight with anyone but to get some census from campy owner of 2007-2008 Record gen.
If anything, may be the company will take notice if they hear the consumer's voice and take action.

[boywander]

It that case I'm going to throw away my BNIB Super Record 2010 brakeset (the brake fixing bolt must be Ti I think).

Stop! Don't just throw those to bolts away. Throw them my way. :D

[jemoryl]

Here is what happens to guys that use Ti bolts to secure their cables (green arrow):

[boywander]

Here is what happens to guys that use Ti bolts to secure their cables (green arrow):

:D I imagine the guy would go over a cliff when he lost his brakes rather than what looks like a front wheel washed out over steering. :D

[boywander]

Updates:
I've decided to rectify this problem. Mainly because it's an eye sore seeing Campy Record 2007-08(at the time top of the line) equiped with chrome plated steel bolts. So I've replace CPS bolts with stainless steel ones I re-machined.
They are 4mm SHCS cut to lenght and the head turned down.The result is a cleaner and slightly lighter no rust finish.
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-vu6Era5fE5Q/TmpMsWEO7JI/AAAAAAAAA-4/ObnAld2xB50/s640/20110823211.jpg
Before:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-fSac7561f5k/TmpMrRiY1KI/AAAAAAAAA-o/RjRclEl6Mes/s640/20110823207.jpghttps://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-vHRog7vx70E/TmpMwIhL3iI/AAAAAAAAA_w/QjhZmHeEV6M/s640/20110825227.jpg
After:
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-VbOpvZLphrQ/TmpMr6MvtbI/AAAAAAAAA-w/OPJCCfuF2BA/s640/20110823209.jpghttps://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-s7WfA6cthmc/TmpMwTOSBrI/AAAAAAAAA_8/T2VV5pqa1q8/s640/20110827240.jpg
One thing leads to another. Note the weight is 0.1g over the brake bolt
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-I8c3mLc9cUw/TmpMtCuF10I/AAAAAAAAA_E/kAvK18i-gzw/s640/20110825216.jpghttps://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-zsLgAeek0ZI/TmpMtYTlPpI/AAAAAAAAA_I/PR27wJD2i9M/s640/20110825217.jpg https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-jd9L7EbctLw/TmpMxryi5FI/AAAAAAAABAM/5X8klNyHP3g/s640/20110827244.jpg