Di2 purchase..

[FixedNotBroken]

Considering getting a full Di2 set up..

I am sure there was a thread on here regarding it but if Ryun could chime in and other who own it/have ridden it. What are the benefits of the group? What should I expect? I love the feel of the shifters under my hands, they are as comfortable as the Campy ergo's for my hands.

Also..what should I look to pay? Best case scenario? Worst case scenario? Thanks much ahead of time!

[pdmtong]

I'm not an owner but i did spend 50 miles/4000' on a Di2 Tarmac SL3 last spring. What you can expect is the unreal experience of perfect shifting with the slightest touch, under load, independent of cadence, with no FD rubbing noise, and the feeling that you wish all your bikes had this group. This coming from a campy guy who also has sram on one ride.

One day I imagine you could go to a vending machine, insert a credit card, stick your hand in, and 5 minutes later out pops a custome shifter body made just for you. why not? there is no longer any need to tie body shape with cable mechanics.


http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=89227

[firerescuefin]

......or since you are a self described "Campy Nut"...just wait for Campys E-group, since that's what you'll end up with anyway :rolleyes:

[FixedNotBroken]

......or since you are a self described "Campy Nut"...just wait for Campys E-group, since that's what you'll end up with anyway :rolleyes:

You're right..I just see it and want it. When is the Campy group coming out?

[WickedWheels]

I've worked on it and rebuilt shifters. It's good. Really good. Very serviceable.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

I am on my second bike with Di2 and the main features, in order of importance to me, are: (1) shape of hoods; (2) once you dial in the shifting, no adjustment necessary as no cable stretch or no replacing cables; (3) front derailler (auto trimming and awesome shifts).

I bought a group from Excel Sports for $3200 a few months ago; that just about matches any overseas retailers and you get a warranty, too.

[firerescuefin]

You're right..I just see it and want it. When is the Campy group coming out?

Possible in 2012...this would be a perfect time for Pez to chime in.

[Bruce K]

The Ultegra version is on the way at a much better price point if it's the functionality you are looking for and not the D-A per se.

A freind has the Di2 set up on her TT bike and that is amazing with shifting available at both the brake levers and aerobars.

BK

[oldpotatoe]

Considering getting a full Di2 set up..

I am sure there was a thread on here regarding it but if Ryun could chime in and other who own it/have ridden it. What are the benefits of the group? What should I expect? I love the feel of the shifters under my hands, they are as comfortable as the Campy ergo's for my hands.

Also..what should I look to pay? Best case scenario? Worst case scenario? Thanks much ahead of time!

Pros-Consistent shifting over time, best front der shifting in existence.

Con's-expense initially and if you fall and kill a lever or rear derailleur-$. No single levers available right now.

I have sold it and have ridden it. Pretty whizbang but unlike some others, it's not a 'aaaahhhhhh' moment for me. Actually slower into lower gears(bigger cogs) than a sweep of STI, one gear at a time. In addition, the first I rode was on a cold day..gloves can make for finding the buttons a wee chore, close together, the buttons.

Ultegra coming this fall/winter, Campagnolo 'may' come this winter as well. I'll know more at Interbike. I'm not sure Campagnolo have decided to market it. Gonna be lots of $, has to be as good(better? Lighter?) than Di2.

[metalheart]

Forgive the uninformed questions, but can an alternate cassette or wheel be mounted without any adjustment issues? Or, does changing cassettes require some mechanical adjustment to make things work smoothly?

[eltonbalch]

Considering getting a full Di2 set up..

I am sure there was a thread on here regarding it but if Ryun could chime in and other who own it/have ridden it. What are the benefits of the group? What should I expect? I love the feel of the shifters under my hands, they are as comfortable as the Campy ergo's for my hands.

Also..what should I look to pay? Best case scenario? Worst case scenario? Thanks much ahead of time!

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=70101

I'm a casual cyclist so this is not in my immediate future. Seems too go to be true IMHO.

[Ryun]

My initial impressions have already been linked to...
I have been riding it exclusively since round march on two separate bikes.
I stand by all my first impressions and can add some color to longer term impressions.
--Shifting is very very consistent. One bike I have touched since I got it and the only reasonI adjusted the other one was swapping wheelsets. it just need a two touch tweak and I was able to do this while riding.
--The front shifting is still amazing.
--I have dropped a bike and scuffed the rear derailleur. I reset from crash mode and no issues. Pretty durable.
--I do seem to get a little flex out of the rear mech under high high speeds. Not sure whats going on there. may just be me.
- I bought an extra battery to rotate thru cause I was paranoid but I have not had an issue with battery life. Although I did show up at the tuesday night worlds and realized I had left a batter at home.
--The single cog in the rear takes getting used to. Its flat here so no issue but rolling territory might be more annoying.
--I absolutely love campy. i have had them (up until now) on every bike since 91 BUT I would never buy italian electronics. I have enough experience in my day job with italian high end cars to understand that is not their forte.

I havent looked into pricing but I would buy it domestically just in case. I have not ever thought about a component warranty with mechanical groups and routinely buy them overseas but in case you get a bad harness etc. might be easier to deal local

[oldpotatoe]

Forgive the uninformed questions, but can an alternate cassette or wheel be mounted without any adjustment issues? Or, does changing cassettes require some mechanical adjustment to make things work smoothly?

If the cogset is in the same relative place with regard to the rear derailleur, no adjust but unless the hub is the same, unlikely. BUT hold a button down while in 5th cog..micro adjust/center there there, ensure limit screws still proper, yer done.

[WickedWheels]

I agree with all of the for the most part, with one small exception. The shifters are repairable. I had a customer crash and kill the shifter body and while the entire shifter was on backorder, they had a shifter body sent to me. I was able to remove the lever blade and swap the electronic portion without any issues. It was quick and easy and did not require any derailleur adjustments afterwards.

One other issue that I ran into with Di2, which I believe applies to standard 7900... they run a titanium clamp for the STI attachment to handlebars. It has fairly sharp corners and seems to be pretty solid. This makes it more difficult to clamp onto carbon bars and keep them from rotating accidentally without going beyond what I would consider to be acceptable torque. I wish that they beveled the edges on the clamp and either used a thinner titanium clamp so it's more pliable or some sort of a rubber shim inserted in it.

Pros-Consistent shifting over time, best front der shifting in existence.

Con's-expense initially and if you fall and kill a lever or rear derailleur-$. No single levers available right now.

I have sold it and have ridden it. Pretty whizbang but unlike some others, it's not a 'aaaahhhhhh' moment for me. Actually slower into lower gears(bigger cogs) than a sweep of STI, one gear at a time. In addition, the first I rode was on a cold day..gloves can make for finding the buttons a wee chore, close together, the buttons.

Ultegra coming this fall/winter, Campagnolo 'may' come this winter as well. I'll know more at Interbike. I'm not sure Campagnolo have decided to market it. Gonna be lots of $, has to be as good(better? Lighter?) than Di2.

[rinconryder]

I have been riding it for about a month now and would agree with the above. Is it the be all end all? Probably not. Front shifting is far superior that anything I have ever ridden, but that is only a small advantage really. Rear shifting is the same as standard DA. But what I really like about it is that it just works plain and simple. Set it and forget it. I have ridden DA, Campy 11 and SRAM Red and Di2 is really my favorite of them all. Granted my mechanic skills are not the greatest, but I could never get the above to work perfectly - Di2 does work perfectly every time and I have yet to miss a shift. Never hangs and then drops back down, never skips over to the next gear up, never makes a noise, it just works - at a premium though.

[dhoff]

I have been riding Di2 for about 3 months. At first I had a reaction similar to all the others here, "good, works perfectly, and so what" As I ride it more and more, I like it more and more. Perfect shifting simultaneously front and rear makes is possible to have every shift be an even interval.

I liked it when I got it but that was based on using it like everyting else. Now that I am learning how to take advantage of it, Di2 is Killer. And to make wheel swapping effortless, space your wheels the same.

I am looking at it for the next project as well.

-d

[palincss]

I've worked on it and rebuilt shifters. It's good. Really good. Very serviceable.

What is there about DI2 shifters that could need to be rebuilt?

[Z3c]

I have had Di2 for over 2 years, the same grouppo has been moved 3 times to different frames. I am not a mechanic and I think it is simple to set-up. Totally reliable. Battery life is simply not an issue; I average ~1200 miles per charge and the battery charges in less than an hour. I describe it as a keyboard/typewriter comparison; same movements, just less effort. I have not had one single issue; granted it does not rain much in Az. I have ridden it with winter gloves and not had any problems; again, not with Lobster mitts though.. My other bike has 7900 and when I switch, it is mostly the absolute consistency/light touch that I miss. The front shifting still amazes me. I have the satelite/climbing switch which provides shifting from the tops; I really like them as it is nice when you are cruising along to be able to shift..

My opinion is that electronic shifting will be very common very soon, it is just that good. Most who hate on it have not ridden it for any real period of time.. the same folks who whined about the onset of integrated brake/shift levers.

Feel free to PM with any specific questions.

[m.skeen]

Excellent thread. A couple Q's come to mind:

1. Can anyone comment on setting Di2 up on a non Di2 specific frame? Wire routing, etc.
2. Anyone heard if the Ultegra Di shifters will be rebuildable? Not sure why they would need rebuilding though.

[rinconryder]

The wire routing on a non-Di2 specific frame is relatively clean although if you are very anal about looks you won't be happy. Shimano makes a tape like strip that you run down under the down tube - that is for the upper wiring and you cover it with said strip. same thing with the rear derailleur. The batter mounts just below the down tube water bottle mount. Sadly, many Di2 specific bikes don't hide the battery that well - which is a real shame. Calfee has a cool mod that you can do where the batter is inside the seat post - very clean. Right now I have a moots and I did the external just to see if I like it before I ordered up a Di2 specific version of the Moots - looks like I am going to head in that route.

Don't know anything about whether ultegra shifters can be rebuilt.

Hope that helps. I can email you a pic of my moots if you want - I don't know how to post pics here. :crap:

[rustychain]

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=84584

Boardman said that no electric group has yet passed the performance test. Does it make you go faster.

It works great until it doesn't work and the your done

Slower rear shifting then Campag Super Record. Only one shift at I time. The extra gear is great with an 11x25 cassette

[FixedNotBroken]

The wire routing on a non-Di2 specific frame is relatively clean although if you are very anal about looks you won't be happy. Shimano makes a tape like strip that you run down under the down tube - that is for the upper wiring and you cover it with said strip. same thing with the rear derailleur. The batter mounts just below the down tube water bottle mount. Sadly, many Di2 specific bikes don't hide the battery that well - which is a real shame. Calfee has a cool mod that you can do where the batter is inside the seat post - very clean. Right now I have a moots and I did the external just to see if I like it before I ordered up a Di2 specific version of the Moots - looks like I am going to head in that route.

Don't know anything about whether ultegra shifters can be rebuilt.

Hope that helps. I can email you a pic of my moots if you want - I don't know how to post pics here. :crap:

Good insight. What size frame do you ride :)

[WickedWheels]

What is there about DI2 shifters that could need to be rebuilt?

The rider crashed and broke the carbon body.

As for the weight weenies thread...
Any decent shop should have a Di2 system checker. It allows you to diagnose which component has a failure if the system doesn't work as it should. It's very simple to use and replacement parts are available for next day delivery if the store doesn't want to stock anything. I've only run into an issue with a wiring harness that was defective. I had a new one in had next day without any hassles on the part of Shimano. The symptom of the defect was that there was a red light on the system that was supposed to indicate a low battery level even though the batter was fine. It did not affect the function of the system in any way.

[rinconryder]

Ha. I ride a 55. But I think I am keeping it. Best bike I have ever ridden - they have the geometry dialed! I have never had a custom, but I would imagine this is what it feels like.

Good insight. What size frame do you ride :)

[forrestw]

I'm only going on what others have said.

As much as it sounds like they've done a good job with this, Di2 is so seriously overpriced the only way I could see opting for it would be in tt/triathlon where having shifting on the bullhorns as well as bar-ends would be a good thing. And $300 for bar end shifters that are basically a pair of switches??? insane.

I have to think that 5 years from now electronic shifting will be mainstream and cheaper than mechanical; volume brings price down fast. I sure don't wanna be the one paying premium to have the first generation.

[dd74]

BUT I would never buy italian electronics. I have enough experience in my day job with italian high end cars to understand that is not their forte.
What makes you think the Italian electronics are really Italian and not something similar to Shimano, i.e. Japanese?

Team Movistar used E-Campy to great success this year.

[Z3c]

Team Movistar used E-Campy to great success this year.[/QUOTE]

Yes, but until real folks own it we have no idea how reliable it is for those without free/endless tech help.. If pro use meant much, there would be a lot Sram Red on Ebay due to: Chaingate/different chainrings/different front ders/modifed rear der's...

[dd74]

Team Movistar used E-Campy to great success this year.

Yes, but until real folks own it we have no idea how reliable it is for those without free/endless tech help.. If pro use meant much, there would be a lot Sram Red on Ebay due to: Chaingate/different chainrings/different front ders/modifed rear der's...[/QUOTE]
True, but under racing conditions, those stresses should be much more than what "real folks" offer.

[Z3c]

Yes, but until real folks own it we have no idea how reliable it is for those without free/endless tech help.. If pro use meant much, there would be a lot Sram Red on Ebay due to: Chaingate/different chainrings/different front ders/modifed rear der's...
True, but under racing conditions, those stresses should be much more than what "real folks" offer.[/QUOTE]

Granted, but we have no idea how much/little effort it took to keep things working..

[dhoff]

Only one shift at I time.

This is a common myth. If you want it to shift three gears hit the button three times. It will execute a three cog shift way faster than you could throw the lever on another system. It takes getting used to but the more you know it the faster you get.

The best thing about it is when you get the feel and can shift up or down one small interval even if it requires a front and rear shift at the same time. I can shift the rear up two or three and the front down one at the same time.

Does it make me faster? I have no idea. It just works dead on, 100% of the time.

[dd74]

Granted, but we have no idea how much/little effort it took to keep things working..
+1. Which is why I'm curious.

[oldpotatoe]

This is a common myth. If you want it to shift three gears hit the button three times. It will execute a three cog shift way faster than you could throw the lever on another system. It takes getting used to but the more you know it the faster you get.

The best thing about it is when you get the feel and can shift up or down one small interval even if it requires a front and rear shift at the same time. I can shift the rear up two or three and the front down one at the same time.

Does it make me faster? I have no idea. It just works dead on, 100% of the time.

Myth-"b : an unfounded or false notion

My friction shifting 7s freewheel works dead on, 100% of the time...as long as my hand does. I can go from highest cog to lowest and back faster than Di2....

[WickedWheels]

Myth-"b : an unfounded or false notion

My friction shifting 7s freewheel works dead on, 100% of the time...as long as my hand does. I can go from highest cog to lowest and back faster than Di2....

My single speed also works dead on 100% of the time. It shifts faster than your 7-spd. My hand doesn't have to waste any energy moving for it.

My point is that it's not fair to compare a relatively simple 7spd system that, while has decent performance, lacks features available in today's systems. You might as well boast about the reliability of your abacus when talking about the potential of a computer crashing.

[Dave Wages]

Myth-"b : an unfounded or false notion

My friction shifting 7s freewheel works dead on, 100% of the time...as long as my hand does. I can go from highest cog to lowest and back faster than Di2....


My two cents would be this, while you're sitting down, easing up on the pedals to perform your 7 cog friction shift, the Di2 rider is out of the saddle hammering as he/she drops 7 cogs in a SLIGHTLY longer time. I'm guessing that Di2 rider comes out on top here.

Not really fair to compare these two, but since you brought it up...

My personal experience over my first month with Di2 is that it's pretty impossible to mis-shift, and if you do, it's because you pressed the wrong button. That's really been my only complaint, since the main brake lever doesn't move like mech. Shimano, I would occasionally hit the wrong button thinking that I'm hitting the small mech. lever. Once I got this sorted in my analog brain, I was all set. Can't wait to try it out at D2R2!

My new Dirt Road Bike (http://blog.elliscycles.com/2011/07/my-new-drb.html)

Cheers,
Dave

[oldpotatoe]

My two cents would be this, while you're sitting down, easing up on the pedals to perform your 7 cog friction shift, the Di2 rider is out of the saddle hammering as he/she drops 7 cogs in a SLIGHTLY longer time. I'm guessing that Di2 rider comes out on top here.

Not really fair to compare these two, but since you brought it up...

My personal experience over my first month with Di2 is that it's pretty impossible to mis-shift, and if you do, it's because you pressed the wrong button. That's really been my only complaint, since the main brake lever doesn't move like mech. Shimano, I would occasionally hit the wrong button thinking that I'm hitting the small mech. lever. Once I got this sorted in my analog brain, I was all set. Can't wait to try it out at D2R2!

My new Dirt Road Bike (http://blog.elliscycles.com/2011/07/my-new-drb.html)

Cheers,
Dave

Well Dave, I brought it to make the point that it's not a 'myth' that you can shift Di2 one cog at a time, as the OP stated.

The part about 7s was written as a 'light hearted' response to the complicated shifting systems seen today, including Di2.

[oldpotatoe]

My single speed also works dead on 100% of the time. It shifts faster than your 7-spd. My hand doesn't have to waste any energy moving for it.

My point is that it's not fair to compare a relatively simple 7spd system that, while has decent performance, lacks features available in today's systems. You might as well boast about the reliability of your abacus when talking about the potential of a computer crashing.

My 'point'-'Myth', not a myth that Di2 shifts one cog at a time...'light hearted response', 7s stuff, lets not get too serious about shifting systems on these things called 'bicycles'-

Plus, like you and Dave wages, can get this stuff at wholesale or less via EP but I am very happy with friction, etc, on my two bikes.

[FixedNotBroken]

My 'point'-'Myth', not a myth that Di2 shifts one cog at a time...'light hearted response', 7s stuff, lets not get too serious about shifting systems on these things called 'bicycles'-

Plus, like you and Dave wages, can get this stuff at wholesale or less via EP but I am very happy with friction, etc, on my two bikes.

One thing that keeps me from the Di2 is the fact that my Record 11 dances on cogs faster :) and more prestigiously.

But seriously..I love how you can dump gears so fast and at what, like 5 cogs down and 4 cogs up at a time? Other than that..the front shifting is sweet (I test rode one) and what's amazing is you can be pounding in the small ring and for the hell of it shift up in the front and it's flawless under all kinds of load.

[sg8357]

Plus, like you and Dave wages, can get this stuff at wholesale or less via EP but I am very happy with friction, etc, on my two bikes.

Wait for Di3, programmable gear spacing front and rear, so you can
run 7s and half step granny with auto-sequence gear select.
Di3 is Ant+ compatible with automatic gear selection programmed
via power meter and hrm. (from Bike Radar 3/7/12)

Mean while Campy is struggling to electrify the Paris-Roubaix shifter.

[LegendRider]

Can you run a Di2 upgrade kit (shifters, derailleurs) with an otherwise 7800 group?

[oldpotatoe]

Can you run a Di2 upgrade kit (shifters, derailleurs) with an otherwise 7800 group?

Yes, you can get the shifters, ders, battery and harness' and use it on any shimano or sram cogset/crank/brakeset. This with Di2 or ultegra Di2(they need to change the desig, Di1/2, Ej3....get it, 'I'm sorry Dave.........I can't do that'.................???).

Front der action won't be as good as with 7900 or 6700 but it'll work. Put it on a Cervelo with a Quark crank.