Cyclists are lemmings (noseless saddles)

[daker13]

That's what I got out of this article from the Times, anyway.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/28/science/28tier.html?pagewanted=1

[19wisconsin64]

hey, i'm no lemming. i'm a badger.

and i proudly ride a selle smp glider saddle.

looks like a regular saddle, and gosh, shucks...seems to work just fine!!!!

except for the price, it's perfect.

[mtnbke]

The funny thing is cyclists are pretentious buffoons, and care more about whether their Brooks saddle matches the shellacked leather bar tape on their boat anchor lugged steel bike, then whether they can perform functionally or whiz effectively past, say, forty-five.

I don't think you're going to quickly change a culture toward getting pressure of their perineum, as most cyclists belong to a subset that is effectively a cult. If someone wins a gran tour on one of these, or if Grant or Velo Orange sell it, though, you'll see hundreds of these on every ride. Count on it.

[rice rocket]

I'm drinking the Dr. Roger Minkow koolaid right now:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1T3-3RGLu4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsPhPYDV9Ek

[Louis]

I'm too tired to have sex.





(That was a joke.)

[rustychisel]

I was wondering a similar thing from the link...

who the hell measures stiffy time when you're asleep... and who really cares?


Actually, my take on it is from never having tried one of those saddles, but I was concerned about lack of control - I know I'm always using my thighs against the saddle nose to subtly control the bike.

[LesMiner]

Maybe it 20 or 25 years ago someone was promoting a noseless saddle. It had two separate pads for right and left sit bones. Each pad could pivot up and down so as you peddle the pad rotates with you. The saddle looked quite high tech. Then I ran across a saddle from the early 1900's, 1903 or so. Same exact concept just no high tech look or materials. Same size and the same pivot mechanism. Nose or no nose on a saddle appears to be a debate well over 100 years old. Anatomy back then is no different than now. Riders 100 years ago must of had the same numbness we have all had today.

There could be an even greater market opportunity. If it is possible to measure erection time percent while sleeping why not numbeness while riding? Some kind of compact sensor that you put in your shorts or maybe built into the saddle. Add ANT+ so you can monitor and record numbness right along with power, heart rate, speed, cadence, etc. Just imagine the amazing statistics you could create! Lets see what would a good Design Of Experiments be? Ridiculous of course, I am in a corporate cynical mode this morning.

[rugbysecondrow]

The funny thing is cyclists are pretentious buffoons, and care more about whether their Brooks saddle matches the shellacked leather bar tape on their boat anchor lugged steel bike, then whether they can perform functionally or whiz effectively past, say, forty-five.

.


I think you described about 5% or less of cyclists above. Most don't ride lugged, wouldnt know a Brooks from a baseball mitt, and ask about gel padding for the shelack.

Numb Peter is not an issue I typically get with my Brooks by the way.

[keevon]

The funny thing is cyclists are pretentious buffoons, and care more about whether their Brooks saddle matches the shellacked leather bar tape on their boat anchor lugged steel bike, then whether they can perform functionally or whiz effectively past, say, forty-five.

I don't think you're going to quickly change a culture toward getting pressure of their perineum, as most cyclists belong to a subset that is effectively a cult. If someone wins a gran tour on one of these, or if Grant or Velo Orange sell it, though, you'll see hundreds of these on every ride. Count on it.
Your perspective is skewed. Ride bike more, hang out on forums less.

[MattTuck]

“The biothesiometer is a device in which the men set their penis into a trough, and it slowly starts to vibrate,” he explained. “They push the button when they can feel the vibration. While it sounds delightful, it’s actually not. The Rigiscan is a machine the men wear at night that grabs the penis about every 15 seconds to see if it’s erect. It’s not as pleasant as it sounds, either.”

This reminds me a bit of shrodinger's cat experiment...

[Aaron O]

The funny thing is cyclists are pretentious buffoons, and care more about whether their Brooks saddle matches the shellacked leather bar tape on their boat anchor lugged steel bike, then whether they can perform functionally or whiz effectively past, say, forty-five.

I don't think you're going to quickly change a culture toward getting pressure of their perineum, as most cyclists belong to a subset that is effectively a cult. If someone wins a gran tour on one of these, or if Grant or Velo Orange sell it, though, you'll see hundreds of these on every ride. Count on it.

I love my Brooks saddle because it's comfortable. I love my lugged steel "boat anchor" because I like the ride and because it doesn't shatter when it fails. I don't care about maximizing every bit of speed or saving 5 pounds at the cost of longevity, aesthetics and feel. I'm not sponsored by a team that replaces my frame every few years. I like my bikes to look good and if they can match, great. I won't worry about aesthetics at the cost of performance/comfort, but it is a consideration.

I must be a pretentious buffoon for not riding things that are less comfortable and durable for negligible speed increases when I'm not racing :rolleyes:

Some might consider pompous, pretentious buffoonery to be judgmental cyclists who assume their riding preferences, wants and needs fit everyone else.

[BillG]

I think police probably sit on the saddle and ride in a very different position than most serious cyclists do. At least from my observations around here they ride in an upright position on hybrid/mtbs. So I wonder how relevant it is to those of us who move around on the saddle, etc.

[Hawker]

I'd be happy to give this kind of saddle a try, but not willing to spend big bucks to do so. Because this is going against a long tradition, I think the company's best bet is to offer a try-out program at bike shops.

Or...get Lance to ride one. :)

[FlashUNC]

I used a saddle with a nose. Fits me great, no problems in the gooch-ular region.

I get the sense too many folks are using saddles that don't support their sit bones, and instead support the squishy bits.

The problem isn't the equipment, in my mind, its the operator.

Besides, I know I'm adjusting fore and aft on the saddle as the situation dictates. A noseless saddle eliminates that ability entirely.

[kong79]

I'd be happy to give this kind of saddle a try, but not willing to spend big bucks to do so. Because this is going against a long tradition, I think the company's best bet is to offer a try-out program at bike shops.

Or...get Lance to ride one. :)

I went to the Competitive Cyclist site because they are listed as a dealer for the ISM saddle mentioned in the article, and guess what? Lance does (did) ride one on his TT bike.
That's enough for me, I'm going to spend the money I get from the sperm bank and buy me one.

[Ahneida Ride]

boat anchor lugged steel bike

Well yes and no. It all depends on the tubing ...
I've seen some really lite tig and lugged frames come out the Bedford shop.

It's not difficult at all to build a 17 lb steel bike.
Throw on exotic components and you are under 16 lb

I ride a Brooks .... well cause it works. I ride leather bar wrap cause
well it feels great too.

[Ti Designs]

More precisely, according to Dr. Schrader’s measurements, you are putting 25 to 40 percent of your body’s weight on the nerves and blood vessels near the surface of the perineum.

Learn how to ride...

As various forms of this subject keep coming up, I have to ask: What makes people assume they are experts on subjects? Example - everybody thinks they are a great driver. Why would anyone make that assumption? Is this a god given skill? The first step in becoming a good driver is performance driving school and the first thing you learn in performance driving school is that you probably really suck. If someone has spent no time or effort gaining the skills, why would they make the assumption that they don't suck? I can tell you that I don't go to the self check out lane at the supermarket 'cause the teller there is incompetent. Yes, I'm calling myself incompetent. I don't know any of the SKU numbers, I don't know the point of sale system... And why is being called incompetent such an insult? It's pretty much the default really - think of the things you really know, think of the things you don't - you're probably incompetent in most things...

I read the article and I can tell that these people have no clue. The only reason they feel the need to give other people advice is that they don't know their incompetent, or that device that grabs their penis every 15 seconds ain't shutting off.

My shop has sold bikes to at least a half dozen local towns. These bikes are used by multiple police officers, I doubt any of them know how to adjust saddle height. So, saddle height is correct plus or minus say 5" - and these people are giving advice on saddles???

[Dekonick]

Learn how to ride...

As various forms of this subject keep coming up, I have to ask: What makes people assume they are experts on subjects? Example - everybody thinks they are a great driver. Why would anyone make that assumption? Is this a god given skill? The first step in becoming a good driver is performance driving school and the first thing you learn in performance driving school is that you probably really suck. If someone has spent no time or effort gaining the skills, why would they make the assumption that they don't suck? I can tell you that I don't go to the self check out lane at the supermarket 'cause the teller there is incompetent. Yes, I'm calling myself incompetent. I don't know any of the SKU numbers, I don't know the point of sale system... And why is being called incompetent such an insult? It's pretty much the default really - think of the things you really know, think of the things you don't - you're probably incompetent in most things...

I read the article and I can tell that these people have no clue. The only reason they feel the need to give other people advice is that they don't know their incompetent, or that device that grabs their penis every 15 seconds ain't shutting off.

My shop has sold bikes to at least a half dozen local towns. These bikes are used by multiple police officers, I doubt any of them know how to adjust saddle height. So, saddle height is correct plus or minus say 5" - and these people are giving advice on saddles???

Yup - a proper fit and no issues with the typical ass hatchet. Having said that, I love my Brooks.

How many folks have a proper fit to begin with? A LOT of 'cyclists' don't... much less the masses who ride once a year. It is a sad lot that make up my department's 'bike team' - I would bet that the vast majority only ride a bike a few times a year - when they get paid to be a bike medic. Most of our police that are bike cops - well lets just say I see the bikes attached to the trunk bike carriers... I almost NEVER see a cop riding one...

The right bike for the right use, the right saddle for the right use. All with a proper fitting of course!

[Peter P.]

Numb Peter is not an issue I typically get with my Brooks by the way.

I take exception to your use of the word, "Peter". :rolleyes:

[Kontact]

Maybe it 20 or 25 years ago someone was promoting a noseless saddle. It had two separate pads for right and left sit bones. Each pad could pivot up and down so as you peddle the pad rotates with you. The saddle looked quite high tech. Then I ran across a saddle from the early 1900's, 1903 or so. Same exact concept just no high tech look or materials. Same size and the same pivot mechanism. Nose or no nose on a saddle appears to be a debate well over 100 years old. Anatomy back then is no different than now. Riders 100 years ago must of had the same numbness we have all had today.

There could be an even greater market opportunity. If it is possible to measure erection time percent while sleeping why not numbeness while riding? Some kind of compact sensor that you put in your shorts or maybe built into the saddle. Add ANT+ so you can monitor and record numbness right along with power, heart rate, speed, cadence, etc. Just imagine the amazing statistics you could create! Lets see what would a good Design Of Experiments be? Ridiculous of course, I am in a corporate cynical mode this morning.
The physiologist and saddle designer I work with uses blood flow as indicator. Numbness is the symptom, bloodflow restriction is the cause. If the bloodflow is good you aren't going to get numbness or soft tissue damage.

A good saddle puts almost no pressure on the perineum or any other soft tissues. And it doesn't take a noseless saddle or huge cut-outs to achieve that.

[1happygirl]

Ouch! My buy bones hurt after the bysaddle website. $225.00

[BBB]

There has to be a double entendre or two marketing departments could wheel out to headline an add campaign for these types of saddles.

[wasfast]

I went to the Competitive Cyclist site because they are listed as a dealer for the ISM saddle mentioned in the article, and guess what? Lance does (did) ride one on his TT bike.
That's enough for me, I'm going to spend the money I get from the sperm bank and buy me one.

I'd keep the TT bike and road bike conversations separate. Riding in the aero position for 112 miles continuously is quite different than 50 miles on a rolling course with store and coffee shop stops. I've not tried an ISM saddle for the road bike but it's a huge hit with triathletes, especially long course(full IM)