Road Rash!!! OT.

[William]

Well, I ended up with my first case of road rash for the season. It wasn't cycling related, but it's still ROAD RASH OK!!
I took my children to the local skate park. My son who is seven had been begging my to take him over there so he could try riding it. Ok, so I dig out my old Dog Town skate so I can show my kids ( & the locals) how us "Old Schoolers" can rip it up. Turns out we were the only ones there so that was helpful for working with C&A. After helping my kids for a while, dad decides to take a few runs of his own. Hey, I was doing pretty good, it was coming back to me. :banana: Pulled a few axle grinds on the artificial coping and pulled off a few one wheelers & tail taps. Then I lost it at the top and had to bail out. :eek: As my feet hit the ramp, one lands on the ramp, the other on my board (which is rolling down the ramp). Of course the board shoots out from underneath me and I'm flying...(in slo-mo)"hey, look at the blue sky, it's so prett"...GRUNCH!!! I open my eyes and see my son and daughter standing over me, "are you ok dad? Are you bleeding?" "I'm ok, that's why you need to wear your helmet & pads. You never know when you might crash" (Hey, I had to turn it into a positive lesson). I was fine except for some road rash on my calf & a sore back. I spent the rest of the time hobbling around and helping my youngsters with the basics of safe riding. Towards the end a teen shows up and joins us. He's giving me looks like I probably would have when I was his age watching a "grown up" ripping around on a board. :rolleyes: Too funny. :D

William

[Kevan]

is when it's stuck solid in the lawn. Damn thing terrifies me.

[Too Tall]

I want a long board.
Hey! Use triple ointment and keep scabs from forming.
Your kids must love you alot.

[Kevan]

are extremely cool looking, but can't get number 1 son interested at all. I'd get one, but then riding one on the livingroom carpet isn't really riding one at all, is it?

[William]

Thanks TT!

I made a Long Board out of a water ski (Tracker Trucks w/Red Kryptonics 70mm's) back in Jr. High. Some of us got into down hilling long before the X-games ever came along. We would "luge" downhill. I tried it as a way to eliminate the "wobbles" you can get on shorter boards. It worked great! I once did about 60 mph (at least that's what our friend said who was driving behind us in an old Mercury Cougar). No pads or safety gear at all...stupid, stupid, stupid :crap: but fun, fun, fun!!! :banana: I used to love riding that thing all around town.
I'd be curious to see what they are selling now days as a "Long Board".

William

[weisan]

William-my-man, you are the best dad. Your latest donation of skin to the road is to a worthy cause and an act of love. Blaze the trail for us, big guy....teach us some good O' family values.... ;)

[pale scotsman]

Ah, big Will the pale one bailed on a downhill Easter Sunday 2002 and lived to tell about it. Yep that's right we were visiting my parents and I just had to show my son my speed skills on a board set up for a 60lb kid.

Mannnn, I must have been doing about 20 when the speed wobbles set it. I just knew I could pull it out until I had to either step off and take my bumps, or the board decided when to pitch me on my face.... so I stepped off in the mid 20's hoping for the best. Step, bammmm, flip, thud, crack, flip, flip. When I cracked my head I was pissed because my son was watching and the wife had come to the front door and saw my final roll. When I got up off the street my son yelled down to me, " Dad are you all right?'" Followed immediately by, " Dang how many flips did you do? "

End result, a severe tongue lashing from the wife and parental units. Road rash on both knees, elbows, hip, and the top of my head. Oh, the pulled groin kinda hurt too. Man, I was stove up for 2 weeks. Lesson learned? My cat like reflexes are more sloth like and like Kevan said, the thing terrifies me!

[Too Tall]

Willyboy - The feller I raced tandem with two yrs. ago has two...very gucci long boards. One is more flexy than the other. He puts on a small backpack and cruises from home to the grocery. It has appeal.

[William]

Willyboy - The feller I raced tandem with two yrs. ago has two...very gucci long boards. One is more flexy than the other. He puts on a small backpack and cruises from home to the grocery. It has appeal.

Long board links:

http://www.silverfishlongboarding.com/reviews/categories.php?cat_id=1

http://www.silverfishlongboarding.com/reviews/categories.php?cat_id=207

Sunday, January 18 2004 @ 09:32 PM CST
Contributed by: MalakaiKingston
Views: 787

Buying you're first board can is a huge step. There are lots of decisions to make. This guide is meant to help the uninitiated understand what they should consider. There are many awesome products out there, and the aim is to give you the foundation for making a good decision. After all you want to start your collection of right.

Written by theguys at palermolongboards dot com

What is a longboard?

There's a lot of debate (really) and this is probably the broadest definition you'll find.... You might think Longboards are...well...longer, but there are plenty of `longboards' that are shorter than your average shortboard. A longboard is a combination of things. Probably the most telling components are the wheels. Longboard wheels are softer and bigger (60mm all the way to 145mm-see rolls rolls cruiser). The size makes them go faster, smoother, and roll over little obstacles easier. Softer wheels grip the road better and give a cushier ride (harder wheels are faster on very smooth surfaces like skateparks, but softer wheels tend to ride faster on rougher surfaces like roads, see wheels). Next, a longboard tends to have trucks that are wider and turn better than shortboards. And last most longboards are longer.

So let's consider what board length you want….

Your desired length should not determine too much which board you choose. There are more important decisions to make first that will narrow down the length choice. So let's split up board length into two factors, wheel base, and stance.

Wheel Base- Board length is closely tied to wheel base, which is the measurement from the back wheels to the front wheels, so wheel base depends on how long the board is and then where the trucks are mounted on the board. The length of your wheel base directly effects how tight you board will turn. The longer the wheel base the less tight (or larger turning radius) you'll be able to turn (your trucks are also a large factor in how tight your board turns). Besides making u-turns and being able to maneuver through obstacles, having a board that turns tight is important for downhill carving. When you are riding downhill (assuming you aren't sliding yet) the major way to keep yourself from going faster than you are comfortable is to carve out your speed by making S turns (like when you are snowboarding down a steep run). The tighter your board turns, the steeper the hill you can ride and still limit your speed. The only drawback of having a tighter turning radius is that your board becomes less stable once you do take it up to a high speed (More on this under `Trucks')

Stance- Beyond wheel base, you want to consider stance width and deck room. The longer the board the wider the stance you can sport. Your stance width is largely affected by your height. But once you get up to 42 inches or so, the board is pretty much wide enough for anyone's stance. Past 42 inches, and now you are talking about how much room there is to move around up there. Boards above 42 inches increasingly give you some room to play around, kind of like a surfboard.

Boards above 50 inches (see the 57" Ed Economy Bank Rider and Street Rider by Gravity) are pretty much used for either serious downhill speedboarding (remember: a long wheel base means more stability at high speed) or for people who want a really mellow board walk cruiser so they have a lot of room to move around, and a lot of stability so you can totally relax while "hanging ten" and checking out the scene.

A board that's really short (34 inches or less) means you are increasingly sacrificing some stance comfort for really tight turns (a smaller board is also easier to carry around and store). This is slalom board range. A really tight turning board can be very fun for tearing about as it'll be super responsive, and can let you carve REAL tight downhill. (Check out the Loaded Fish, Gravity GS, and Landyachtz lil'gaffer!).

...Alright so now you should have an idea of what range you wanna be in for length, or at least what to consider...Length is a characteristic of the overall deck shape. Here are a number of other factors to consider:

Deck Characteristics...

Concave/Flat/Convex - The vast majority of boards are either concave or flat. Concave means that when you are looking at your board head-on from the front at street level, the right and left edges of the deck curl up slightly so that it looks like a very subtle `U' shape. People that like concave will tell you that they get better grip on a concave board because it helps you "lock" your feet in while carving because the walls of the `U' help keep your feet from slipping off the deck. Also, concave helps gives you more carving leverage for quicker turns, because more of your weight is transferred to the outer edges of the board as you lean into a turn. Another benefit is that you can feel where the edges of your board are without having to look down. The only real draw back of concave is that it's a little harder to move your feet around on top of the board, so you might want flat for a big long board that you want to cruise and play on.. There are only a few convex (opposite of concave, rising up in the middles, down at the edges) decks I know of, one is the Carveboard Bubbler, the other is a turner slalom board.

Flat/Cambered/Rockered - Just as in surfboard terminology I use camber for a board that rises up in the middle so if you are looking at it from the side, with your eye at street level, it makes a slight arch. Rocker is the opposite, with a slight upside-down arch lengthwise (some people say 'concave' for rocker and 'convex' for cambered, but for clarity, I prefer to use those word only for describing the shape width wise). A board with rocker has a lower center of gravity (like a Barfoot) which is important for stability in a deep carve or transitions in and out of turns. A rockered board tends to feels like it's cradling you as you go in and out of turns as it sort of `swings' from side to side (see hammocks). Cambered boards tend to be the type that have more flex, and Flex is characteristic that deserves it own heading. So the only thing I will say here about camber is that it doesn't sag down as far as a flat board of equal flexibility because the deck starts from a higher point, and cambered boards tend to have more springback.

Flexibility - Flex is measured by the amount a board will 'give' when you put weight on it. There are boards that range from totally stiff and don't flex at all (a Tierney rides or Flowlab/Flowboard DCS is totally stiff), to boards that if you jump on, you can get the deck to touch the ground (Take a big bounce on one of the flexier Loaded Vanguard). Flex gives you a softer ride as it can absorb some of the impact when you go down a driveway lip or off a curb. It's also nice if you are jumping on and off your board a lot. A stiffer board is generally preferred for higher speeds as it tends to be more stable (at high speeds, you want to absorb any bumps in you knees, you don't want the board bouncing you up and down after going over a bump at 40mph+). Some people consider a stiff board more precisely controllable, because your feet and body movements are directly transferred to the trucks without being muted, exaggerated or distorted by the flex of the deck. However, an intelligently shaped deck that fits well with the trucks you are riding on can really increase the amount of precision and control in your ride (again, see the Loaded Vangaurds, Hammerhead DCS and Fish).

Springback or Quality of Flex - No no, you ain't the flex masta' yet my brotha'. Fo' Sho' you gots ta consida' the QUALITY of the flex...or Springback. Some boards have pretty dead flex. This means the deck doesn't rebound and push you back up as you un-weight the board a bit.

What do I mean `UNWEIGHT'? Damn glad you asked. Well if you are standing straight up on a scale and you quickly bring your legs up, you will weigh less as you begin to `fall' or move downwards. This is unweighting the board. Then when you start to slow your `fall' and then begin to stand up straight again, you will weigh more as you are pushing into the scale to slow down and then accelerate your body up. This is how you weight your board (seriously, go practice for a sec on a scale, especially if you have the old non-digital kind with a needle, practice moving up and own on the scale to make yourself weigh less and then more, so that you are controlling the needle and making it swing back and forth. This stuff is really important later when you learn to PUMP).

Cont......

[William]

A board with a high quality flex and a lot of spring back will store energy when you weight it and it flexes down, and then spring you back up when you unweight it a bit (by, for example, picking your legs up a little) . If you are doing some big hard pedaling (kicking off the ground with your food to gain speed), a deck with quality spring back will lower you closer to the ground as you weight the board going into a pedal, and then when you transfer weight to the foot pushing off the ground, thereby un-weighting the deck, it'll spring you back up. Most importantlythough, and most fun, a board with quality spring back or a high-rebound will spring you out of a turn and into the next one. When you are riding, you weigh more when you are in the middle. of a turn and the G force pushes you into the deck, and then as you come out of a turn, you can unweight the board and let the board spring you up. You can then use that upward momentum to fall back into the next turn, and tranferring energy back into your deck. Now we're talking about good times! Overall, even before you get this unweighting and weighting stuff down, and are bouncing in and out of turns, many people just find a flexy deck with good springback to be a lot `livelier' of a ride. (the first time I hopped on a Loaded Vanguard I literally felt like I was riding a live beastcompared to alot of other decks which felt either dead or asleep). Good springback is also important for Pumping, which is when you propel yourself forward without kicking, simply by throwing your weigh from side to side. Learning to pump is certainly a bit challenging, but you'll eventually want to do it (for a good how-to-Pump, click here) while it is possible to pump a totally stiff board, I personally find it more enjoyable on a board with good quality flex (however too much flex can sap your energy and slow you down) .

Materials- so what makes a board have "good quality flex"? Great question. Largely, the deck materials are responsible for the quality of flex. Your most basic board is made of simple plywood. When a piece of plywood is concave, it tends to have more rebound or springback... But to get some really good flex takes composite materials like fiberglass (Sector 9 Cosmic Rider series, FibreFlex, Flex Dex, Comet skateboards, Loaded, and Landyachtz are all example of composite boards that use some fiberglass) Boards with fiber glass are more expensive to make though, so you are looking at paying a bit more. A further improvement in flex seems to come with the use of vertically laminated wood cores (normal ply wood is horizontally laminated, as the layers, `plys, ' are laid one on top of the other, while vertically laminated means the plys are placed side by side in thin strips next to each other, so you can see the different `layers' when you are looking at the top or bottom like stripes going down the length) in conjunction with fiberglass, which is basis for the technology that Loaded Boards and Comet Skateboards use.

So you've got, length, wheelbase, and deck charactertistics (i.e. camber, concave, rocker, flex...) all figured out. Now its time to talk about deck shape.

Deck Shape...

O.K., if you understand this next stuff, you will understand the basic issue of skateboard design and consequently be able to look at a skateboard and really tell what's going on there. Skateboards started with roller skate trucks, which barely turned, they veered slightly to one side as you leaned, and were very very narrow. Then they started making trucks a bit wider so that you could make the boards wider than a water-ski without the thing tipping over. But the trucks still couldn't get you around a corner, and in order to make a fast turn, you had to kick the back of the board up. This describes your average eighties board and your 90's new school shortboard. But if you really want to simulate surfing (and snowboarding) and don't care so much about tricks, but rather for the feel of the ride, then you got to make trucks that really turn, so you can carve hard and lean into it. Now the problem is, if your trucks turn a lot, and you are riding larger wheels, that means the wheels are gonna hit the deck as you turn hard, which is called `wheel-bite, ' and immediately causes the board to stop in its tracks while you get a face full of street. Longboard design is largely centered on how to deal with this problem: how do you make a board that turns well but doesn't get wheel bite? And each board has its own strategy. Most of the boards being sold today (Sector Nine, Gravity Boards (most), Dregs, Vision Skateboards, Fluid Longboards) use a two or three pronged strategy….

TRUCKS...

…1. They use trucks like Tracker B-2's or the Sector Nine `Pivot Trucks', which don't turn very tight, and 2. they mount the trucks on the board with a riser so that the deck is raised up a bit which affords the deck more clearance over the wheels, and 3. sometimes, the deck is shaped so that at the point where the wheel might hit the board in a turn, the deck is narrower or there is a piece cutout. Notice how a Gravity HyperCarve has little half-moons cut out above the wheels (called wheel cutouts) in the front, and the deck gets narrow above the back wheels. Or picture the classic longboard shape, a Pintail. The front trucks are mounted way up on the nose where the board is still thin and way back on the tail where it gets thin again. The drawback of using a combination of these approaches is that you end up with not-so-turny trucks, and when you use a riser, you are making the board less stable than it could be as you raise the center of gravity. Another strategy is to make the deck shape so narrow above the front and back truck that you can use really carvy trucks with no riser, and you still don't get wheel bite. I'm talking of course about a Loaded Vanguard, and that explains why the board is totally cut away at the back and front ends, so it can use the Randal R-2's which turn a lot sharper than your Pivot truck or Tracker B-2. Another option is to use REALLY wide trucks like Independent 215s which stick out past the deck. (what you want to know about truck width is that the wider the truck, the more stable the ride but the slower the trucks will react in a turn). And yet another strategy is to make trucks that turn sharp and quick, but have a built in turn stopper to stop the truck before the wheels hit the deck, like the Exkate and Baku torsion trucks (Bakus only come on Barfoot and Hobie completes).

So let's review the 5 strategies for preventing wheel bite, so the next time you look at a board you can tell which ones it uses:

® trucks that don't turn very sharp

® riser pads that raise the deck up higher for more clearance

® deck shaping that gets narrower or is cutaway above the wheels

® wide trucks that extend past the edge of the deck.

® trucks that are set to not turn past a certain point like torsion trucks.

Other deck shape features... The wider the board is where you put your feet, the more turning leverage you will get. Also a few decks like the Loaded Vanguard have rounded-stand pads for multi-directional leverage that help you control the board by pushing on it from different directions. And of course you know what a kicktail is, and what it's for, and some board like the Gravity Concave Maple Series have a `nose tail' too. Then some decks like the Barfoot NoseRiders are built with a wide spot to stand on in front for some Longboard surf-style stuff.

Finally, you want to think about wheels. Most completes come with wheels attached, and most skate shops, don't stock enough components and decks to let you custom build a board. But if you order online, you can choose wheels from a big selection. So take a look at the Wheels section for a comprehensive explanation of longboard wheels, that way if you are buying a complete, you'll know what your wheels are good for, and if you are having a custom board built, you'll get a better idea of which wheels to pick.

If you have any questions or want some help in figuring out which deck is right for you, feel free to email theguys@palermolongboards.com.

[William]

Weisan-pal,
being a good role model can be painful....but I shall roll on. :banana:


Pale one,
I feel your pain.....really I have. Glad you didn't get more banged up. And i'll bet your son has told that story to his friends many a time. ;)


William

[Kevan]

but I still ain't gonna buy one. Especially now after Pale confirmed my opinion.

[William]

but I still ain't gonna buy one. Especially now after Pale confirmed my opinion.

Yes, but see, if he had a Loooooong Board he wouldn't have had the wobbles and hence, wouldn't have had to bail off.

You can do it! :banana:

William ;)

[William]

Oh, the sun, the warmth, the gentle breeze with the slight smell of spring blowing across my face. I feel the gentle impulse to get out my longboard and carve down the road again. Turn around and pump all the way back up until my quads feel like they are going to explode….then carve my way back down again. On top of that my kids are whispering about the skate park again…. Lets pad up kiddies and head out…Time to roll again.

Oh, the sun, the warmth, the gentle breeze with the slight smell of spring blowing across my face.



William :)

[soulspinner]

This thread is worthless without pics! :)

[katematt]

Priceless thread. Can't tell you how many times old schooler comes out when I jump on a board. The sims pure juice and powell are long gone, but I seem to do just fine on the new school boards. Tic tac's don't seem to get the same reaction as a well laid 360 or above.

My wife cringes when I hit the ramp, although I have not been able to equal the one wheeler of old, which is probably why I have escaped rash to this point.

William you inspire me to get higher. Safe healing.

Did buy a long board for my son for christmas, disguised for him, as I am certainly enjoying. She wouldn't let me buy two.

[chuckred]

Thanks TT!

I made a Long Board out of a water ski (Tracker Trucks w/Red Kryptonics 70mm's) back in Jr. High. Some of us got into down hilling long before the X-games ever came along. We would "luge" downhill. I tried it as a way to eliminate the "wobbles" you can get on shorter boards. It worked great! I once did about 60 mph (at least that's what our friend said who was driving behind us in an old Mercury Cougar). No pads or safety gear at all...stupid, stupid, stupid :crap: but fun, fun, fun!!! :banana: I used to love riding that thing all around town.
I'd be curious to see what they are selling now days as a "Long Board".

William

Sounds like my daze of growing up as well... I see these guys on the weekends (here's a half second where you can see me riding up as they fly by on the way down). They scare the hell out of me when they cross the yellow line on blind corners (as I've had many a near miss on the bike without even being close to the yellow line).

Lookout Mountain Colorado Longboarders (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rclwiblJ7wE)

[Keith A]

Hey William -- I've been getting into longboarding lately and am having a blast with my youngest daughter. I have a long history of skateboarding and used to ride ditches and ramps while I was in college and farther from the beach. Unfortunately, this history including destroying my knee when I bailed at the bottom of a ramp...severed ACL and meniscus damage on both sides...ouch.

My daughter started out riding a shortboard, but she decided that longboarding was more fun. She's riding a Gravity Mini-Carve and I have a Hyper-Carve, Mini-Carve and a S9 Super Cruiser and just picked up G&S FibreFlex. We don't have any hills around here, but when we visit my mom we bring our boards and have a good time bombing the hills.

I still get out my shortboards every now and then, but longboarding is just so much fun.

[Keith A]

Here's a couple of pictures of us on our warm up hill...

[Keith A]

William -- So what kind of LB are you riding? Lately I've been interested in trying one of the drop through style boards...maybe the Gravity Kalai.

http://www.gravityboard.com/support/gstore/boards/dc41_b.jpg

[Ahneida Ride]

William

did the board have ceramic bearings ?... that was the problem :banana:

glad you are ok ....

[William]

Keith, great photos!

I like the drop through. :cool: A while back I picked up a Gravity Ed Economy 55".

http://ridingcloud9.com/images/decks/GravityEdEconomy55.JPG


I'm sure you remember Ed Economy from the old Sims team.

I keep my eye on the local Craigslist for good deals on longboards that pop up from time to time. I also have trucks and wheels lying around and thought about picking up an Eastbilt LB. I've heard some good things about them plus I can use my design skills to good use on graphics.

http://eastbilt.com/long_old_school.htm



William


PS: Has anyone ever ridden one of these Landyachtz? If yes, thoughts?

[William]

KM: My son has a new school board and it's alright except I can't stand the little hard wheels on it. He seems to like it but I prefer the feel of softer 70 mm wheels. Plus my tub of an old school board doesn't lend itself to the hops onto metal rails and stuff. Funny though, when I do tic-tacs and get myself flying I get a lot of looks from the younger crowd.

CR: Watching that vid, I found about half way through it I had a big stupid grin on my face. The thrill of tucking, building speed, and carving out the corners started coming back. Not sure I would bomb as fast as I used to but I would certainly consider doing it again. Thanks for the link.





William

[Keith A]

William -- I'm sure you already know about the Silverfish longboarding forum. It's great for reading about different gear and I know the Landyachtz comes up often. The Ed Economy looks like a great board and have ready many positive reviews about it.

The downhilling stuff looks like a blast...but I would certainly want to have the right equipment. I have a good friend who just lost a roommate due to a crashing going downhill. He wasn't even going that fast, but he didn't have a helmet and his head smacked the pavement and that was the end....very sad.

[William]

William -- I'm sure you already know about the Silverfish longboarding forum. It's great for reading about different gear and I know the Landyachtz comes up often. The Ed Economy looks like a great board and have ready many positive reviews about it.

The downhilling stuff looks like a blast...but I would certainly want to have the right equipment. I have a good friend who just lost a roommate due to a crashing going downhill. He wasn't even going that fast, but he didn't have a helmet and his head smacked the pavement and that was the end....very sad.



Not another forum!! :crap: ;)

In days past I never wore any safety gear of any kind. These days a minimum of helmet and good gloves is required.


William