Looking for saddle suggestions (again)

[rice rocket]

I'm on an endless quest for comfort it seems, but here's how it's gone down so far.

Fizik Aliante Carbon/Gamma/Sport (134mm wide) for ~1500mi - had them all, good for a while, and then the saddle softened and cut circulation off
Fizik Arione CX (130mm wide) for ~100mi - felt good in the drops, felt my sitbones IMMEDIATELY if I sat upright (too flat perhaps?)
Fizik Arione (130mm wide) for ~10mi - too soft, soft tissue was gettin' crushed because the saddle didn't support my sitbones enough
Fizik Antares (140mm wide) for ~20mi - same feeling as the Arione CX
Prologo Scratch (134mm wide) for ~100mi - liked the stiffness (no loss of circulation), shape good for ~20mi

I had a Selle Italia SLR in the past too, but I remember not liking it past 10 miles (although I forget why). I think the Aliante worked for a while because it was so padded that it masked poor fit, until my body sank into it and pinched off my circulation.

So my thoughts are this...I either need a narrower flat saddle (<130mm wide), or a saddle ~130mm that's more curved. Any ideas? I'm not opposed to carbon shell saddles either, given my bad experience w/ heavily padded saddles.

Thanks.

[Chousen One]

Specialized Toupe or Romin might be a good fit for ya, available in varying widths to suit your anatomy

[false_Aest]

You NEED THIS! (http://www.amazon.com/Boppy-Total-Body-Pillow-Neutral/dp/B003UTUEOU)


or...

try a gel toupe.

[Louis]

To find out what width works for you (how's that for alliteration :p ) there are at least two options:

1) Go to a Specialized dealer who has one of those ass-o-meter devices to sit on and see what they recommend based on that.

2) Take a clean, flat piece of white paper and put it on the carpet then sit on it while wearing only your BVDs. Get up and examine the paper closely. You should be able to see two divots from your sit bones. (holding the paper at an angle to the light often helps) Based on the distance see what saddle seems most likely to put your sit bones in a comfy area on the back of the saddle.

Good Luck

[eddief]

i know your variables are different...and i'd been on a quest to find a plastic alternative to the brooks b17. i like the b17 a lot, but on my carbon bike and my travel bike the leather thing was ok but i wanted something lighter and weather resistant. finally found that both the wtb rocket and pure were surprisingly to my butt's liking. not 100% convinced yet, but pretty close.

funny thing was when i saw the saddles displayed at rei or in my local shop, i could not imagine that the curves of what i saw would ever be right for my own curves. but tried wtb anyway and maybe found it. also all wtb saddles look a little funny to me, but now i say who cares?

[benb]

If you're having this much trouble definitely put some consideration into whether or not you're running the saddle too high. I did this million saddle thing about 4 years ago and it turned out I just got a bad fit.

[Climb01742]

try a cobb saddle. it ended my years-old search for comfort.

[rice rocket]

I've been back to the fitter twice, updating between a few of those saddles, so I think my fit is pretty spot on. I measured the saddle-to-rails height before putting each of them on, and they're pretty close to each other, with the Arione CX being a little shorter than the rest but also a stiffer foam.

Those Cobb saddles look goofy, I'll consider it a last resort. ;)


So the Toupe looks like its the flatter saddle and the Romin looks like it's the wavier? Is that right? Looks like the 130mm Romin might be worth a try. I tried to find the local Specialized dealer w/ the ass-o-meter, but I refuse to walk into their shop due to past experiences. :rolleyes:

[1happygirl]

http://cobbcycling.com/

this cobb?

[1centaur]

It may not be helpful, but I'm wary of the short distances ridden before deciding a saddle was wrong. Most saddles are very sensitive to angle in delivering their comfort zone. I think some miles at .2-degree increments are necessary before deciding a saddle just won't work. Also, some saddles don't work well with some chamois. The right combo of hardness in one and softness in another can make all the difference. Some people think they love a saddle because the chamois they used worked great with that saddle.

If you have a bunch of those saddles you tried still around, I'd try the angle thing and I don't discount the height thing entirely either. I think it's rare to buy a saddle, hop on, and declare it perfect 40 miles later. If you get close on the maiden voyage, work with it, and if you have no alternatives on a given day, try variations of it. There's a reason there are not infinite saddle widths on the market.

[rice rocket]

I found this floating around on the internet, I'll try my own ass measuring later today. ;)

http://i.imgur.com/8iU04.png



Nevermind, I just measured. 90mm. Eek. Looks like I'm going narrow.

[Climb01742]

Those Cobb saddles look goofy, I'll consider it a last resort. ;)

i hear you and i thought exactly the same thing. it does look goofy. but which do you want? a cool looking saddle that you can't ride or a saddle that i've never felt a single twinge on for over a 1000 miles now, and that i can't see 'cause i'm sitting on it? cool or comfort, your choice. ;)

[Climb01742]

http://cobbcycling.com/

this cobb?

yep. goofy site but if anyone knows his shiite, it's john cobb. call him and talk to either john or his wife. they're the real deal.

[Fixed]

turbo is back i saw them in white and black 50 dollars i like them
cheers

[DRZRM]

If you like the Prologo Scratch for short distances maybe the ProLogo Nago Evo saddle would work. Aaaaand, as it turns out, I bought both a white one and a black one on sale to see if they worked for me (if the white one did for my road bike, then I wanted a black one for my cross bike, I'm a big believer in buying the same saddle for multiple bikes). I'd let them both go for $130, or if you want to try out one...call it $75?

PM me if you are interested. Black is new in box, white was mounted and sized and ridden on the rollers once, but never outside.

Link to same saddle (http://www.bikesomewhere.com/bikesomewhere.cfm/product/615/5751/38945?g=1)

[rugbysecondrow]

Squats and lunges. Build up some good ol'fashion cushioning back there and the saddles will feel better.

With that said, mysuggestion would have been the standard arione or b17, both of which work for me.

[ahumblecycler]

Hey RR, we should chit chat on the phone in the near future. It looks like my list of saddles is quite a bit longer than yours, and I picked up a few things along the way that may be helpful. If you are interested, PM your phone number and we will chat soon.

FYI, I continue to go back to my Antares Versus. It is not the best saddle, but it is the only saddle I have found to be pretty good everywhere. I am a nose rider, and I like how the cut out extends all the way to the nose. The cut out (not really a cut out in the tradition sense) also extends all the way back, which alleviates some tail rise. I prefer a flatter saddle, and therefore, appreciate the less wave in the rear. Check my pics on my CAAD10; I am running pretty good saddle-bar drop and I do ride 50% or more in my drops.

[palincss]

And meanwhile, I'm in my 19th year, going on 20, with the Brooks Team Pro on my Spectrum Ti. It's still doing fine. The B.17 on my touring bike has been in service since around 2000. I had to adjust the tension a couple of times last year; it's still doing fine. Several other B.17s with over 10,000 miles of service on the other bikes, and they're all fine too. Later this year I'm going to try a Gilles Berthoud touring model, but if that doesn't work out I have a new Team Pro and a new B.17 on the shelf in boxes.

It's nice to not be on the 'saddle merry-go-round.' I spent enough time doing that back in the 1970s.

[dekindy]

Unclear regarding what is wrong with the Scratch?

I am a multi-year Aliante user that did not find anything even remotely tolerable until the 134mm Scratch. The Scratch has been good up to 30 miles and plan to try it on longer rides ASAP.

Maybe you need to fiddle with the Scratch adjustment more before giving up on it?

I find the Scratch at least so far to be firm in the very back (good thing), flatter so that I can move around easily but still "hammocky enough" because I cannot tolerate flat saddles well, and softer up front when I get on the rivet (also a good thing).

[Elefantino]

Shoot a PM to SoCalSteve. He has made a career of The Great Saddle Search!

[oliver1850]

.

[Kontact]

I'd appreciate you taking a look at my Kontact website. I've resurrected Joshua Cohen's lab tested design by buying the rights to produce them, and will have saddles available in May.

I personally own 4 of the previous incarnation and think that the leg cut-out design is the best possible way of getting your sit bones where they need to be without having to put pressure on any soft tissues.

Thanks!

[cdn_bacon]

Romin.

If you are a 143 (sitbone width) get the 155 Romin. Test ride that saddle (my lbs had one) rode for an hour felt nothing but my legs. if you get the cradle at just the right part this seat is rediculously comfy. The least expensive Expert has gel. If you don't care about a few grams its comfy.

Toupe is too flat.

http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bc/SBCEqProduct.jsp?spid=47281

have a gander. might do the trick.

[rice rocket]

cdn_bacon: That's my plan for tomorrow!

I read about the width issues as well, we'll see what happens. I called the shop on Sunday and had them order me up a 130mm to test along w/ a 143mm, hopefully they'll let me just do a back-to-back ride around the block.

I'm on a 130mm wide Arione CX right now, and I feel sit bones are being punished when I'm on the hoods. I'm fine in the drops where I am 70% of the time, but I climb on the hoods. If the 130mm flat-n-wide Arione is too wide, I'm hesitant to go to the wider 143mm version. Guess we'll have to see.

dekindy: I'm not sure exactly what felt wrong, I sold it mostly because I wanted to keep on my quest. :p It was also the wrong color. It is on my list of saddles to revisit if this foray into Specialized saddles turns up dry.

oliver: I'm hesistant to try plush saddles again after the Aliantes. Too much numbness and pinching off oxygen supply to the legs.

[bumknees]

I was having saddle issues last summer after my rear suddenly decided that my Specialized BG Pro saddle wasn't right for me anymore. I tried a Brooks Swallow that I slightly used, and now it's been the only thing I can ride for anything more than 50 miles.

[cdn_bacon]

You just have to make sure that dip in the middle is level with the ground. Took a lot of fidgeting with it but now it's perfect (for me at least)

best of luck :)

[Ken Robb]

Squats and lunges. Build up some good ol'fashion cushioning back there and the saddles will feel better.

With that said, mysuggestion would have been the standard arione or b17, both of which work for me.

Those are my favorites also and who would guess that two saddles that are so different would both work for the same riders. :banana: :beer:

[BrownBear]

Those are my favorites also and who would guess that two saddles that are so different would both work for the same riders. :banana: :beer:

Keep in mind that Arione's break over time. I love mine until i started to go numb then I realized it cracked in the middle. No exterior damage, but a slight dip in the middle that gave it away.

[Germany_chris]

Only brooks for me...

[BrownBear]

Only brooks for me...

Im stuck between brooks and a san macro regal

[veloduffer]

Take a look at the Ritchey saddles, which have a very classic shape. They have different levels of padding for the same shape as well. Similar to the old Vetta SP/SL saddles.

I also like the Bontrager Evoke saddles, which are similar to Arione but better IMHO (cheaper too).

[Bauch]

Get a Belgian sofa, i.e., the Selle San Marco Regal. I have tried a number of different saddles, from the Selle Italia Flite to the San Marco Rolls, and the Regal turns out to be the most comfy for me.

[Geeeewiz]

Hey Rice Rocket

As mentioned go to a LBS that has one of those "ass-o-meters" to determine you width. I have to recommend the Bontrager Affinity Line. They are new this year and absolutely the best saddle I have sat on. Do yourself a fav and give one a try.

Good luck...

[desalvo]

as someone else mentioned, you should spend some time tweaking each one for more than a handful of miles before you give up on them. saddle height, tilt, & fore/aft changes, even slight, can make a noticeable difference depending on their shape.

saddle comfort is a very personal thing, but since you asked ...

i agree with you on the arione. great 1st impression; comfort got worse the more miles i put on it. my current favorite 'keeper' is the prologo scratch ti. felt a little weird at first since it was different than the other 2 cut-out saddles i'd been using, but now i don't even notice it. 50-60+ miles, not problem.

although they're pricey ... make that very pricey ... you may want to try one of the selle smp models. i had a pro a while back, which was one of their wider (~145-ish mm) models. they have narrower models, as well. numbness never entered the picture.

one final note; you mentioned feeling your sitbones. on the selle smp & the toupe gel (which i also like, and still have on one of my bikes), you will feel your sitbones for a while since a lot of riders aren't used to sitting on them. that bothersome feeling goes away over time as your sit region adjusts (at least it did for me). the selle smp is more of a 'hammocked' shape; the nack & toupe flatter, the arione maybe the flattest of the bunch.

[Pyramor]

I measured the sit bone indentations in my Brooks B-17. Measured 140mm, then went to a Specialized dealer and used the ass-o-meter. Surprise, also 140. Bought a 155 Romin as recommended since I am on the hoods most of the time.
Still getting the positioning right, but it is the best I've used on over 3 hour rides. Also tried the Toupe in 155mm but isn't as comfy.

[Ti Designs]

As mentioned go to a LBS that has one of those "ass-o-meters" to determine you width.

Such blind faith in a measuring device known as the ass-o-meter. My shop has all kinds of these things, I even duct taped two of them together for tandem owners, I call it the double butted ass-o-meter. I just can't see ever measuring my own ass on one of them - what would I hope to learn?

I break saddles into two categories, those that support the rider from the sit bones and those that hold the rider from moving back. As examples I'll use the Toupe and the Aliente. The Toupe has a flat and flexible area on back to support the rider's sit bones. If you happen to sit this way on a saddle, perhaps the ass-o-meter would help. I would still go by feel 'cause those measurements are total BS. If you slide back on the saddle the Toupe will feel like a razor blade on the sides. The Aliente has no flat area on back, but it has a lot of surface area on the sides. If you're going to be comfortable on the Aliente or something like it, skip the part about measuring your bottom...

[rpm]

I break saddles into two categories, those that support the rider from the sit bones and those that hold the rider from moving back.

I agree. I think of it as the difference between a flat saddle and a curved saddle. Figure out which one of those categories better fits you. I'm definitely a curved saddle person, so I like the Aliante, Regal, Turbo, and Prologo Scratch. All the flat saddles lke the the Arisone, SLR and the like don't work for me.

Fizik relates saddle preferences to flexibility. I'm a "bull" with a less flexible spine and they recommend the Aliante, which is indeed my favorite saddle. If you have a lot of flexibility, you're a "snake" and they recommend the Arione. Typical of European sports websites they explain the concept with a dopey video, complete with techno music:

http://www.fizik.it/spineconcept/#/how-it-works.html

[JohnHemlock]

Is it weird that I can ride pretty much any saddle for hundreds of miles with zero discomfort? I read these threads and I think maybe something is wrong with my taint.

[slowandsteady]

i hear you and i thought exactly the same thing. it does look goofy. but which do you want? a cool looking saddle that you can't ride or a saddle that i've never felt a single twinge on for over a 1000 miles now, and that i can't see 'cause i'm sitting on it? cool or comfort, your choice. ;)

+100

I must (ashamedly) admit that I go through this same dilemma...I WANT a go fast, speedy, race ready, aero wheeled, hot looking bike that exudes speed and coolness. After all i grew up racing and touring so i deserve one, right?!?!?!

But then I realize I am a 48 yr old, single full time father and business owner, with a heart condition, an 8yr old daughter, a dog, a cat and a fish (and little time to train)!!! If I keep this in mind when I look at my bike the B17 looks damn comfy :beer:

[SoCalSteve]

try a cobb saddle. it ended my years-old search for comfort.

What do Cobb salads have to do with cycling?... :confused:

Oh wait, I think I need reading glasses!... :rolleyes:

[jpw]

What's your waist band size and leg inseam length?

What cycling shorts are you using? What's the insert like?

[rice rocket]

I agree. I think of it as the difference between a flat saddle and a curved saddle. Figure out which one of those categories better fits you. I'm definitely a curved saddle person, so I like the Aliante, Regal, Turbo, and Prologo Scratch. All the flat saddles lke the the Arisone, SLR and the like don't work for me.

Fizik relates saddle preferences to flexibility. I'm a "bull" with a less flexible spine and they recommend the Aliante, which is indeed my favorite saddle. If you have a lot of flexibility, you're a "snake" and they recommend the Arione. Typical of European sports websites they explain the concept with a dopey video, complete with techno music:

http://www.fizik.it/spineconcept/#/how-it-works.html

The Fizik philosophy makes sense to some degree. I was "comfortable" in all the recommended positions in each saddle. Problem is, you have to stick to those positions and sometimes, it just doesn't work out. On the Arione CX, while I am flexible enough to roll my hips forward and ride all day in the drops, I still sit upright on long climbs. Just because I can be flexible doesn't mean I want to be restricted to that position. The Antares was almost identical to the Arione CX, I didn't feel that much comfort atop a flat board. On the Aliante, the upright position worked as advertised, until padding seemed to soften over time and pinch off blood flow. It also had more perineal pressure in the drops that I learned to live with, but am finally liberated from w/ my new Romin.

I haven't tried their Gobi, Ares, Tundra, etc...

[rice rocket]

I felt okay on the Prologo Scratch Pro, but could still feel some perineal pressure in the drops, and my sitbones when I sat upright to climb.

I think I finally found it though. I pushed through 3 days of riding (and 100 miles or so), and by the 3rd day, I couldn't tell it was there (although the 3rd day was the shortest of the 3 rides, and I got my new pair of Giordana Forma bibs too. I changed too many variables at once!).

Specialized Romin Expert (yeah, I got it so I could be called an expert ;) ). It's listed this year as having the same padding as the Pro, just w/o the carbon rails. The Romin Comp Gel is listed as softer, which may go on my commuter bike in the future. It is a "sit bone" saddle, it has a large channel and moves the pressure from your perineal arteries to your sit bones. I initially felt the most pressure there. However, I'm about 3 days and 100 miles into the saddle, and now it has all but disappeared under me. I went w/ the 130mm width (sitbones measured 90mm wide) as per the Specialized ass-o-meter, and it's been spot on. Some people around the internet say size up on the Romin, but I'm more than pleased right now w/ the mfg recommended size. Maybe there's even more comfort to be had?!

Guy at the LBS told me that I should make the middle part of it level which promotes you to roll your hips forward and use the drops more, but I already have the flexibility to do that and don't need it to "help me" get there. It also shortened up my reach some, and I'm already maxing out the rails. I had more luck with making it level at the nose and tail. Cradles me well when I'm on the hoods or top, and the cutout is great for when I'm in the drops.

Thank you all for the input and great suggestions, you've saved me a lot of pain and money! :hello:

[dekindy]

I felt okay on the Prologo Scratch Pro, but could still feel some perineal pressure in the drops, and my sitbones when I sat upright to climb.

I think I finally found it though. I pushed through 3 days of riding (and 100 miles or so), and by the 3rd day, I couldn't tell it was there (although the 3rd day was the shortest of the 3 rides, and I got my new pair of Giordana Forma bibs too. I changed too many variables at once!).

Specialized Romin Expert (yeah, I got it so I could be called an expert ;) ). It's listed this year as having the same padding as the Pro, just w/o the carbon rails. The Romin Comp Gel is listed as softer, which may go on my commuter bike in the future. It is a "sit bone" saddle, it has a large channel and moves the pressure from your perineal arteries to your sit bones. I initially felt the most pressure there. However, I'm about 3 days and 100 miles into the saddle, and now it has all but disappeared under me. I went w/ the 130mm width (sitbones measured 90mm wide) as per the Specialized ass-o-meter, and it's been spot on. Some people around the internet say size up on the Romin, but I'm more than pleased right now w/ the mfg recommended size. Maybe there's even more comfort to be had?!

Guy at the LBS told me that I should make the middle part of it level which promotes you to roll your hips forward and use the drops more, but I already have the flexibility to do that and don't need it to "help me" get there. It also shortened up my reach some, and I'm already maxing out the rails. I had more luck with making it level at the nose and tail. Cradles me well when I'm on the hoods or top, and the cutout is great for when I'm in the drops.

Thank you all for the input and great suggestions, you've saved me a lot of pain and money! :hello:

If I am reading this correctly you liked the Scratch Pro very well and I am not sure what the key to the Romin was that made you select it over the Scratch Pro. Maybe I need to test the Romin? Disregard my question on the other thread since you are aanswering it here. Thanks.

[rice rocket]

The Romin is a different saddle philosophy than the Scratch Pro. Rather than attempting to distribute your weight evenly over the whole saddle, it puts your weight over your sitbones. However, since it's a waved saddle as well, it works in a variety of positions, whether you ride in the drops, tops, hoods, etc. The huge channel down the center ensures that you'll have blood flow to dekindy Junior at all times.

You WILL feel it for the first 75-100 miles, but my butt adjusted well after then and now I don't feel any but clouds under my bum. There really is no discomfort at all, in any position.

[cdn_bacon]

Score 1 for bacon :)

I love my Romin.

[dekindy]

The Romin is a different saddle philosophy than the Scratch Pro. Rather than attempting to distribute your weight evenly over the whole saddle, it puts your weight over your sitbones. However, since it's a waved saddle as well, it works in a variety of positions, whether you ride in the drops, tops, hoods, etc. The huge channel down the center ensures that you'll have blood flow to dekindy Junior at all times.

You WILL feel it for the first 75-100 miles, but my butt adjusted well after then and now I don't feel any but clouds under my bum. There really is no discomfort at all, in any position.

Yikes, that sounds good. However I think I will wait for a long ride on the Scratch Pro before making a change. Like I said, the Romin felt good enough on the trainer to be worthwhile to try on the road this Spring until I found the Scratch Pro that is.