Standard older FD with campy compact?

[tfunkin]

I'm doing an alloy Campy build right now and I'm realizing I'd like to use the older-style front derailleurs with the nice cages, but it's not incredibly easy to find compact-specific FDs in a year, trim level and price combo that works for me; what are the pitfalls of using a regular FD with a compact crankset? Am I going to be dropping my chain constantly?

Thanks guys,
tfunkin

(First thread, woo)

[John M]

I use regular FD with compact cranksets (FSA SLK) and campy shifters (10s)--works fine for me.

[wasfast]

Actually, you don't want a "compact specific" in my experience. The standard FD works fine. I have both a older steel chorus and carbon record standard FD on 2 different bikes. Note that Campy now only offers 1 model FD. Shifting is just fine as well.

I did try the "compact" version a few years ago. The width of the cage, when viewed from the top, is narrower than a standard which meant endless trimming.

[tfunkin]

Well, great! That makes my life a lot easier. Thanks! I'll try to ask a harder question next time.

[oldpotatoe]

I'm doing an alloy Campy build right now and I'm realizing I'd like to use the older-style front derailleurs with the nice cages, but it's not incredibly easy to find compact-specific FDs in a year, trim level and price combo that works for me; what are the pitfalls of using a regular FD with a compact crankset? Am I going to be dropping my chain constantly?

Thanks guys,
tfunkin

(First thread, woo)

No pitfalls and no if adjusted well. Remember compact cranks via FSA were around before compact Fders and after 2008, Campagnolo didn't have compact specific Fders anywho. Just use any FD for a double.

[oliver1850]

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[mpetry]

The lower cage is for the compact crank with 15 or more difference between the small and large. The other cages are for the older 39/52 non compact rings.

To answer the original poster's question, yes, any of these derailleurs will shift a compact just fine - I've used them all. If by "older campagnolo derailleur" you mean one like this

http://www.petry.org/pics/NRfrontder.jpg

it will shift a compact (34/50) just fine, but if you want to use Ergo levers I think you'll be disapponted with how it performs.

Mark Petry
Bainbridge Island, WA

[tfunkin]

Heh, I didn't mean quite that old. I was more thinking about the standard FDs from the era when there were compact FDs to be had.

http://www.petry.org/pics/NRfrontder.jpg

it will shift a compact (34/50) just fine, but if you want to use Ergo levers I think you'll be disapponted with how it performs.

[mpetry]

haha. Well, in that case, any of them should work fine. A little trick - if you have a Campy FD that fits your bike that has the "wrong" cage - they are all interchangeable, at least within the last 10 years. Any clamp-on diameter, or braze on, the cages can be interchanged.

This is important when you've got a Serotta with the 35mm seat tube and you can't find the configuration you want.

Mark Petry
Bainbridge Island, WA

[oliver1850]

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[handsomerob]

haha. Well, in that case, any of them should work fine. A little trick - if you have a Campy FD that fits your bike that has the "wrong" cage - they are all interchangeable, at least within the last 10 years. Any clamp-on diameter, or braze on, the cages can be interchanged.

This is important when you've got a Serotta with the 35mm seat tube and you can't find the configuration you want.

Mark Petry
Bainbridge Island, WA

I think you are almost right... ;)

IIRC...The last few incarnations (maybe the last 3 years or so) aren't swappable. The Veloce and lower used to have that C-ring part that snaps off the notch in the post that allows you to swap the clamp/braze-on and snap it back in place. or even easier... on Centaur (maybe Chorus) and above it has that allen head screw.

I don't have any QS (quick shift) FD's right now.. or else I would check how the parts are attached to each other... so if someone wants to make sure I am not delusional that would be appreciated.

[oliver1850]

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[Ralph]

I have a 2010 Centaur to go with some 2010 Centaur Ultra shifters, that is not the same as the mid 2000's and older FD's. It will not separate from the clamp part. I also think it works better with new shifters than older FD.

But all my others will. As noted. Recent Record Triple FD, 2 Centaurs, Racing T FD, etc.

[oldpotatoe]

I think you are almost right... ;)

IIRC...The last few incarnations (maybe the last 3 years or so) aren't swappable. The Veloce and lower used to have that C-ring part that snaps off the notch in the post that allows you to swap the clamp/braze-on and snap it back in place. or even easier... on Centaur (maybe Chorus) and above it has that allen head screw.

I don't have any QS (quick shift) FD's right now.. or else I would check how the parts are attached to each other... so if someone wants to make sure I am not delusional that would be appreciated.

Non swappable started in 2008 along with one FD for compact or standard cranks. What was swappable was the clamp type//braze->31.8->34.9. Alas Campagnolo thinks that nobody makes steel frames anymore..no 28.6 clampon altho 2-3 makers of 28.6 FD clamps for brazeons..I only buy brazeon Fders, helps with invemtory.

[tfunkin]

Non swappable started in 2008 along with one FD for compact or standard cranks. What was swappable was the clamp type//braze->31.8->34.9. Alas Campagnolo thinks that nobody makes steel frames anymore..no 28.6 clampon altho 2-3 makers of 28.6 FD clamps for brazeons..I only buy brazeon Fders, helps with invemtory.

It seems like a lot of people use shims with 31.8 clamps... is there a reason besides ugliness/hackiness not to do that?

[wasfast]

Did Campy come up with the compact FD just so they could sell one to people that were swapping from a std. crank? Seems a lot of extra tooling and inventory if there was no actual advantage. I didn't realize the cage was narrower. At least Campy front shifters allow you to trim.

The introduction of the STD/CT cage style would seem to indicate that there is some advantage in shifting a compact with them over the earlier std. cage. They sure aren't much in the looks dept. though.

Logically I agree, extra design/tooling/SKU's. It also seems the longer inside plate should help control dropping the chain inside the small ring. In practice doesn't work that way. I will say that compacts are more prone to dropping the chain. Having a chain watcher is a good idea, if nothing more than insurance.

[Ralph]

I use a plastic shim under the FD on a steel bike, and you don't see it unless you look real close. I use it on purpose. I have a 28.6 clamp on I could use.

The shim helps protect the paint. On this bike I occasionally change from double to triple and back, etc.

[oliver1850]

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[Ralph]

On one of my bikes, I am running a 39-52 front and 13-29 rear with a short cage Chorus RD and a standard double FD. It kept throwing chains when I would downshift to 39. No matter how I adjusted FD, it would occasionally throw the chain. And while I know Campy didn't design the short cage RD to wrap up this many teeth, or at least it's borderline for this design, I also knew others were successfully using this combination.

So I thought about it and thought about it....and finally decided it wasn't a front derailleur adjustment problem, but a chain tension problem. The length I had cut the chain so it would wrap the 52X29 (just in case....), left the chain just a tad slack in small to small (probably about an 1" away from rubbing), and didn't leave enough tension on the chain to take up the slack when I dumped the chain from 52 down to 39. It would have been fine with a med range (or a 13-26 with 2 fewer chain links), but just not enough tension with the short cage and my combination. Maybe that's why Campy doesn't recommend this combination, and recommends the med cage when running the 13-29.

So I adjusted the B scew so that it put some more tension on the chain. And.....it doesn't throw the chain off any more.