OT: Yet another reason to hate the killer hill at the entrance to my subdivision

[Louis]

The entrance road to my subdivision has several tough hills, the first and most difficult is approximately a quarter-mile long with two 20% sections, one at the start and one at the end, and a not-quite-so-killer portion in the middle. At the end of long rides it's a real challenge.

This evening a few hours after sunset, with the temperature just below freezing it started to rain very gently, and because the road has trees on both sides and doesn't get much sun things started to freeze over. When I got to that bottom of the hill I noticed that several of my neighbors had parked and walked home rather than challenge the ice. Being the stupid guy that I am, and because I've made it up before when other folks haven't dared (Front WD helps) and because I had just put my Blizzac tires on Sunday night I decided to give it a shot.

I made it over the first steep section, then at the end of the less steep portion things started to go wrong, with the tires slipping, then catching. I made it past a car that had attempted to go up but had been abandoned on the left side, sticking out at an angle, taking up about 1/3 of road. Shortly after that I started to slip sideways, managed to correct things, but then came to a complete stop. If I applied the emergency brake but released the foot brake the rear tires alone were not enough to hold the car and I would slide down. I decided that there was no way I was going to make it up (just starting off would have required a near burn-out).

I also decided that I would not risk backing down. I've done it in years past starting from much closer to the bottom (back before I had the Blizzacs) and the combination of complete darkness (no street lights out here) and nearly zero control make it almost impossible to have a controlled descent. So I backed down just a bit farther and jockeyed the car off to side as much as I dared (I'd guess the right side of the car is 2 feet to the right of the pavement) and allowed the snow and gravel to kind of hold things. I then turned the wheel to the right and got out. At that point I was not able to walk up the road so I sat down on my butt, slid to the back of the car then made my way to the side where I had enough traction to walk up.

I've walked the 1.5 mile or so home and am safe and sound. Before going up the hill I also took a good look at the front left fender and wondered if I'll ever see it intact again. I doubt anyone going up will hit me (if they make it that far) but tomorrow morning as folks start to go to work (at least the intrepid ones who can't just stay home) there's a decent chance that someone will just slide right into me as they go down.

So, I'll walk down shortly after sunrise and hope for the best...

Louis

PS, I've learned my lesson. I next time I see a bunch of cars at the bottom at least try to walk up to see how slick it is, before attempting to drive up.

[oliver1850]

Not much you can do when it's icy. I remember a group of us standing in our driveway, watching a bulldozer slowly sliding sideways downhill toward us. It stopped when it hit my dad's new pickup.

Hope there's no dozers on higher ground.

[dave thompson]

Oh c'mon Louis, HTFU.

[echelon_john]

don't ever move to Vermont!

(we live on a steep hill that I've been lucky to make it up a few times in questionable conditions, even w/4wd and snow tires)

[Blue Jays]

Perhaps hike back to your vehicle tonight to extensively salt/sand the asphalt nearby?
Drivers may slide...yet perhaps regain sufficient control to avoid hitting your car?

[Ken Robb]

Front wheel drive isn't much help driving forward up a steep hill. It would be great if you back up the hills. :)

[Z3c]

Ah, the charming Mid-Worst..don't miss it one bit.

[gearguywb]

I lived in a subdivision in Asheville, NC at the top of a hill...combined with a fairly sharp curve. When it started snowing/freezing hard during one storm last year I went out to help a motorist that made it part way up and then got stranded. Weather we heading downhill rapidly. Car was stuck at an angle out into the road and it took several of us to get it off the road.

Ended up going to the base of the hill (and back a ways) to warn drivers that it was pretty much impassable and they should try another route or park and walk. I gave up after about 30 minutes when several drivers ignored the warning and tried anyway...then ended up in the ditch all nicely clustered together. It was fun to watch though.

Be careful out there! Right now the South is getting hit with a nice ice and snow storm and it is going to be a challenging day.

[1centaur]

One of my first priorities when I knew I'd be moving back to New England was to buy a house without a steep driveway. When I ride by those in the summer I am grateful for having the foresight. But roads are a whole 'nother kettle o fish. I remember commuting on the major, can't avoid it, divided two-lane road to Boston one day after a flash snowfall had put two inches down before the plows could get out so commuters had hard packed it. Everybody was being stymied by a 5% grade that barely registers in the mind in the summer. One or two were sliding backwards. After taking an hour to go 3 miles, I pulled into a parking lot to rest my nerves, then went home and waited two hours before starting again. That commute told me AWD was required on my next car.

[William]

When I lived in the West Hills back in Portland getting home could be interesting when there was snow or ice on the ground (not that it happens all that often). There was a guy with a Ford F-350 4wd with chains front and back that would sit at the top of NW Cornell at Skyline and wait for folks to try climbing the hill. Most don't know how to drive in the snow. They wouldn't make it and he would cruise down to them and offer to pull them to the top for $25. People were pissed but what are you going to do when you want to get home? He'd be pulling folks up non-stop and making a bit of coin.

Moral of the story:
Get a big 4wd with two sets of chains - make it home and make a bit of side money for your next custom. ;)




William

[Ralph]

Sometimes I get bored with Florida, thinking we need to move somewhere for some excitement and change of weather......then I read these reports.....

[veloduffer]

Two words: tire chains

About the only thing that can get you up a hill like that.

[Louis]

I'm still home but got a phone call from a neighbor. Apparently our plowing guy came through and salted the hills and they are now much better. One guy was able to leave without much trouble and the owner of the other stuck car was able to get her car out. Hopefully that bodes well for both the condition of my car and my being to get it off the side of the road and in to work...

[johnnymossville]

When I lived in the West Hills back in Portland getting home could be interesting when there was snow or ice on the ground (not that it happens all that often). There was a guy with a Ford F-350 4wd with chains front and back that would sit at the top of NW Cornell at Skyline and wait for folks to try climbing the hill. Most don't know how to drive in the snow. They wouldn't make it and he would cruise down to them and offer to pull them to the top for $25. People were pissed but what are you going to do when you want to get home? He'd be pulling folks up non-stop and making a bit of coin.

Moral of the story:
Get a big 4wd with two sets of chains - make it home and make a bit of side money for your next custom. ;)


William

I love capitalism. This guy's a genius.

Great story William

[AngryScientist]

Two words: tire chains

About the only thing that can get you up a hill like that.


yup - this.

for a while i lived in an apt where the shared driveway for three houses was about a 30% slope to get in. my mini cooper with chains on the front wheels was the only car in the driveway on several occasions. they make nice low-profile chains for car tires now that are literally a snap to put on in situations like yours.

or just walk it...

[dekindy]

I had a 1986 Ford Thunderbird TurboCoupe. It was not very fast but looked sharp and very comfortable seats. The big wide sporty tires had zero traction in snow. I got it out once to the end of the driveway, which was about 2 car lengths long, and could not go anywhere. It took me 20 minutes to get it back in the garage with very little slope on the driveway. Does this count? I also did a 270 spin leaving work at about 5 miles per hour. I decided not to drive that car in bad weather anymore. The lady that cut my hair had the same vintage Mustang during the same time period and complained about how bad that car was on the snow. She forgot to tell me that unlike me, she was hitting things. I saw her car once and the original color was Candy Red approximately. After hitting things it had 3 different color fenders. FWD or AWD for me from then on.

[Volant]

Front wheel drive isn't much help driving forward up a steep hill. It would be great if you back up the hills. :)

You beat me to it! - although if it's really icy (or the dreaded black-ice) you're still not getting up - even with the additional weight transfer.

[texbike]

The entrance road to my subdivision has several tough hills, the first and most difficult is approximately a quarter-mile long with two 20% sections, one at the start and one at the end, and a not-quite-so-killer portion in the middle. At the end of long rides it's a real challenge.

This evening a few hours after sunset, with the temperature just below freezing it started to rain very gently, and because the road has trees on both sides and doesn't get much sun things started to freeze over. When I got to that bottom of the hill I noticed that several of my neighbors had parked and walked home rather than challenge the ice. Being the stupid guy that I am, and because I've made it up before when other folks haven't dared (Front WD helps) and because I had just put my Blizzac tires on Sunday night I decided to give it a shot.

I made it over the first steep section, then at the end of the less steep portion things started to go wrong, with the tires slipping, then catching. I made it past a car that had attempted to go up but had been abandoned on the left side, sticking out at an angle, taking up about 1/3 of road. Shortly after that I started to slip sideways, managed to correct things, but then came to a complete stop. If I applied the emergency brake but released the foot brake the rear tires alone were not enough to hold the car and I would slide down. I decided that there was no way I was going to make it up (just starting off would have required a near burn-out).

I also decided that I would not risk backing down. I've done it in years past starting from much closer to the bottom (back before I had the Blizzacs) and the combination of complete darkness (no street lights out here) and nearly zero control make it almost impossible to have a controlled descent. So I backed down just a bit farther and jockeyed the car off to side as much as I dared (I'd guess the right side of the car is 2 feet to the right of the pavement) and allowed the snow and gravel to kind of hold things. I then turned the wheel to the right and got out. At that point I was not able to walk up the road so I sat down on my butt, slid to the back of the car then made my way to the side where I had enough traction to walk up.

I've walked the 1.5 mile or so home and am safe and sound. Before going up the hill I also took a good look at the front left fender and wondered if I'll ever see it intact again. I doubt anyone going up will hit me (if they make it that far) but tomorrow morning as folks start to go to work (at least the intrepid ones who can't just stay home) there's a decent chance that someone will just slide right into me as they go down.

So, I'll walk down shortly after sunrise and hope for the best...

Louis

PS, I've learned my lesson. I next time I see a bunch of cars at the bottom at least try to walk up to see how slick it is, before attempting to drive up.

St. Louis has hills? Hills with 20% grades???

Wow!

TXB

[torquer]

FWD or AWD for me from then on.
I got a good taste of the limits of FWD within a week or two of acquiring the Viggen; a one-inch dusting of snow, combined with the 45-series P-Zeros motivated by 240 foot-pounds, left me with an unusable car (not quite, since I could have done donuts in the parking lot all day.)
Fortunately, SAAB had a special on snow tires (unfortunately mounted on those ugly three-spoke rims) which I jumped on. I make sure they are back on the car by Thanksgiving every year since.

[RPS]

So, I'll walk down shortly after sunrise and hope for the best...

Louis
Haven’t you been thinking of getting a new car to replace the Integra? ;)

[RPS]

Sometimes I get bored with Florida, thinking we need to move somewhere for some excitement and change of weather......then I read these reports.....
Exactly my thought. I've only encountered ice a couple of times in Houston and it wasn't that bad -- one time in 15 years it took me 3 hours to drive home. When I lived in Central Florida bad winter weather was never an issue.

[97CSI]

St. Louis has hills? Hills with 20% grades???
Wow!
TXBYou need to get out more. :)

Yes.......... Snow flurries just starting. Here's hoping that I can convince the wife that we need a place in FL for Nov-Mar.

[Louis]

Well, it turns out the roads were in much better shape this morning and all my neighbors managed to avoid my car as they drove down. Once I got the ice scraped off the windows I was able to pull out (going forward) without much trouble, then turn around at the top and go down and off to work.

Texbike, if you're ever looking for a ride with plenty of rollers I can show you routes that have more than you ever wanted. Even the world-class pros who did the Tour of MO commented on how hilly it can be around here.

RPS, yes, I am thinking of replacing the car, but until I know what to get, the Integra's my baby.

[bike22]

nokian hakkalettapellitas (sp?)

when i lived in vermont people would leave them on their cars year-round.

[dookie]

summer performance tires are absurdly bad in inclement conditions...i feel for every one of the prior stories:

at 17, dad sent me to the tire shop in his track toy (a mistubishi AWD turbo coupe...forget the model...same as eagle talon). i was to have the yoko a008 track tires swapped out for some daily drivers. i got there, no issues, but a water pipe had burst in the cold overnight and they were closed. did i mention it was january in cleveland, with ~6" of fresh snow?

the trip home...not so good. slid into a stone guardrail post at ~20mph, full steering lock, absolutely zero traction in the snow from the sticky when hot slicks. doh!

today? a dose of sleet overnight and i needed 4WD to get out of my driveway in central NC. (a word about the driveway: 75yds long, 26% slope up to street)

[Blue Jays]

If summer performance tires are on the car, don't even depart the garage if snow is threatening.

[veloduffer]

Well, it turns out the roads were in much better shape this morning and all my neighbors managed to avoid my car as they drove down. Once I got the ice scraped off the windows I was able to pull out (going forward) without much trouble, then turn around at the top and go down and off to work.

Texbike, if you're ever looking for a ride with plenty of rollers I can show you routes that have more than you ever wanted. Even the world-class pros who did the Tour of MO commented on how hilly it can be around here.

RPS, yes, I am thinking of replacing the car, but until I know what to get, the Integra's my baby.


Get emergency snow chains. They are easy to install (it's just a chain with a strap through the wheel, not like a full chains set) and are only meant for very short distance, like a long drive way or short part of the street. You need to take them off as soon as your clear of the difficult part.