Brooks users...help please...

[700 x 23c]

First day on the B17....my butt loves it....yesterday, I rode my Selle Italia and after two hours, my butt hurt...not today. Maybe despite my scrawny butt, my IT are wider than I thought.

My problem: I feel like I am sliding forward. When I am hands free, I definitely slide forward (wedgie). I made a few adjustments in the tilt during the ride and when I got home, my wife, who does not ride, said "it looks like the seat is tilted backwards." Is this "ok?" When the nose is level, the butt of the seat is up and I slide forward and then I feel more "pressure" on my hands.

One writer, in a previous thread, wrote that the "nose should point upward?" True?

The Brooks sits higher off the rails by 0.5 cm compared with the Selle Italia, so when I got home, I lowered the seat post by this amount. Maybe this will help or solve the problem. I really did not want to screw with my fitting settings, but I also wanted to try this saddle. Any help would be much appreciated.

[pale scotsman]

Point that nose up! What you want is the "hammock" in the middle.

[700 x 23c]

"Adjust yours so that rear portion is higher than the neck and nose. Not by a lot, not so that the nose looks angled downward, but just a little, as the maker intended. You sit on the higher rear portion, which supports your sit bones. Your tender perineal region (between your genitals and your crack) is positioned over the neck, but not pressed hard against it. If you're getting numb down there, you've got too much pressure on your P-region; you probably need to raise the back of the saddle."

Per Rivendell

[Dekonick]

and - call me crazy -
replace all of your saddles with brooks...your butt will appreciate it.

seriously - the Brooks is a different fit than a typical saddle. You might consider getting another 'fit' with someone in the know... you may need to get a set back seatpost to achieve a similar fit to what you had with your previous saddle.

Good luck!

Dont forget to proofride (and give it several hundred miles before you give the brooks final judgement. It takes awhile to develop a fit to you.)

[Ray]

"Adjust yours so that rear portion is higher than the neck and nose. Not by a lot, not so that the nose looks angled downward, but just a little, as the maker intended. You sit on the higher rear portion, which supports your sit bones. Your tender perineal region (between your genitals and your crack) is positioned over the neck, but not pressed hard against it. If you're getting numb down there, you've got too much pressure on your P-region; you probably need to raise the back of the saddle."

Per Rivendell
Yeah, IF you're getting numb down there. But otherwise, don't be afraid to raise the nose some. All of my Brooks' have raised noses. Which gets the rear part, where my sit bones go, pretty close to flat. Which keeps me from sliding forward on the saddle. With the front level, the rear is tilted forward and I tend to slide. If I tilt it so far up that the 'taint is feeling pressure, that's too far, but I can usually find the sweet spot before that point.

-Ray

[Rapid Tourist]

I found that the tilt changed for me as the brooks became "worn in". I started out with the saddle fairly level and after a good 500-800 miles or so I started to tilt the nose up. There is something about how the leather gets broken in, and the hammock affect starts to take place as the leather gets softer.

Anyway, I digress. Yes, you should point the nose ever so slightly up if you are sliding toward the handlebars. You'll know it is tilted too far up if you slide off the back of the saddle. :) And dont be surprised if the angle of tip changes as the leather breaks in. Enjoy one of the truly wonderful bike components available on the planet.

[Peter]

My experience with Brooks saddles is the same as what you're experiencing-set up per Rivendell instructions I feel like I'm sliding forward off the saddle. Set up so the rear portion is more level and the nose is applying too much pressure on the "important parts".

So, it's my opinion that Brooks saddles "work" with bikes whose handlebars are equal to or approach the same height as the saddle. The lower your bars, the more you'll experience the feeling that you are encountering now. Brooks saddles just aren't a good match for today's "modern" bike set up if it includes lower bars.

[Air Jer]

Also, the things are slick when new;this may or may not be part of the problem.
With a little time the saddle will lose this and not be so slippery.
Glad you like your B17. I love mine.

[Smiley]

700 X 23 , you need to make sure that your not sliding forward so point that nose up , but as Peter has said the B 17 is intended for riding with bars and saddle almost level , Bill Laine will tell you that if you have a drop that is bigger then you should opt for the B 17 N . This might be meaningless and just a suggestion . The bigger problem is that you failed to mention that you moved the saddle back on the rails by 1.5 to 2 cm to compensate for the 177 mm width of the Brooks saddle , this detail alone will move your KOP forward and should be re-checked by someone in the know . If I think a client will be opting for a Brooks in the future I make sure they have the option to use more off-set in the seat post for just that reason . So TWO things get the saddle tilt so your not sliding forward and MOVE that saddle back from where your skinny little racing saddle was by about 1.5 to 2 cm . Trust me , I have positioned many a rider on Da Brooks .

[700 x 23c]

Smiley....I measure the posterior portion of the saddle to the end of the stem and adjusted the Brooks so that this number is the same as my other saddle. I would think that this would keep the KOPS the same? In other words, I think my Butt is sitting the same distance from the bars as it was in the first place and therefore, my knees must also still be in the same position.....I think?? As it is, the Brooks is as far back as the rails will allow using a DA post.

[Smiley]

NOPE , you would be wrong , the Brooks flares wider and hence will push you forward , you must move the rear of the saddle the distance I noted . I will bet you a kings ransom on that one , done it too many times with clients and its really easy to check with a plumb , maybe thats why you are really falling forward ?

[dbrk]

NOPE , you would be wrong , the Brooks flares wider and hence will push you forward , you must move the rear of the saddle the distance I noted . I will bet you a kings ransom on that one , done it too many times with clients and its really easy to check with a plumb , maybe thats why you are really falling forward ?

Smilely is correct. Take it from a relative. The other side of our family makes buttondown shirts.

Note too that the rails on the Brooks are shorter than other saddles, exacerbated by the steeper seat tube angles on modern bikes which change the knee/pedal position accordingly. Leaving aside how many saddles are slammed all the way back these days, you can compensate with the FLAT REAR. Instead of thinking of the nose pointing up, think of the rear-most portion of the saddle being level (which will point the nose up).

dbr[oo]k[s]

[700 x 23c]

OK...Thanks!

So, I need to get on the saddle and drop a plumb line....if it is "ok," then all is well. If not, then I need a new seat post since I can't push the Brooks back any further?

[eddief]

A while back I experimented using a DA seat post and a B17. I ride pushed pretty far back and could not get the B17 to go back far enough. The only post that looks like it might work for me is the Selcof dual position sold by Peter White. Alas, I gave up on the Brooks before doing another seat post purchase and experiment.

[700 x 23c]

Yup...If I need a new seat post, I may put off riding the Brooks for now. I don't want to screw to much with my fitters settings initially. I think I may go back to my original settings for a while and then go back to my fitter with the Brooks and see what he can do.

[Ahneida Ride]

Installation of a Brooks compelled me to purchase an offset post.
Small angles changes can make a huge difference. Tilt the saddle up !

[Ken Robb]

it is surprising how a very slight change in angle will affect your comfort. I seem to like mine Brooks best when the nose is just barely one bubble up using a level running across the middle of the saddle from front to rear. Any less and I feel pressure on my hands from the pressure of stopping me from sliding forward. When I get the nose a bit too high it can feel dandy when riding the hoods but it crunches the boys when I go to the drops. I mean VERY small adjustments make a BIG difference.

[Dekonick]

Like Smiley stated earlier - It is worth a trip to your 'fitter'

You won't regret it.

[spiderman]

i've flattened the saddle out a little...
...only a slight elevation upward.
there's not as much slippage
after a good break-in it seems...
my wife is riding my arione...
and is hinting that a brooks may be
a nice mother's day present!

[700 x 23c]

First, thanks for all the great responses.

Second, since the bike is new, I feel l should probably ride it as it was set up for a few months to get a feel for it and make sure everything is comfortable. I was hoping, that changing the saddle would be an easy swap out, but clearly I did not think about all the great points you guys made.

Is there a Brooks saddle that would be easily swapped out without making seat post changes and major position changes? Swift?

If not, then I may just wait a while, get comfortable with the bike, it's characteristics, and then consider discussing the change with my fitter (who, does not seem to be a Brooks fan based upon our brief discussion of the topic).

Thanks again....you guys have been very helpful!

[Smiley]

NO , you can't swap out a modern skinny saddle with any Brooks . If your fitter is not a Brooks fan , that's too bad to hear since he's closed to the possiblities of the importance of sit bone placement with regard to proper KOP . If I have a client that is NOT in love with their saddle, a conversation about sit bone placement and Brooks saddles ensues . I always manage to get these on the fence clients to go Brooks and they usually never go back . As a convert myself it was the single BEST move I made switching all my saddles to Da Brooks . Look at a Swallow sometime and tell me that saddle is not way Kool . I for the life of me can't understand why fitters don't take advantage of all tools available to them to maximize rider comfort within the bike fit equation .

[Rapid Tourist]

Smiley, when are they gonna make a brooks swallow that doesn't cost $400? I mean its cool and everything, but that's a lot of change!

[Smiley]

Actually I just had a e-mail exchange with Bill Laine about the timing of the intro of the stock Swallow and how it will differ from the limited edition version ( $$$$ ) . I think it will still be pricy but not 400 clams .

[Dekonick]

If your fitter can give a reason (other than weight) that a brooks is not a great seat..........

I think your fitter needs to have a chat with Smiley. I had him fit me - (like you I tried to go from a modern saddle to a brooks on my own... couldnt get it to work...Smiley fit me and I am not looking back)! Love my brooks....

[spiderman]

a woman's swallow...my spouse really wants to know
...the swift and the finesse
the professional and the professional s...
the swallow and the butterfly??