Rivendell rider sighting

[Steve in SLO]

On my way to work this AM, I spotted someone riding a Rivendell with a Grant Peterson philosophy fit. The frame looked HUGE under the rider. The rider looked to be about 5'10" or so and was riding a frame with a head tube that was over a foot tall. The seatpost was showing perhaps 3 inches or so, and there was a riser stem so the handlebar tops were level to the seat. My initial thought was "Wow, that frame is too big for him", but then I recognized it as a Riv, saw the fenders, Arundel bag and looked carefully at the rider, who looked comfortble as h*ll, just pedaling along. Amazing how something like this can catch your eye, make you initially think it's wrong, then on further thought have you realize it's just different. Hmmm...

[John H.]

I see guys like that around here too. Usually going up a climb. As I am approaching I usually think "wow, what a bad bike fit"- get up to them and they are Full Riv- super long chainstays, 2 inches of seatpost, brooks saddle, nitto technomics stem that puts drops about level with saddle, jersey sized so it fully covers their ass with stuff in pockets...
Bike is always weaving all over because the front end is so high. Often time they are in the drops (on a climb).
I guess they are having fun?

[Steve in SLO]

I wasn't really thinking about this guy as a kook, rather that he seemed to know what he was about, was having a great time riding well. It was just in a much, much different way than I do.

[MRB]

The Riv Fit stuff does not work for me. I have tried it. For me the result was a bike that was too big, and my position was too upright.

If you only want to have one bike, and you have all the time in the world to spend on every bike ride you go on, then it might be a good option.

For me, I have to get to work by a certain time in the morning, and when I am out "training" I like to set of goal of 20 mph or so. Non of this is achievable on my Romulus. It is a great bike to go to the grocery store on.

[Ray]

I would assume the guy was having plenty of fun unless you had a very specific reason to think otherwise, based on input from HIM, not from your assumptions!

I've been in a few places over the years with the Riv fit. My first nice bike back in '97 was a Riv and I bought into the whole Riv fit thing back then, but it was much different back then than it is now. And I was very comfortable and happy on that bike, which was basically an RB1 with chainstays almost 2cm longer and a bb about 5mm lower. As Grant started building more and more upright bikes with even longer stays, I tried 'em for a while and never liked it, so I didn't stick with it. And then, when I was really in shape and riding a ton, I tried a racier position and ultimately hated it too - couldn't do long rides in that position without ending up with too much weight on my hands/arms/shoulders - not relaxed. Eventually moved back to the same middle ground I started with on my first Riv - seat pretty far back, bars within about an inch of saddle height, back flat but at about a 45 degree angle in the hoods - flatter in the drops and more upright on the tops. I can ride comfortably in this position for as long as I can ride. I found it myself and, having tried everything else (being the inquisitive sort), I'm good with it. Even now that my mileage is well down, it still feels right. And when I take myself by surprise and get a view of myself in a window or something as I ride by, I look about right to me - not too low, not too high. But if I'd been more comfortable in the more upright position I'd tried for a while, I'd still be in it. And if I'd been more comfortable in the lower, racier position I tried for a while, I'd still be in THAT. Most of us that ride a fair amount end up in the position that works best for us, even if it looks goofy to other folks.

If I see someone else on a bike I can usually tell whether they're comfortable or not and it has nothing to do with whether I'd be comfortable in the same position.

-Ray

[eddief]

I enjoyed your posting about Riv and your ability to acknowledge different strokes for different folks. Riv and GP are incredible magnets for both sides of the spectrum; those who are religious for the approach and those who are religious against it. Such is the nature of religiosity. The middle is a good option. Good thoughts for Sunday and raining in CA.

[Frankwurst]

Ray gets it and explains it well I might add. :beer:

[Rueda Tropical]

If you are headed to work in a suit on your Dutch utility bike or heading out for a container of milk in flip flops the Riv fit is perfect. It's how millions of cyclists ride on bikes used strictly for transportation. That's probably 99% of cyclists in the world. Cyclists who ride for sport and fitness on expensive bikes are probably a pretty small slice of the cycling world. The combined output of Trek and Specialized is dwarfed by Chinese and Indian producers of those old fashioned roadsters.

Grant has just repackaged utility cycling with a nicer kit for US recreational cyclists.

[Ken Robb]

Grant also wrote about a mixte "sooner or later we'll all want one". Sometimes I think he may be right. :)

[goonster]

Bike may have been 650b, which can trompe l'oeuil and make the headtube look much longer than on an equivalent 700c bike . . .

[xjoex]

Horses for courses right? I had my bianchi set up pseudo rivendell and it was a blast to ride commuting and on day long rail trail rides.

http://s62.photobucket.com/albums/h85/boulderjoe/bikes/IMGP2992.jpg

-Joe

[BillG]

Grant also wrote about a mixte "sooner or later we'll all want one". Sometimes I think he may be right. :)

We call it a "sloping top tube".

[oldpotatoe]

On my way to work this AM, I spotted someone riding a Rivendell with a Grant Peterson philosophy fit. The frame looked HUGE under the rider. The rider looked to be about 5'10" or so and was riding a frame with a head tube that was over a foot tall. The seatpost was showing perhaps 3 inches or so, and there was a riser stem so the handlebar tops were level to the seat. My initial thought was "Wow, that frame is too big for him", but then I recognized it as a Riv, saw the fenders, Arundel bag and looked carefully at the rider, who looked comfortble as h*ll, just pedaling along. Amazing how something like this can catch your eye, make you initially think it's wrong, then on further thought have you realize it's just different. Hmmm...

Hmmmm...the other day I passed a guy with just about every gadget made on his handlebars. GPS, phone, computer, lights. GREAT big long headutbe extension, upslope 30 degree(plus?) stem, handlebar above the saddle. Camelback, helmet visor, MTB shoes, big rack hooked to his seatpost with a big bag..seemed very happy and content..on his Serotta.

[slowandsteady]

Racers Race, Trainers Train, Riders Ride...to each his own and may everyone enjoy their rides and their individual goals. Just get comfy on your bike and you'll ride farther and longer. Does not matter what position you are in relative to OTHER people and what they tell you about how, what or where to ride (unless racing of course)...just ride and enjoy your fellow riders. If speed matters to you, that's ok, just remember it does not matter to everyone. Just remember your $6,000 bike is a waste of money to some riders and they may be putting in 5-10K miles a year on their $1,000 "beater".

I was out for a ride this summer with my buddy cruising up he NH coast at 18-20 on our "fancy custom" bikes and came upon a gentleman in his mid to late 60's cruising along on his Riv. I pulled alongside and admired his bike and chatted for a moment. He was cruising with fat tires, probably 32's. We then passed him casually saying "have a great day". He caught up to us about 3 mins later, took the lead and just cranked for the next 15 mins putting us young pups (both 47) to shame and sent us home wheezing. We both remarked how strong and fit this guy was and how impressed we were with his riding. Sometimes we ride to our own drum beat...not every ride is a race. I like to watch the waves and surfers and beachgoers where I ride so lots of people pass me but I suppose few have as much much fun as i do while riding :-)

[rpm]

If you're going to try a Rivendell fit, I think you have to go full-in with a Rivendell-style bike with long stays.

When I first got my present bike, with a racing-style geometry, I experimented with the set up by getting some cheap Salsa stems with different rises and lengths. After getting all the "your stem is too short" stuff, I tried a longer stem that preserved my reach by bringing my bars closer to the saddle level. The bike handled like a farm truck. My 90 mm stem with a greater drop makes the bike handle much better.

I suspect you need the long stays to get the weight distribution right on a bike with high handlebars.

[Ralph]

So far, and even at my age 69, I'm not much into the RIV position. I need all the aero help I can get to keep up with the younger guys on rides. LOL

But....on longer rides over, say, 60-70 miles, my neck, back, and butt give me more trouble than my legs. So maybe it would be a good idea to buy one of those old steel touring bikes like I used to have one of (P15 Paramount in 70's), an inch or so larger frame than I ride now, and make it into a comfortable rider. They say history repeats itself....eventually.

[Ray]

When I first got my present bike, with a racing-style geometry, I experimented with the set up by getting some cheap Salsa stems with different rises and lengths. After getting all the "your stem is too short" stuff, I tried a longer stem that preserved my reach by bringing my bars closer to the saddle level. The bike handled like a farm truck. My 90 mm stem with a greater drop makes the bike handle much better.

I suspect you need the long stays to get the weight distribution right on a bike with high handlebars.
This is absolutely critical. A more upright position moves your weight back on the bike and puts more weight on the rear wheel. To keep a good weight distribution so the bike will handle well in this position, the wheels have to be moved under you. Longer stays are usually a big part of that equation, to put enough weight back on the front wheel. A lot of folks try to convert their racing bikes to a more comfortable position and find they handle like garbage and then assume that everyone riding in a Riv-type position is riding a bike that handles like that. NOT SO!! If the bike is set up for this type of position, it will handle just as well as the racing bike under a racer.

-Ray

[Minstrie]

Horses for courses right? I had my bianchi set up pseudo rivendell and it was a blast to ride commuting and on day long rail trail rides.

http://s62.photobucket.com/albums/h85/boulderjoe/bikes/IMGP2992.jpg

-Joe


Man after my own heart. To make an ebay Colnago purchase gone bad less bitter, I did the bike up as a pseudo riv in much the same way, and it makes me smile to ride. In fact, just bought some wood fenders to put on it.

Minstrie

[rw229]

While I don't ride with my bars level or above my saddle, I can see the benefits of what Grant preaches. If it puts people on bikes and makes them comfortable enough to continue to ride, its a good thing.