Bike Path Violence--almost

[indyrider]

My buddy and I decided to hit a long interval hammerfest on a local bike path section that I had never ridden and is seldom used. We were approaching the outskirts of a city here in OH that is known for some rough characters, when we encountered a wet wooden bridge crossing a stream.

I had slowed my speed on the bridge so I wouldnt end up on the deck when I approached two 12-13yr girls walking towards me when one of them jumped out at me as I passed and yelled something along the lines of "Im gonna knock you off and take your bike" blah blah blah....I mean I could smell her breath she was that close. My partner saw that go down and was prepared when they did that to him. I didnt move off my line or flinch or whatever....I was pretty much in shock and couldnt believe what just went down. I very easily could have crashed or reacted by swinging my fist towards her face by instinct and Im glad neither happened!

We rode a few more miles discussing knucklehead kids and such before turning around and approaching the bridge again from the opposite direction. We then ran into 4 boys, 9-12 yrs old, all smoking, who were yelling at the two girls...the boys approached us, but I kind of yelled/raised my voice and stopped them in their tracks, taking the initiative and control of the group dynamic with them....

and so went the day without further surprises but it makes me really think about the kids today and the lack of parenting...what would have happened if I crashed? what could I do about young girls or kids in general crashing me?
what if I would have reacted by instinct and swung my fist when she jumped and cracked her in the mouth. what that have been assault on my part or self defense....any precedent here???

Just cant get that whole scene off my mind and happy I came away unscathed and not in the hoosegow!

[dekindy]

I am glad nothing happened. File a report with authorities.

[Ralph]

The authorities need to know. Here in Central Florida our paved trails are mostly petroled by county employees in pick up trucks. One trail I am aware of does go thru a rough neighborhood, and you have to be careful. Good thinking on your part. No need to escalate the violence.

[rugbysecondrow]

My buddy and I decided to hit a long interval hammerfest on a local bike path section that I had never ridden and is seldom used. We were approaching the outskirts of a city here in OH that is known for some rough characters, when we encountered a wet wooden bridge crossing a stream.

I had slowed my speed on the bridge so I wouldnt end up on the deck when I approached two 12-13yr girls walking towards me when one of them jumped out at me as I passed and yelled something along the lines of "Im gonna knock you off and take your bike" blah blah blah....I mean I could smell her breath she was that close. My partner saw that go down and was prepared when they did that to him. I didnt move off my line or flinch or whatever....I was pretty much in shock and couldnt believe what just went down. I very easily could have crashed or reacted by swinging my fist towards her face by instinct and Im glad neither happened!

We rode a few more miles discussing knucklehead kids and such before turning around and approaching the bridge again from the opposite direction. We then ran into 4 boys, 9-12 yrs old, all smoking, who were yelling at the two girls...the boys approached us, but I kind of yelled/raised my voice and stopped them in their tracks, taking the initiative and control of the group dynamic with them....

and so went the day without further surprises but it makes me really think about the kids today and the lack of parenting...what would have happened if I crashed? what could I do about young girls or kids in general crashing me?
what if I would have reacted by instinct and swung my fist when she jumped and cracked her in the mouth. what that have been assault on my part or self defense....any precedent here???

Just cant get that whole scene off my mind and happy I came away unscathed and not in the hoosegow!

Kids have been knuckleheads for a long time, and there have been bad parents for just as long. There was a guy I knew growing up who, while in a moving vehicle, pulled along side a guy on a bike and pushed him over for no reason. This same guy was at a local pool hall the same night I was there some years ago and he tried bullying the wrong guy...he end up on his knees with a gun against his head begging, crying and pissing a little. He didn't get shot, not that night, but he was just an a$$hole, and life tends to deal with those people. These kids are no different.

[BumbleBeeDave]

Kids have been knuckleheads for a long time, and there have been bad parents for just as long.

But my impression is that there are a hell of a lot more of both these days. Way, WAY more parents than in the past who seem to feel like it's everyone's responsibility to raise and supervise their kids except them. :no:

BBD

[fourflys]

But my impression is that there are a hell of a lot more of both these days. Way, WAY more parents than in the past who seem to feel like it's everyone's responsibility to raise and supervise their kids except them. :no:

BBD

I bet your parents said/thought the same thing when your age as well.... it's a cyclic thing, we think our parents are idiots when we're 15 and then when we're in our 40's/50's we think all kids are dirtbags and their parents MUST be doing something wrong... this is the way it's been for centuries, the younger generation is ALWAYS worse then your generation... unless, it's YOUR kidsm then they're the exception, of course...

[gemship]

Well Indyrider sounds like you did the right thing. This is one of those incidents where I absolutely can't fault anybody for being shook up and having some post incident agitation, enough so to share a experience on the forum. On the other hand it's hard to forget that hostility you displayed starting that LA thread that got locked up. I don't know you and it really doesn't matter but boy did you try hard at that one. :rolleyes:

Kids act like punks all the time. Live to ride, ride to live but try not to take it too seriously. Stuff happens but at least things didn't escalate like you said. Be well.

[indyrider]

On the other hand it's hard to forget that hostility you displayed starting that LA thread that got locked up. I don't know you and it really doesn't matter but boy did you try hard at that one. :rolleyes:


Now, now :argue: **** I thought that polarizing subject had passed...Hostile? No. Passionate? Yes, and tired of the drama...

What it comes down to is that we believe what we believe, we all ride two wheels, and have to deal with idiots on the road all the time. :beer:

[gemship]

The authorities need to know. Here in Central Florida our paved trails are mostly petroled by county employees in pick up trucks. One trail I am aware of does go thru a rough neighborhood, and you have to be careful. Good thinking on your part. No need to escalate the violence.


Speaking of Florida my grandparents live in St. Petersburg. When I was 17 we took a trip down there for thanksgiving vacation, the neighborhood where they live was pretty nice with houses right on the water but about a couple of blocks or really just at the beginning of the street there was this main road with lots of shopping plazas and stores. I took grandpa's bike for a ride to explore and went over that way. At a parking lot I was confronted by three colored kids. Just standing there straddling the bike I thought I was being friendly acknowledging one of them asking me a question well it turns out he was setting me to rob me. The kid punched me in the face another tried to pry my hands off the bike. If it wasn't for some older guy observing this as he pulled up to park his car they probably would of succeeded in stealing the bike and the shoes off my feet. I was lucky. This experience left me with the impression that there are a lot of desperate lower class people in Florida. I'm 36 now but I don't think the place has changed but it was a rough neighborhood and really close to the nice part of town, I have a hard time figuring that one out to this day.

[Ralph]

I kinda doubt Florida is any different than any place else in this regard.

[mike p]

I don't understand the whole bike path thing. Aren't there roads you can ride around there? I'm from upstate NY (very rural, country) no bike paths around and if there were I wouldn't ride them. Our roads here are great and you can sometimes ride for an hour and hardly see a car. I'm asking because I always hear of bike paths, and assume its very crowded and no good roads in your area for biking? Just seems like a bad mix, biking, walking, rollerblading,YUK! I'll stick to the roads and just cars to worry about.

Thanks
Mike

[jvp]

I've had kids fake their intent to stop me several times. My reaction was to speed up, hold my line, and remain impassive. They cleared every time. Once on my commute I saw a women crossing the road ahead of me, I thought that was all she intended but when I rode past her she struck me and yelled something. I didn't go down but my arm smarted due to my speed and her smack. Just as it happened, a highway patrol slowed and stopped - I told him what happened and continued to work. I assume he discussed the incident with her!

[mike p]

Just realized I broke 1500 WOW! Do I get a prize?

Mike

[gemship]

I kinda doubt Florida is any different than any place else in this regard.


Maybe... I don't know, not very well traveled. What I described was random and I know it can happen everywhere but it also was like one of those see I told you so things. Maybe it's just me but I read about a lot of crime like this in Florida, stealing,beatings,killings and then there's that Cops show where they do a lot of filming in the streets of Miami. That certainly don't help Florida's image.

Looking back on it I feel spoiled to live where I live. There are kids acting like punks but it just seems more of a rare thing to have them get embolden to act on their words. I don't know it's all subjective, I don't really want to turn this into a Florida is a bad place thing but I do have a uncle the moved there, bought a pretty cheap house and even he seems to have this heighten sense of security.

[indyrider]

I don't understand the whole bike path thing. Aren't there roads you can ride around there?

Thanks
Mike

Great country roads but since is was raining hard on and off throughout the day, we thought we would be safer with no cars...just didnt plan for punks!

[rugbysecondrow]

I don't understand the whole bike path thing. Aren't there roads you can ride around there? I'm from upstate NY (very rural, country) no bike paths around and if there were I wouldn't ride them. Our roads here are great and you can sometimes ride for an hour and hardly see a car. I'm asking because I always hear of bike paths, and assume its very crowded and no good roads in your area for biking? Just seems like a bad mix, biking, walking, rollerblading,YUK! I'll stick to the roads and just cars to worry about.

Thanks
Mike
I think it just depends on where you live and what's available. I have bike paths and roads available and often cobble them together to make a great ride.

[indyrider]

We also mix it up a lot for good 60-70 milers as we have a world class trail system here running from Columbus to Cinci and can put together some really nice path/road routes....

Im not a hardman like Jens, but still wanted to ride even though it was pouring and thought we'd be better off staying on the path and not have to worry about metal boxes with four wheels

[gemship]

We also mix it up a lot for good 60-70 milers as we have a world class trail system here running from Columbus to Cinci and can put together some really nice path/road routes....

Im not a hardman like Jens, but still wanted to ride even though it was pouring and thought we'd be better off staying on the path and not have to worry about metal boxes with four wheels


Yeah there is no bike paths where I live so I have to ride the country roads and I get passed by lots of cars. Lately I noticed that they don't leave much room, always after the fact but it's not like I can do much about it. Other than give up riding. On that note I think it's time to go for that ride today.

[Ralph]

I don't understand the whole bike path thing. Aren't there roads you can ride around there? I'm from upstate NY (very rural, country) no bike paths around and if there were I wouldn't ride them. Our roads here are great and you can sometimes ride for an hour and hardly see a car. I'm asking because I always hear of bike paths, and assume its very crowded and no good roads in your area for biking? Just seems like a bad mix, biking, walking, rollerblading,YUK! I'll stick to the roads and just cars to worry about.

Thanks
Mike

Can't speak for the rest of Florida, but Central Florida has about 150 miles of paved mostly 14' wide multi use trails. The key word is "multi use" trails. Some areas are heavily used, by all kinds of users, and not so great for cycling, and some areas you can go for miles without seeing another user or a side road, and you can ride as hard and fast as you want. They are designed for all kinds of users, to connect neighborhoods to shopping, to connect neighborhoods to schools, etc. They are not designed to be cycling trails only. Most follow old abandoned RR beds, so do go thru some interesting areas. They are also useful to get you back into town after a long training ride in the hills, maybe after work for some, and it's getting a little dark on way back.

While paved trails are not useful usually for training cyclists, pace line riding, interval training, etc...this is an urban area, and I, for one, do not like to mix it up with commuter traffic Mon-Fri, foreigners here for Disney who sometimes can't read road signs, foreigners in rental cars, and your usually assortment of folks who can't see a cyclist. I usually reserve my road riding for Sunday AM, where my odds are better for not getting hit.

So I like to ride the paved trails where the riding is good, and/or as a route to get me out of town to ride some of the rural roads some of you speak about. And in the areas where there is heavy use of all kinds, I just remember the trail is for all users, and slow down. So I think the paved trails are very good things, for around here. There are many areas you can get in some long rides safely without encountering much trail use. Maybe where you live, there is no need. But I'm glad we have them. It has certainly been good for bike shop businesses and has definitely increased cycling activity in this area. Some bike shops have even located themselves near or on the trails, with good sales of parts and rental equipment of all kinds.

Edit Addition....Our trails are also a big tourist draw. Foreigners with trail maps can ride safely about as far as most wish, without getting lost, with plenty of bathrooms, food, and water near by, and as a family of all kinds of abilities. Our trail system is sometimes called the "other reason foreigners visit Disney". Almost every week I meet some tourists on rental bikes from Europe or Asia. Trails are good for local business. Put a trail thru a blighted area, and the yuppies move to be by a trail....no need for county money to fix up area. Many counties are now beginning to understand the benefits of a trail system.

[Dekonick]

Around Baltimore, I find it makes sense to use paths to move to and from good cycling roads. Like Paul mentioned earlier, it is easy to cobble together a good ride using what you have at hand.

Just remember that when you are on a path, it is shared use... not a personal TT course (unless you have a desolate stretch to use... around here there could always be a 3 year old or a dog just around the bend)

:beer:

[Lifelover]

Bike path Violence....

...two 12-13yr girls ...
... 4 boys, 9-12 yrs old....

Sounds like a tough area. Maybe you should start carrying a squirt gun.

[thendenjeck]

in chicago people do this in the path near the lake, but it's more like 18 yr olds, and they will actually knock you off your bike and take it.

[indyrider]

Sounds like a tough area. Maybe you should start carrying a squirt gun.
Nice ocho cinco blast man....anyway it doesn't matter how old they are if they can push u over and my point being who thought it would start that young, right?

[davidlee]

Sounds like a tough area. Maybe you should start carrying a squirt gun.


Post of the day..
I just laughed so hard.
Thx I needed that
d

[Mike 870]

I was on the trail yesterday from Dayton to Franklin. I might have passed you guys.

[indyrider]

We were up in Urbana and into Springfield where the drama began....not gonna ride that stretch anymore, although up until S'field it was beautiful country....

[rugbysecondrow]

We were up in Urbana and into Springfield where the drama began....not gonna ride that stretch anymore, although up until S'field it was beautiful country....

You should have opened with that. I am from Springfield and I can attest to there being some rough charactors. It may not be a large city, but you need to know how to handle yourself around there if you know what I mean.

What path were you on?

***Nevermind, I am from Springfield, IL, although Springfield, OH is no picinic either from what I remember of my days at Wright Patterson.

[indyrider]

Yep, we were aware of the S'field issues as they've made news all summer with dog attacks and bad happenings....not a friendly place.....

Maybe I'll hit the 29er more...all I have to worry about are trees jumping out at me

[54ny77]

Middle aged white vigilantes on Serottas, takin' back the 'hood one bike path at a time. "Stop, or I'll blind you with high gloss carbon fiber!" ;)

[OtayBW]

Bike paths: meh.

[Larry]

in chicago people do this in the path near the lake, but it's more like 18 yr olds, and they will actually knock you off your bike and take it.

Yes..... this happens, unfortunately. I live in north Dallas, and there is a nice trail very close to the house. I enjoy night riding, but even in this seemingly safe area, I tend to have doubts about the safety.

I have seriously considered buying a pepper-spray shooter or something similar. ........ just in case. Weird stuff happens in this calm neighborhood from time to time.

Does anyone have a suggestion for a favorite brand??
"Tis a shame, but crap and assaults happen all the time.

[Bud_E]

Bike paths: meh.

I've said it repeatedly: Bike paths are the spawn of Satan - at least the ones around here.

[onekgguy]

I came across one of these idiots on a ride last week (http://onekgguy.blogspot.com/2010/07/jra.html) . I'm not sure what the net effect of my approach was but to do nothing didn't seem to be an option at the time.

Kevin g

[snah]

Had a similiar incident in downtown Indy about 15 years ago, came across a group of roughly 10 boys, probably 10-14 years old. Blocked the whole rode, forcing me to stop. Luckily I was able to push my way thru and out pedal, definitely got the adrenaline going.

As for your question about self defense hitting a kid, don't know the exact law but I did see my father take a beating in our front yard when he couldn't defend himself against a 17 year old, took my brother and I, 12 and 13 at the time, carrying bats to get the kid off him. As I remember, kid being under age 18 meant my dad couldn't do a thing, except press charges which he did. His face was a train wreck when it was all over.

[rugbysecondrow]

I came across one of these idiots on a ride last week (http://onekgguy.blogspot.com/2010/07/jra.html) . I'm not sure what the net effect of my approach was but to do nothing didn't seem to be an option at the time.

Kevin g

I understand having a less than positive view of cyclists. There are lots of things I see daily that I have a less than positive view of. What I don't understand is acting out on any one of them, especially by being dangerous and the flicking somebody off (which we all know is the equivalent of saying F-you). I think these people are cowards and they only vent like this because they know they would get their dick knocked in the dirt if they acted like that in the grocery store line, at work or pretty much anywhere else. I have never been a fan of giving the finger in the car because if/when that car stops, you better be able to back it up and few things are worth it. Like I said, this guy was a coward and never thought he would be confronted forwhat he did. He will do it again someday, but likely to somebody who will not show the restraint you did. Good for you for keeping your cool.

[William]

I stay away from the bike paths around here.....the squirrels are freakin' vicious...



http://www.trailerparknews.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/squirrel-bites-hand.jpg


Squirrels parenting skills really suck!! :butt:




William


PS: Glad you were fine without having to "school" anyone. Teens can be idiots. I know, I was a teen and I was an idiot on more then one occasion. :rolleyes: