650B tires question

[sevencyclist]

Quick question. I am thinking of getting into 650B randonneur, but wondering about ease of getting tubes. Are there specific tubes for 650B wheels, or do they use the 700c or 26 inch tire tubes? Thanks.

[rcnute]

26" tubes work fine.

[goonster]

26" tubes work fine.
+1.

[Acotts]

26" tubes work fine.

Is that true on MTBs as well?

[palincss]

The Schwalbe 650B tube is marked on the package as fitting the following sizes:

47-559 (26x1.75)
47-571
37-584
44-584
32-590
37-590
44-590
32-597

Depending on the brand, I've had success using 26 x 1.25-1.5 and 26 x 1.5-1.75 tubes. Some of the 1.5-1.75 are a bit on the wide side and are hard to fit into a 38x650B tire without getting the edges pinched under the bead, while other brands fit fine. I have no experience with 650B MTB tires, but I don't see any reason why the same relationship wouldn't hold true.

[Acotts]

I have no experience with 650B MTB tires, but I don't see any reason why the same relationship wouldn't hold true.

I can't tell you how many times I have been burned applying this logic to bikes, ha ha!

[kramnnim]

I (and many others) use 26" tubes in 29" tires, so 650b would also work fine.

[Acotts]

huh? I tried using a 26 in my 29 inch wheel a couple months ago and it was a total fail.

[palincss]

When in doubt, use these: http://www.rivbike.com/products/show/inner-tube-650b/10-066

[I Want Sachs?]

Looks like if one runs out of 650B tubes and stranded on the roadside, one should be able to get by with tubes from MTB riders. Thank god for those MTB riders, they are good for something after all. ;)

[palincss]

I don't like the idea of getting stranded by the roadside, so I carry 3 tubes with me.

[fourflys]

when I had my 650b bike, I used 26" tubes with no problems....

The 650b specific tubes that Riv had were just a bit too much money for no particular benefit...

[palincss]

The 650b specific tubes that Riv had were just a bit too much money for no particular benefit...

It's not like six bucks a tube is all that expensive, and they are a very nice, high quality tube that also happens to fit perfectly, making tube replacement very easy. I've paid as much for other tubes and gotten crap - such as the most recent four Michelin 700Cx28-32 tubes I bought a couple of months ago. They developed mystery punctures on the inside of the tube (rim side) with no corresponding rim-side problem that rim strip replacement didn't cure but new tubes did.

That was very disappointing, as I remembered Michelin tubes (French made, from back in the 1970s) as having been of the very highest quality. I patched some of those old Michelin tubes literally dozens of times, and the valve stems never used to fail.

I've been using Schwalbe 650B tubes since 2005, and have never been disappointed. I'm also very happy with Maxxis Ultralight 26" tubes used in 650B tires. They're about the same price as the Schwalbes, but are significantly lighter.

[sevencyclist]

Thanks for the information. Sounds like it would be good to carry the Rivendell tubes, but can get by with 26" tubes in a pinch. Thanks.

[Kirk Pacenti]

26" tubes work best... they actually fit better, imo.

[Kirk Pacenti]

Is that true on MTBs as well?

yes.

[Wilkinson4]

26" tubes work best... they actually fit better, imo.

+1000 from a guy who knows.

mIKE

[kramnnim]

huh? I tried using a 26 in my 29 inch wheel a couple months ago and it was a total fail.

It takes a few times to get the hang of it. It helps if you inflate the tube alone and let it sit for a few days to stretch...

[fourflys]

It's not like six bucks a tube is all that expensive, and they are a very nice, high quality tube that also happens to fit perfectly, making tube replacement very easy.


don't forget to add in shipping... I can tubes at Performance locally for cheaper and I can say I've never had an issue with thier tubes...

[Acotts]

It takes a few times to get the hang of it. It helps if you inflate the tube alone and let it sit for a few days to stretch...

yeah, this was a trail side change an hour into a NASTY bonk on a 4 hour training ride by myself, out of food and almost out of water, on a single speed, in like 100 degree heat.

Not the best of times.

I was still like 2 miles away from my car with supplies. Luckily a fellow 29er came by and gave me a hand. In fact, he changed my tire for me. I was so tired, I was not even embarrassed.

How pathetic is that?

Still its good to know that I wasn't totally crazy. It really seemed to me that a 26er SHOULD be able to fit.

-Andrew

[palincss]

yeah, this was a trail side change an hour into a NASTY bonk on a 4 hour training ride by myself, out of food and almost out of water, on a single speed, in like 100 degree heat.

Not the best of times.

I was still like 2 miles away from my car with supplies. Luckily a fellow 29er came by and gave me a hand. In fact, he changed my tire for me. I was so tired, I was not even embarrassed.

How pathetic is that?


It doesn't sound pathetic to me, it sounds like you were on the verge of heat exhaustion.

[Frankwurst]

I have two 650b bikes and a set of wheels with tires mounted headed for a 650b conversion and have never bought a 650b specific tube. LBS's in northern Wisconsin look at you with that "What the hell are you talking about?" look when I ask so I just buy the 26's. I have yet to have a problem. :beer:

[goonster]

I have two 650b bikes
I'd like to buy you, and everybody else who has two or more 650b bikes in their stable a beer. :beer:

(Kirk, Grant, Jan and Dr. Brooks get as many as they can handle)

We also have two at chez Goonster, with one more expected shortly. Whoda thunk such a thing was possible just five years ago?

[Acotts]

When I am done paying off my car, I am going to buy some Stans 650b rims, a Pacenti Neo Moto for the front and a Quasi Moto in the back, and convert my Canondale rush to a 650b.

I'm pretty stoked.

Its like getting a whole new bike.

BTW, Kirk, if you are still reading this. On behalf of enlightened MTBers everywhere, thanks for sticking to your guns on 650bs. They make a lot of sense.

[Frankwurst]

I'd like to buy you, and everybody else who has two or more 650b bikes in their stable a beer. :beer:

(Kirk, Grant, Jan and Dr. Brooks get as many as they can handle)

We also have two at chez Goonster, with one more expected shortly. Whoda thunk such a thing was possible just five years ago?

I'd like that. I have one more F/F/HS I'm converting and a custom soon to be built that will be 650b. I'm hooked and not looking back. Not saying I don't have 700's and 26's but if I had to sell them all and keep only one it would be one of the 650b's. Now about that beer. :beer:

[billrick]

I now have two 650B bikes in the house - (1) a Rock Lobster singlespeed with Neo Motos and (2) a Rivendell (Goodrich's old Saluki prototype) with Hetres. Both are absolutely phenomonal bikes.

On the commute this morning I passed a guy on the side of the trail with the rear wheel off of his beautiful 700C Serotta. Asked, as always, "Do you need anything?" He said, "Do you have a tube? My spare was bad." After a pause, he looked at my Birkenstocks, flat pedals, and my 650B Hetre-shod wheel and sadly said, "Oh." I left him with my patch kit. Hope he was okay!

:)

[Joellogicman]

Has me even more impatient about the (admittedly reasonable) waiting period I am in for my custom 650b frame.

I even have my secondary 650b wheel shod with tires at the ready in my closet.

[Acotts]

now, I get why 650bs on MTB are great. Wheel size has a huge effect on how a MTB handles and gets over stuff.

But why do folks want them on road bikes? Is it a tradition thing, or is there a practical reason too? (other than for tiny folks who are scared of too much toeverlap.)

[billrick]

But why do folks want them on road bikes? Is it a tradition thing, or is there a practical reason too? (other than for tiny folks who are scared of too much toeverlap.)

For me, I favor wheel/tire combos that are light, larger diameter, and have a large volume of air. I ride on dirt roads and crushed gravel a lot. Prior to setting up my Rivendell 650B, I was riding a Surly Long Haul Trucker with 26 inch wheels. To get the same diameter as my now favored Hetre tires, I was running a 2.3 inch Schwalbe Big Apple. That tire weighs nearly 1 kg each - it was a portly and slow-to-accelerate tire. The Hetre weighs (I think) around 400g, which translates as "Yippee."

There are other wheel and tire combos that would give me my desired feel (700C and Jack Browns, for example), but the 650B just hits a nice balance right in the middle of the weight/diameter/volume sweet spot.

YMMV and I'd love to hear from others on the question.

:)

[Joellogicman]

But why do folks want them on road bikes? Is it a tradition thing, or is there a practical reason too? (other than for tiny folks who are scared of too much toeverlap.)

I am just under 6'. When I put Schwalbe Big Apples on my 700c Road bike, the bike was higher than optimal. With 650B I can ride wide cush Hetre tires on a bike suitable for my arm and leg length and not be too high off the road.

I will stay with 700c with bikes where my tires will always be less than 35c wide.

[goonster]

But why do folks want them on road bikes? Is it a tradition thing, or is there a practical reason too?
It's the tires. There's nothing like a Hetre or Pari-Moto in 700c.

Some of the riding where performance is most important to me takes place at night, on poorly maintained back roads with rain-filled potholes.

(other than for tiny folks who are scared of too much toeverlap.)
650b doesn't really help in that regard. The smaller rim size is mostly negated by the higher volume tires. The whole "650b wheels are for small people" is a pernicious misconception, atmo . . .

[Acotts]

Now I know.

and....

[billrick]

It's the tires. There's nothing like a Hetre or Pari-Moto in 700c.


I can't wait to try the Pari-Moto. Soon.

BTW, does anyone know if a 650B cyclocross tire is in the works anywhere? Kirk, are you out there? I do really wish my Riv would fit the 2.1 Neo Moto or the 2.0 Quasi Moto. Guess I need a thrid 650B bike.

:)

[bfd]

It's the tires. There's nothing like a Hetre or Pari-Moto in 700c.

Some of the riding where performance is most important to me takes place at night, on poorly maintained back roads with rain-filled potholes.


650b doesn't really help in that regard. The smaller rim size is mostly negated by the higher volume tires. The whole "650b wheels are for small people" is a pernicious misconception, atmo . . .

Agree. I think those with small frames where there may be severe toe-clip overlap will go to a 26" (559mm) wheel size.

One benefit of 650b (584mm) wheels that has not been mentioned is for those interested in converting old "racing-style" bikes from the 80s and 90s with very little clearance to be more useful by allowing more room for fatter tires and fenders. There's a bunch of guys on the ibob list who have done this sort of conversion and really like it.

It doesn't work on every bike, but if you can take a racing-style bike that can only fit say 23 or may be 25mm tire without fenders and then use 650b wheels to get it to fit 28 or 30mm tires with fenders, the bike can be used on more varied terrain in all kind of weather.

Is this a big market? Probably not. But this is a good use of 650b wheels and more options are good.

Of course, the big problem with 650b is that it requires yet another size of tires and rims for many LBSs to carry and I suspect one of the big reasons why big companies like Trek and Specialized don't carry this size.

[billrick]

To answer my own question, I found a post from a very authoratative source on the MTBR forums saying . . . 650x42B Mini-Moto due early 2011. Hooray! Saluki and Bleriot riders rejoice.

Kirk - let me know when you start taking pre-orders.

And re. market size and dealer support for 650b, who cares. If you love 650B like the rest of us, you will hoard enough tires and rims for your grandkids.

:D

[Kirk Pacenti]

To answer my own question, I found a post from a very authoratative source on the MTBR forums saying . . . 650x42B Mini-Moto due early 2011. Hooray! Saluki and Bleriot riders rejoice.

Kirk - let me know when you start taking pre-orders.

And re. market size and dealer support for 650b, who cares. If you love 650B like the rest of us, you will hoard enough tires and rims for your grandkids.

:D

The Mini-Moto is a ways off yet, but I will keep you posted!

Cheers,

KP