SPOILER: TdF Stage 3

[Steve in SLO]

Tough stage!

It was a shame Paul and Phil didn't see Armstrong's flat on the TV screen in front of them. It would have been exciting if a camera had been closer to follow it. It was quite a ride by him and Popo back to a chase group.

Any thoughts on what was going thru Vino's mind as he rode away from Contador at the finish? Seemed like he was making a statement..

[97CSI]

Who knows with Vinokurov? Maybe he didn't know that Contador had a flat. And, if he didn't do it someone else in the group would have, so why give up the time when it would have been no help to Contador for him to hang back.

Too bad for LA. Contador's equalizing flat came about 5k's too late. Good job by LA catching back up to the third group. Tough break for Hesjedal. Terrific ride.

The start of this tour has certainly been more interesting than most.

[Tim]

Contador flatted and it's pretty clear that Vino had no idea and just kept pressing to the end.
Cancellara's riding on the cobbles is amazing!

[Auk]

You'd think the memo might have gotten back to the teams that they needed to beef up the tires of the GC hopefuls?

[Ray]

Yeah, a brutally entertaining stage. I hope Frank Schlek is OK - he looked pretty badly hurt, but its hard to tell from the tv sometime. I thought on the replay of that crash I saw Contador trying to avoid it but then go over the bars and land pretty hard. It was definitely Astana and it sure looked like #1. Whoever it was, he had slowed a good bit before going down, so it probably wasn't a hard hit. Contador was riding up front with those guys so it could have been him. Good on him for getting back up and making it back to the first chase group.

I didn't see Lance flat, but I saw Popo sit up, just as Contador passed him, to wait and pace him back. I don't think Andy Schlek's 30 second or so lead over Contador will mean much either in the mountains or the last TT. But for Lance to be down a minute on those guys at this point is pretty bad for him. If he'd have gone into the mountains with a bit of a buffer, he might have been able to defend somewhat and hold on in the TT, but I just don't see him actually gaining time on either AC or Andy S in the mountains, and probably not Cadel either. I stick to my prediction that Lance is a long shot to podium.

Then again, I wouldn't have predicted much of what happened in the last couple of days either, outside of Fabian finishing in the lead group today. Should continue to be fun to watch.

-Ray

[bozman]

Who knows with Vinokurov?

I think you can expect much more of this over the next two and a half weeks. Today was just the beginning...

[OnceFast]

Question? Where were Leipheimer and Kloden? Did one of them give Lance a wheel or a bike? If they were not with him - why not? Must be some interesting conversations on the Radio Shack bus.

[mschol17]

Leipheimer and Kloden finished 10 seconds back of Armstrong.

[michael white]

They pulled him back within striking range, from what I could see. They did their jobs.

[Tim]

Yes, I think it was Kloden who did a huge job of pulling Armstrong most of the way back to a larger group- he looked toasted- and dropped off and finished a bit back of Armstrong.
Evans clearly is strong- and managed to be in the right group at the end.

[johnnymossville]

Yes, I think it was Kloden who did a huge job of pulling Armstrong most of the way back to a larger group- he looked toasted- and dropped off and finished a bit back of Armstrong.
Evans clearly is strong- and managed to be in the right group at the end.

Yes, Evans is really turning into a great rider. I'm impressed. Tough luck for Lance.

Andy Schleck was smart to stick to Cancellara like glue as well. Hope his Bro Frank is ok.

Great tour so far.

[Bruce K]

The Astana rider doing his best "swan dive" was #7.

Everybody seemed to think it was Contador at first but they corrected it on the replay.

Definitely a tough few days. Lots more drama to come but hopefully all of the upright and pedaling kind.

BK

[Ray]

Yes, I think it was Kloden who did a huge job of pulling Armstrong most of the way back to a larger group- he looked toasted- and dropped off and finished a bit back of Armstrong.
No, I'm pretty sure it was Popo. And once he was cooked then Lance finally rode the rest of the way up to the group he ultimately finished with on his own. I didn't see Kloden with Armstrong at any point in the latter (post crash) part of the stage.

-Ray

[Ray]

The Astana rider doing his best "swan dive" was #7.

Everybody seemed to think it was Contador at first but they corrected it on the replay.

Thanks for the clarification - looked like a 1 to me, but that's an easy mistake to make. So I guess Contador was just riding a bit behind the Schleks and got caught out for just long enough not to be able to hitch onto the first two groups that went up the road. With Lance in the second group and AC in the third, and then AC chased up to the second as Lance flatted and watched him ride by. He must have just HATED that moment.

-Ray

[swt]

No, I'm pretty sure it was Popo. And once he was cooked then Lance finally rode the rest of the way up to the group he ultimately finished with on his own. I didn't see Kloden with Armstrong at any point in the latter (post crash) part of the stage.

-Ray
It was popo. I watched on eurosport today and they covered it pretty well.

Contador was with the Vino group for the last 10km or so. He only popped off the back in the last couple of kms. I honestly don't think vino knew it. He was just pushing up front.

Good effort by lance, but I think he's fuxored.

Looked like a bad crash for Frank S.

[97CSI]

With Lance in the second group and AC in the third, and then AC chased up to the second as Lance flatted and watched him ride by. He must have just HATED that moment. -RayAm sure he did. I certainly would have. Too bad the camera coverage was so poor on that particular event. We only know who towed LA towards the end of his run back up to the third group. Likely come out soon enough if Levy, et al, had any chance to lend a hand. Tough stage and some great individual rides. Cancellara and LA for two. Can see why Aldag was questioning the reasoning behind cobbles so early on. His team is pretty much decimated from yesterday and today.

[MattTuck]

Can see why Aldag was questioning the reasoning behind cobbles so early on. His team is pretty much decimated from yesterday and today.


A lot of people questioned it, including Andy Schleck in a pre-race interview. I'm a bit conflicted about it. I do like that the organizers are trying to make the earlier stages more important for the GC. As a test for the most complete rider, I don't think you can poo poo the hills yesterday or cobbles today.

I am sympathetic to the riders though. The early stages are always twitchy, and I hate to see crashes and mechanical problems lead to significant time gaps and/or injuries that send people home. But what are the organizers supposed to do? It would be really boring (from a GC perspective) if they just spent the first week on wide open, flat roads.

As far as Fabian taking the jersey back from Chavanel, I don't really feel much pitty for the bad luck of the yellow jersey today. He was in yellow, arguably, because Fabian let him yesterday. MAYBE he would have stayed away and had the stage win had there not been a massive crash and resultant neutralization of the race by certain riders, but his gap would certainly not have been so big. So, this was just the universe setting things right.

Hope F. Schleck is ok.

[gary135r]

Today's stage makes me wonder if Andy Schleck hadn't crashed yesterday would Cancellara have been so forceful in neutralizing stage 2.???

[nm87710]

No, I'm pretty sure it was Popo. And once he was cooked then Lance finally rode the rest of the way up to the group he ultimately finished with on his own. I didn't see Kloden with Armstrong at any point in the latter (post crash) part of the stage.

-Ray


Levi and Kloden already flatted on the pave and were behind LA and Popo when LA flatted. Popo earned his paycheck today getting LA back within striking distance to the 3rd group. Points out how lucky LA was for 7 years!

[uno-speedo]

Vino kept pushing because Contador will get the same time...I think.

[blschaefer1]

Today's stage makes me wonder if Andy Schleck hadn't crashed yesterday would Cancellara have been so forceful in neutralizing stage 2.???

Exactly. One could argue that when it is in Saxo Bank's favor Cancellara wants the Peloton to ride "'tempo" so Andy can stay in the race after a crash, but when other GC candidates (LA) have a mechanical, or crash, he is just fine with driving a torrid pace for his teams gain.

[97CSI]

Popo earned his paycheck today getting LA back within striking distance to the 3rd group. Points out how lucky LA was for 7 years!Why lucky? Fortune favors the well prepared. Never been anyone more prepared for the TdF than LA. Was just thinking this morning when looking at some pre-race pic's that I don't recall LA ever looking so gaunt.

[MattTuck]

Why lucky? Fortune favors the well prepared. Never been anyone more prepared for the TdF than LA. Was just thinking this morning when looking at some pre-race pic's that I don't recall LA ever looking so gaunt.

Lucky that he, for 7 years, pretty much avoided serious mechanical issues at key points in the race, and was never forced to withdraw due to crashes. Just looking at the last two years of his riding, he's with drawn from a handful of races due to injury.

I'd agree that LA's run of 7 had as much to do with luck as it did with his preparation.

[97CSI]

I'd agree that LA's run of 7 had as much to do with luck as it did with his preparation.You'll only agree with me if you agree he made his luck rather than relied upon being 'lucky'.

[OnceFast]

If Lance, Levi and Andreas all flatted, was that bad luck or a bad equipment choice?

[MattTuck]

You'll only agree with me if you agree he made his luck rather than relied upon being 'lucky'.

I wasn't agreeing with you, I was agreeing with nm87710 that his 7 years were lucky. (note, I'm not saying his winning was lucky. Just that he was able to stay uninjured for so long, and avoid major mechanical issues.)

I'd be interested to see how many other riders have started and completed 7 straight TDF's. Just getting to Paris requires a bit of luck. Eventually even the best/toughest guy will have to withdraw from the TDF due to a crash. (as they say, "on a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero". Hell, even Jens Voight had to withdraw last year and that took a crash that would kill most mortals.

[97CSI]

Would be interesting to know how many of the 3, 4 & 5-time winners have crashed out of the TdF. Surely one of the reasons this particular selection did win so many was due to their superb bike handling skills. Watching LA dodge the fallen Boloki in '03 being a good example. LA's racing on the cobbles this past spring is good example of preparation.

[JohnHemlock]

Having ridden almost 40 miles of pave in my life (mostly in 3 or 4 mile segments between wine stops) I can say its sort of a wheel of chance. I gave my wife some advice on how to handle the cobbles and I flatted twice and crashed into a hedge. She did just fine.

[MattTuck]

Would be interesting to know how many of the 3, 4 & 5-time winners have crashed out of the TdF. Surely one of the reasons this particular selection did win so many was due to their superb bike handling skills. Watching LA dodge the fallen Boloki in '03 being a good example. LA's racing on the cobbles this past spring is good example of preparation.

So, when he fell last year and broke his collar bone, and withdrew from a race in Spain, or this year when he crashed and had a cut on his face and withdrew from the Tour of California... that was, what? Him holding back on his bike handling skills so he could bust them out at the TDF.

There are plenty of racers in the peloton who are phenomenal bike handlers. Sometimes, they still crash, and sometimes even the most innocuous crash leads to an injury that forces withdrawal. That's not knocking the racer, that's just the way it is sometimes. LA was lucky to not have anything like that happen during his run of 7, that's all I am saying.

[Rueda Tropical]

It was a good day for Astana and Cadel. Andy lost Frank and having Saxo in yellow without his brother is not really a good thing for his GC chances. Team RS took a beating as well in a stage they really needed. Contador just needed to stay upright and did much better then that.. with Vino having a great day as well. AC and Astana are very well positioned now. Evans is having one hell of a year and doing his world champion jersey proud. I hope he makes the podium. Real disaster for Garmin. Really sorry to see Vande Velde and Tyler injured.

I'm not so sure decimating contenders on a short stretch of cobbles really adds anything to the premiere ROAD stage race. I say leave that to the spring classics. Like mixing beer and wine. Each is great on it's own mixed together not so much. Still it makes for some riveting viewing.

[jmc22]

How about a big shout-out to Tyler Farrar for finishing today's stage with a broken wrist he sustained in stage 2!!!!

[davidlee]

I think Andy is about to have his best tour ever bc he doesn't have to worry about big brother when he is/was dropping him on the Cols.
d

[Elefantino]

Harmon and Kelly were talking about carbon wheels and how they weren't such a great idea, necessarily, on the pave. (Unlike Frankie Andreu, who was doing a "commercial" for Easton at roughly the same time.)

Andy Schleck looked like a Tour winner today. Comes back from a bad day, when he could have lost it all, and uses his über domestique to pull him back into contention.

And Cuddles was a beast, too.

Love it.

[giverdada]

a lot of people seem to have plenty to say on velonews regarding the course and crashes of yesterday, and the inclusion of the pave today. horner was pretty quick to blame the organizers for the mass crash on the descent yesterday. voigt was pretty angry about losing frank schleck today. and lots of people are debating the inclusion of the pave at all, mostly talking about how it messes with the GC riders and could/did force large time gaps prior to the mountains.

i guess it all depends on one's point of view regarding the nature of the Tour and bike racing in general, and i am no expert by any means, but i do kind of wonder about pros blaming an inevitability (crashing) of their profession (bicycle racing) on the organizers of a race (getting paid to ride a bike as fast as possible on whatever course is there). i remember a downhill course back in the 90's that was modified overnight because unnamed participants found it was too risky. it was a root section. this was all long before freeriding and north shore popularity and the inclusion of massive drops or jumps in pro DH courses. a few roots? slow down. pick a line. cobbles are cobbles. descents are descents. as long as it's on a bike and flagged, isn't it a race? why is everyone complaining? i'm just wondering what your all's perspectives are.

[dancinkozmo]

...giverdada makes a good point. racing with radios on smooth asphalt roads has caused things to become too boring and predictable...i think the giro gravel road stages and the tdf cobble stages are great for the sport...

[TMB]

The Tour has become largely dull, boring and tedious over the last number of years.

Mostly glass smooth roads, race radios and very little actual "racing" as opposed to simply setting up a train and riding tempo to drop as many people as possible.

That may result in someone crossing the line first, but it really isn't what I think of as racing.

The stage today was exactly what the Tour needs. Unpredictability, excitement and the possibility of catastrophe. Why do those things not belong in the Tour??


Gravel roads and snow are fine for the Giro, but for the Tour we can only have dull smooth pavement?

Especially in what is typically a very dull first week, a stage like this is precisely what the doctor ordered for what has become the tedium of the Tour.

Now if it holds up like this where people compete and actually race - then it will be a very entertaining race ( in spite of Phil and Paul ).

[JohnHemlock]

a lot of people seem to have plenty to say on velonews regarding the course and crashes of yesterday, and the inclusion of the pave today. horner was pretty quick to blame the organizers for the mass crash on the descent yesterday. voigt was pretty angry about losing frank schleck today. and lots of people are debating the inclusion of the pave at all, mostly talking about how it messes with the GC riders and could/did force large time gaps prior to the mountains.

i guess it all depends on one's point of view regarding the nature of the Tour and bike racing in general, and i am no expert by any means, but i do kind of wonder about pros blaming an inevitability (crashing) of their profession (bicycle racing) on the organizers of a race (getting paid to ride a bike as fast as possible on whatever course is there). i remember a downhill course back in the 90's that was modified overnight because unnamed participants found it was too risky. it was a root section. this was all long before freeriding and north shore popularity and the inclusion of massive drops or jumps in pro DH courses. a few roots? slow down. pick a line. cobbles are cobbles. descents are descents. as long as it's on a bike and flagged, isn't it a race? why is everyone complaining? i'm just wondering what your all's perspectives are.

Bah, the first time the Tourmalet was raced, the riders had candle lanterns attached to their forks and climbed 20,000 feet on 32 pound bikes. And boxers would fight 61 rounds, bare-knucked, to a draw. Bunch of sallies these days!

[thwart]

The stage today was exactly what the Tour needs. Unpredictability, excitement and the possibility of catastrophe. Why do those things not belong in the Tour?? Agree. However, I feel bad about Frank Schleck (altho he does seem to have a tendency to crash heavily...).

It was a great stage to watch... actually lived up to the hype.

[William]

The stage today was exactly what the Tour needs. Unpredictability, excitement and the possibility of catastrophe. Why do those things not belong in the Tour??


Gravel roads and snow are fine for the Giro, but for the Tour we can only have dull smooth pavement?

Especially in what is typically a very dull first week, a stage like this is precisely what the doctor ordered for what has become the tedium of the Tour.

Now if it holds up like this where people compete and actually race - then it will be a very entertaining race ( in spite of Phil and Paul ).


Agreed. :beer:




William

[thwart]

Just saw this...

Apparently Jens Voigt was not so impressed by the stage today...

http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid28343239001?bctid=109510111001

[Wilkinson4]

Ban the radios and doping, fixed. I think Andy and Cadel were huge winners today. Especially Andy as I think that will give him a huge boost and now he is really on his own. Props to Cancellara for being the perfect teammate.

Lance rode his legs off today at the end. Very impressive I think but he may have some issues considering he was so isolated after popo couldn't keep up the pace. But, I think a top 5 for him would be a helluva Tour IMO.

Vino riding Contador of his wheel, that was great. I want to see Contador in and interview say, "That wasn't according to the plan". Flat tire, just saw it.


mIKE

[Steve in SLO]

The Gods of yesteryear must be shaking their heads in wonder at the complaining being done by the Gods of tomorrow.

[Jack Brunk]

AC may have won the tour today with an epic ride. When he rips Andys legs off in the mountains no one will remember today's stage.

[Acotts]

AC may have won the tour today with an epic ride. When he rips Andys legs off in the mountains no one will remember today's stage.

Thats what I am thinking. The Berto may have just won the tour and Lance just got knocked off the podium for good.

[BBB]

AC may have won the tour today with an epic ride. When he rips Andys legs off in the mountains no one will remember today's stage.

I don't disagree with this analysis. But, I wonder if having got through the opening three stages whether there will be a slight mental relaxation on the part of some of the riders. If so, that's when a crash will happen or there will be a split in the field similar to the Astana antics early on in the race last year. If not, and barring any misfortune, I reckon you are spot on.

[1centaur]

When the camera's close to AC late in the stage there's an unpleasant noise that I think was the broken spoke. I was wondering why the commentators did not notice it. AC showed he's a strong rider with a strong mentality (I saw him hop on and off a sidewalk when he was squeezed to the side of the road) but I think we already knew that. What I also saw yesterday was Andy breaking the bonds to Frank and blasting away from rivals with Spartacus, two psychological elements that will help him this year and in the future. Lance riding away from Popo tells me he's very strong. Look up the standings from AC and there are only two contenders ahead of him. Look up from Lance in 18th and there are probably 5. Levi, Basso, Sastre are not doing anything this year. Cadel's looking like podium material. Wiggins is hard to figure until we go up. The organizers got a very exciting race with great unpredictability. But it's time to snooze for a while now. Ryder top 10 would be nice for Garmin. BTW, listening to JV on the 8pm show, that guy seems way psychic - his comments read like he'd seen the stage already. If he hadn't, he ought to be paid to comment on every stage. He was thinking time gaps 20 minutes from the end that were about right.

[Rueda Tropical]

Fabian and Andy may have turned in the best performance of any team today but losing the double team of Frank and Andy in the mountains really puts a big hole in the Saxo Tour strategy. Frank was most certainly not a burden to Andy as some are suggesting. His form was looking better then last year and who on Saxo will replace him when the road turns up and AC lights the afterburners? Fabian might want to sacrifice that yellow quick, defending it won't do any favors for AS in the overall right now.

Vino was there for AC and Fabian was most definitely there for AS, where were Levi and Kloden when LA needed them? Without a dominant team I don't think LA has any chance of making the podium. This stage was critical to Armstrong's chances against the climbers and the climbers won.

Lot's of names that were not talked about pre tour will be factoring into the GC going forward and Cadel is looking great.

[Climb01742]

guys who lost time today will be hunting+hoping for crosswinds the next few days.

[Auk]

The Gods of yesteryear must be shaking their heads in wonder at the complaining being done by the Gods of tomorrow.

They're also probably wonder what the big fuss about doping is, as they each had a little 'preparation' back then.

[Onno]

Voight's anger about the stage yesterday certainly makes one sit up and take notice. Certainly his anger is in part a response to losing Andy Schleck, but it's also about the danger and uncertainty that this kind of stage throws into the whole race. Pave, unlike any other aspect of bike riding, throws a huge element of chance into the race. Fans love that, because we watch for unpredictability, for unfolding narratives. Riders, I guess, hate it for the same reason. For them it's unfair, rolling a dice in the middle of a race. I still love it, though.

[sg8357]

Contador traded Lance for Vino, then Vino rides away when AC flats.
Hmmm, didn't anyone tell Vino he's not Czar ? :)

[Ray]

Contador traded Lance for Vino, then Vino rides away when AC flats.
Hmmm, didn't anyone tell Vino he's not Czar ? :)
I'm not ready to jump all over Vino for this one. Contador only had a problem in the last few hundred meters. He no doubt made the decision that he was faster to ride in with a broken spoke (not a flat) causing brake rub than to get it changed at that point. Vino couldn't have done him any good at that point in the race. If I see something different I'll reconsider, but I don't think it hurts Astana or AC for Vino to be well placed on GC at this point, so his actions probably helped and certainly didn't hurt. Contador lost 10 seconds because of his busted spoke. That's gonna be meaningless in the mountains. And Vino couldn't have gotten any of those ten seconds back for him.

-Ray

[michael white]

Looking at Saxo yesterday, I kept remembering Postal. Seldom do we get to see such a great team effort.

Everyone seems to just love that stage. All the contenders were spectacular, as far as I'm concerned.

as for predictions . . . . I see no basis for any confidence with so much ahead.

[97CSI]

My problem with Saxo Bank was they neutralized on Monday when their man was loosing time and then stepped on the gas yesterday when the other main contenders were doing the same. While it was a impressive effort by Cancellara and company, what's fair for the goose is fair for the gander.

[RonW87]

Big props to Ryder Hesjedal for most aggressive "Ryder". Haven't seen a canuck animate a race like that since the Fenwick Flyer, Steve Bauer. I loved Phil's allusion to Bauer's tire-width loss in Paris-Roubaix and raising the possiblity of Ryder making up for that loss with a win on the stage. Even though he came in fourth, it was still a display of power. Hoping for a stage win or maybe a day in yellow out of this guy.

R.

[oldguy00]

My problem with Saxo Bank was they neutralized on Monday when their man was loosing time and then stepped on the gas yesterday when the other main contenders were doing the same. While it was a impressive effort by Cancellara and company, what's fair for the goose is fair for the gander.

Agreed.
If Andy happens to win the tour by a minute or so, he will not have deserved it.
'Spartacus' had no issue racing full on when it suited his team...
Seriously, I hope Andy has a mechanical, and Radioshack go to the front and hammer it..
I'm not saying that the race should have been neutralized yesterday, but it shouldn't have been neutralized on Monday either...

[97CSI]

Agreed.
If Andy happens to win the tour by a minute or so, he will not have deserved it. 'Spartacus' had no issue racing full on when it suited his team...
I'm not saying that the race should have been neutralized yesterday, but it shouldn't have been neutralized on Monday either...+1

[BillG]

+1


Totally different stage. Everyone knew going into the cobbles what was up. The other crashes were due to an oil spill, it was mostly just a sprint neutralization, and almost all the peloton agreed with it.

[SEABREEZE]

Diversaity is the spice of life.Thats what we have in this years TDF, unlike mundane smooth glass rds of the past couple TDF's.

Top riders having to leave,due to going down, others with nasty injuries continuing on.

Just look at all the comments, speculations etc by forum members.

No one is sure how things will unfold, this makes for a exciting TDF

On the other side, dont like to see the riders getting injured. After racing in previous TDF'S many dont have there guards up to the unexpected.

Seen two spectators on the rd with umbrellas up talking to one another. A group of riders came by , one had to go on the outside of them, almost off the rd. Perfect example to the unexpected...

[MattTuck]

Seen two spectators on the rd with umbrellas up talking to one another. A group of riders came by , one had to go on the outside of them, almost off the rd. Perfect example to the unexpected...

Lucky the "badger" wasn't still riding, he'd have punched them as he rode past.

In all seriousness though, things like spectators in the road, or dogs wondering into the path of the peloton should not be the kind of unexpected events that cause crashes, injuries or gaps to form.

[dancinkozmo]

Big props to Ryder Hesjedal for most aggressive "Ryder". Haven't seen a canuck animate a race like that since the Fenwick Flyer, Steve Bauer. I loved Phil's allusion to Bauer's tire-width loss in Paris-Roubaix and raising the possiblity of Ryder making up for that loss with a win on the stage. Even though he came in fourth, it was still a display of power. Hoping for a stage win or maybe a day in yellow out of this guy.

R.

+1 !!!!
hope michael barry can pull something off as well !

[SEABREEZE]

Lucky the "badger" wasn't still riding, he'd have punched them as he rode past.

In all seriousness though, things like spectators in the road, or dogs wondering into the path of the peloton should not be the kind of unexpected events that cause crashes, injuries or gaps to form.

Actually, that was what I was expecting from the rider that had to go around them...

[Ray]

Totally different stage. Everyone knew going into the cobbles what was up. The other crashes were due to an oil spill, it was mostly just a sprint neutralization, and almost all the peloton agreed with it.
Oh yeah, the two are barely comparable. On the first one, the only guy that I heard complain about the neutralization was Thor. Yesterday, nobody complained that they didn't neutralize it. A bunch of guys complained that they shouldn't have a stage like that in the Tour, but everyone knew the rules and there wasn't the kind of mass carnage that they had on Monday.

-Ray

[TMB]

Lucky the "badger" wasn't still riding, he'd have punched them as he rode past.

In all seriousness though, things like spectators in the road, or dogs wondering into the path of the peloton should not be the kind of unexpected events that cause crashes, injuries or gaps to form.

Cycling has always been thus.

The access to the sport is what makes it great.

The only way to change it is to conduct the events in a stadium behind glass.

[MattTuck]

Cycling has always been thus.

The access to the sport is what makes it great.

The only way to change it is to conduct the events in a stadium behind glass.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jN319Fzo5DE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dBvJkqv0DM watch from 4:53


I'm not sure that these moments should be celebrated as what makes cycling great. Access to the sport is a unique aspect of cycling, but (And I can only speak for myself) a race should ONLY be decided by how well the riders and their machines negotiate the conditions of the course and weather.

If you believe that having to deal with spectators in the road and other non race related road hazards (like dogs, oil slicks, etc.) is a legitimate part of cycling, it is a long slippery slope that ends with spectators (or worse) purposely interfering with the race for the benefit or detriment of certain riders. I don't think that is where I want the sport to go.

I'm not saying that you need to run races behind barriers (as even those don't prevent spectators from influencing the race, just ask Thor Hushovd). All I'm saying is that celebrating such things sets a dangerous precedent. People will continue to be idiots and cause crashes, dogs will continue to go out in the course, and I'm sure other things will influence the results of future races. My opinion is not that we need to change the sport to prevent such things, just that we should recognize these as things that SHOULD NOT happen. And if they do happen, we should condemn those involved and hope that they didn't affect the race (through either injury or finishing order).

Ok, getting off soap box. Maybe I am unique for believing this.

[Steve in SLO]

With access should come a sense of responsibility. Unfortunately, that doesn't come across to everyone.
An example: At a local criterium, a friend and I were watching the Pro 1/2 men's race at the bottom of a long downhill straight where the racers were setting up for the turn and were probably passing at 40-45mph. A guy walks up to the barrier with his unleashed dog with his leash draped around his neck. I asked him "You're going to leash your dog, right?" He replied that his dog was a good girl and wouldn't ever cross the barriers. After a few laps with now 10+ of us looking at his dog, then him, then having the dog walk briefly under the barrier onto the course, he leashed the dog. He seemed really pissed at us for not trusting the dog.

[SEABREEZE]

With access should come a sense of responsibility. Unfortunately, that doesn't come across to everyone.
An example: At a local criterium, a friend and I were watching the Pro 1/2 men's race at the bottom of a long downhill straight where the racers were setting up for the turn and were probably passing at 40-45mph. A guy walks up to the barrier with his unleashed dog with his leash draped around his neck. I asked him "You're going to leash your dog, right?" He replied that his dog was a good girl and wouldn't ever cross the barriers. After a few laps with now 10+ of us looking at his dog, then him, then having the dog walk briefly under the barrier onto the course, he leashed the dog. He seemed really pissed at us for not trusting the dog.

Why should you trust his dogs , most municipalities, have a leash law...

Just like the owner of the dog who wandered on the course, and caused many to crash. Assuming the dog wasn't a stray.

Both cases, it boils down to improper management by owners.

[Polyglot]

My problem with Saxo Bank was they neutralized on Monday when their man was loosing time and then stepped on the gas yesterday when the other main contenders were doing the same. While it was a impressive effort by Cancellara and company, what's fair for the goose is fair for the gander.

You can neutralize when you command respect. Respect is earned.