has anyone actually performed a tubeless conversion?

[vqdriver]

i'm looking at the stan's no tubes site and am curious if it's worth trying?
any experiences? thoughts?

[ergott]

I've done it on a set of Kinlin rims. I've also done it on the road and for cross with Stan's 29er rims. I'm currently running a set of Intensive tires for my commuter bike (only 2 days so far).

[MattTuck]

I've asked at several bike shops "if they know anyone running road tubeless." and what their experience has been. And I usually get a response about how racers are the only ones that use tubulars, or like last night, "oh, I haven't run those since the 70's!".

I suspect that the folks on this forum are WAY ahead of the curve, or I'm just talking to really dense bike shops.

[dogdriver]

Yes, works great. Lower pressure, no pinch flats. Extremely messy with Stan's goo, experimented around and settled on half and half Stan's and Slime-- less mess during installation, seems to last longer.

Best, Chris

[CGReid]

I am running Stans with hutchinson cross tires on the converted Fulcrum 7 wheels (OE on my ridley cross bike). It works great, I can run lower pressure and less chance of flats. Tires have not rolled or burped yet.

[gemship]

I've asked at several bike shops "if they know anyone running road tubeless." and what their experience has been. And I usually get a response about how racers are the only ones that use tubulars, or like last night, "oh, I haven't run those since the 70's!".

I suspect that the folks on this forum are WAY ahead of the curve, or I'm just talking to really dense bike shops.


yeah a lot of folks just don't know the difference between tubular and tubeless

[vqdriver]

doesn't that sealant leave a mess inside the wheel, or does it just spin out to the tire and stay there?

[fourflys]

as far as sealant goes, I really like the look of the Caffelatex stuff from (I think) Mariposa... It's supposed to last longer and be easier on your tires as well... I had a chance to check it out at InterBike last fall...

[vqdriver]

when using a tubeless tire with tubeless rim, a la two-way-fit or the DA tubeless, is it true you just install and inflate without any sealant on the bead itself? if that's the case, can you get away with no sealant and carry a spare tube?

[zott28]

If you have to deal with sealant, way not just run tubs and deal with glue? Aren't both offering the same thing, low pressure, lower rolling resistances?

[MattTuck]

If you have to deal with sealant, way not just run tubs and deal with glue? Aren't both offering the same thing, low pressure, lower rolling resistances?

As I understand it, the benefits of tubeless vs. tubulars are primarily on cost and ease of repairing on the road.

Can your tubular do this? http://www.notubes.com/movie_newdemo.php

[Acotts]

I bet you are just like me. You probably need to spend the $100 and try them out for yourself . After using them for 8 months, I just don’t see the benefits.

I did the conversion to some Ops I had laying around. I thought it was okay. I changed it back after 8 or so months. I had to re-fill my tires before every ride. It sketched me out. Nothing annoys me more than having to worry about a piece of equipment when there are so many solid alternatives out there.

I bet its better with the DA tubeless specific rims. Then again, most things on DA rims feel good.

On my Mountain bike, you dont even need the goo or a high pressure pump. You can just fill it with air from a normal pump and get a seal. The goo becomes a bonus and the spare tube is a double-extra insurance plan. That’s what I want to see for the road. (BTW, I have never popped a tire MTBing since going tubeless.)

Not to mention, those Fusions 2's are heavy will make any bike look ugly. I honestly just did not see the advantages. Unless you are using the DA rims, I bet you will still be carrying a tube just in case. And if it turns out that you do need to use the tube, you'll find that it takes 40 effin minutes to get those tires on and off the rim and you will get bike goo all over the place.

Call me unimpressed. It’s just not there yet for the road yet. I don’t know why. It has so much promise.

That said, I am still considering going tubeless on my Sachs CX this season. Apparently the Nuevations have a great seal. We’ll see. I will proceed with caution.

imho and stuff.

-Andrew

[Dave B]

The sealant is jus tthat, it helps seal, but not necessarily a deal breaker.

I have run tubless mtb and cross wheels never road, so I am limited that way. I have used stan's strips, ghetto tubelss (cut inner tubes), stan's yellow tape, etc and all can work set up correctly. Set the wheels up when you was a ike so you can spray off any of the goo, I would say that for any messy tubless product.

I will say the sealant does work and can be the difference in less pressure and flat. I have had tires, rides, and races saved due to the sealant w/o ever knowing it. Stan's has amonia in it and evaporates more quickly in cold.

[Ray]

I did the conversion to some Ops I had laying around. I thought it was okay. I changed it back after 8 or so months. I had to re-fill my tires before every ride. It sketched me out. Nothing annoys me more than having to worry about a piece of equipment when there are so many solid alternatives out there.
Open Pros (I assume this is what you mean by Ops?) are one rim that Stans indicates are problematic for conversion, so that might have been your problem, or part of it. I've run tubeless on two sets of tubeless specific wheels and one set of Ksyriums, which may as well be given the lack of spoke holes on the internal wall of the rim. And I just haven't had any problem with any of them. I have one set that, with or without sealant, I don't have to top off any more than clinchers. I have another set that, with or without sealant, I have to re-inflate before every ride, but they've never lost enough air on a ride to notice let alone matter. The only time I've had to use a 'high pressure' air source or Co2 is on first inflation to get everything seated quickly. After that, a regular pump is all I've needed. I do carry a tube on the road and, so far, after a year of riding tubeless almost exclusively, I've had to use it exactly once. And it was no more hassle getting the tire off the wheel enough to stick a tube in there than changing a shot tube on a clincher would be. The only extra step is taking out the tubeless valve, but that's a 20-30 second job at most.

The short version is that I just haven't seen the downsides you saw. I don't have a problem with the looks of the Fusion 2 and don't find them heavier than most good tire/tube combinations. And I can run 'em about 15 psi softer than clinchers, which makes ALL the difference.

-Ray

[vqdriver]

my 07+ campy eurus wheels have no nipple holes on the tire side.
anyone know how the two-way fit rims are different?

[Acotts]

I hate to derail the conversation. But am I the only one here who likes their tires nice and high pressure?

I get it for CX and MTB. Less pressure means more traction and traction=speed. I get that.

But when I am off to a race or just go on a really hard ride, I always put it up to 105-110 or so. I like the way it feels--hard and fast. (btw, im about 180#)
I hear that performance does not actually suffer, but it sure seems like the bike is more sluggish when the tires have less pressure. When I am in a go fast mood I want a stiff alum frame, stiff wheels and hella pressure. Am I alone here? Is this a product of youth and vigor?

Oh and Ray, I have heard from others that the OPs (yes, your assumption was correct) were problematic. At the time the Stan's site specifically said those rims worked well. My teammates on the DAs were loving the system--I was just a little skeptic since that is a $2,000 setup. It should be fantastic.

Part of my "meh" attitude was the tubeless really was "all that" on the MTB. I was instantly blown away by how well it worked and how easy the sytem was. You just mount the tub, fill it up, and then later you pour in the goo through the removed valve. And bam, you were good for 12 months. And the ride was fantastic and the tire was way lighter. I probably went 3 months before I needed to even add any air to a tire. (btw I am using Maxxis Ignitor on CrossMax rims.) Now THAT makes me randy!!

With the OPs I was just like...meh.

Anyone have any experiences using Nuevations with stans? How is the traction on the cross tires? Is it easy to convert? (the OPs were a real pain.)

[jrflanders]

So I have a new set of AC 420s with Continental high pressure rim tape. Should I removed these before I use the Stan's kit? or can they stay on? Thanks!

[martinrjensen]

Use the Stan's tape if you are going to try tubeless, unless the other stuff is specifically designed to seal the air leaks that the spoke holes would allow. I'm guessing that your current rim tape is there to provide strength only, not sealing. I had a set of 420's with Stan't and they work just fine BTW. I just sold the bike but kept the tiresSo I have a new set of AC 420s with Continental high pressure rim tape. Should I removed these before I use the Stan's kit? or can they stay on? Thanks!

[jrflanders]

But should I leave the Continental rim tape in place or remove it? It doesn't feel like there's a lot of room in there...

[Ray]

But should I leave the Continental rim tape in place or remove it? It doesn't feel like there's a lot of room in there...
Remove it - just use the Stans. It'll provide the strength the Conti tape is already providing (although you won't need the same strength without a tube in there) and, more importantly, it'll provide an air tight seal over those spoke holes. Air tight is a pre-requisite for keeping air in!

-Ray

[bagochips3]

I've been road tubeless for about a year now (Fusion2 on DT Swiss rims). It was a pain to set up the first time and very messy. I'm not looking forward to changing tires when they wear out. I have to top them off before every ride just like clinchers. To me the big advantage is no flats. I have had 0 flats since I went tubeless. To me that's worth the hassles of setting them up and the mess.

I built some wheels with Stan's 29er rims for cyclocross and will try them tubeless next.

[gemship]

I've read that another advantage to tubeless besides lower air pressures and less flats is less rolling resistance. They say that the tubeless tire will actually weigh less than the sum of a premium tire and tube combo and that their is friction created between the tube and tire which in turn has a adverse affect on rolling resistance. It seems to me though that if you have to add some sort of slime or tire sealant to the tubeless that this would add mass and counteract this benefit.

If you want a great tubeless conversion besides making a air tight seal where the spokes join you also have to pay close attention to the rim choice. You need a good seal between the bead of the rim and the tires. I believe that's why the Mavic OP's aren't a ideal choice for this conversion.

[brokenladder]

I've had great experience with tubeless to date using Stan's. See the following thread:

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=60243&page=1&pp=15

I have four sets of tubeless--three using Stan's with Mavic Kysrium and one set of Mavic tubeless-ready mtb wheels. While I like the ride quality, the principal reason that I initially took the plunge was for any improvement in the number of flats that I get with my urban routes. Toward that end, I have been very impressed. Just a data point....

[iffyjoe]

I didn't see much benefit in turning my Mavics into tubeless, but I finally bought a set of ultegra rims on ebay for $400, had a couple Hutchinson Fusion 3's mounted and I love the result. Only have maybe 1500 miles on them so far, but I'll probably never go back to the Ksyriums. Granted the Ultegra is a bit heavier than DA but I can live with what? 6oz's for the 5 or 6 hundred dollar difference. They roll really well, look good and give you a good bit of peace of mind.

[jrflanders]

Thanks Ray, that sounds right to me. I'm going tubeless because I feel like I had a high number of pinch flats when I rode clinchers. Also, probably like others here, I have a weight saving fetish, which is pointless, since I don't race. Yet there I am trying to shave grams off my bike. It's an illness.