Cabin Fever thoughts: Retiring as early as possible in order to better enjoy cycling

[Louis]

This may sound silly, but with the first real snow of the year falling as I type this (about 1" down right now, 1-2 expected total, but it will probably all melt on Sunday) my thoughts turn to something that always comes to me as winter sets in: moving to someplace with nicer weather and having more time to ride. In my case I'm single, no kids (except my two cats) and if I really wanted to allow my cash flow to take a hit I could probably bail on my current job and move to someplace that is closer to the "ideal cycling place to live" than St Louis MO.

In one dream world I'd "retire" early (I'm now 47) and drastically reduce my need for significant cash flow. It's not going to happen any time soon but it's always nice to think that I would retire before my body is completely decrepit and I can no longer enjoy a century.

Your thoughts on riding into the sunset?

Louis

PS, no I have no interest in taking up skiing or some other such foolish activity that is sometimes performed in cold places.

[djg]

I dunno Louis.

Work has sucked for me lately but it still means something more than just the paycheck. I'd love to have some more time for the bike as well as more time for my kids, but I don't really want to retire any time soon and, honestly, as much as I'd love more time on the bike, I don't really want to spend a decade or two riding all day every day. But now I've made this about me, and your post was not about me.

BTW, as long as it's about me, skiing is awesome.

[rounder]

No way. You are an ivy leaguer and much to young to be retiring. You should be out saving the world and riding your bike. I recommend that you forget that you even brought it up for discussion and not raise the issue again for another 20+ years. Having said that, we are looking for 2 feet of snow.

(edited) I dunno, but it sounds like you are looking for real advice. If you have a job that you really don't mind going to every day, my vote is to keep it. Good jobs are hard to find. However, if your job is so bad that it is killing you but you can afford to leave, then you should go to FL and ride your bike. For me, plan to keep on working as long as i can. I need the money, the job's not bad, and i like to work.

[dave thompson]

Louis, how old will you be when you become 'decrepit'? 50? 60? 70? More? Different folks age differently. I know some that are my age who are really, really old. Me, I'm still going pretty strong. Sometimes are stronger than others but strong nonetheless.

I'll bet that you're pretty young for your age. You seem to have a simpler lifestyle. All of which means you're going to live to a ripe old age and most likely be pretty active 'till close to the end.

Someday soon sit down to figure out how much money you'll need to live each year and how many years you genuinely think that you may have left. Multiply A by B and when you have that much money, then you can retire!

Meanwhile I have a small shed in the back that I could put a cot in so you could stay here to ride in cyclist's heaven! :p

[eddief]

Weather for Spokane, WA
35°F | °C
Current: Cloudy
Wind: N at 0 mph
Humidity: 96%Fri

38°F | 32°FSat

36°F | 31°FSun

35°F | 35°FMon

40°F | 26°F

[weisan]

Louis-pal, you should have taken absence from work the last two days and come ride with me. That will stop you from hallucinating.

I rode 2 hrs on Thursday from 1:30 to 3:30.
Starting temp: 51
Ending temp: 51

I rode again 2 hrs today from 10:30 to 12:30.
Starting temp: 45
Ending temp: 45

I didn't know it was going to snow here in St. Louis tonight.
Glad I got the ride in for the last two days.

Sorry pal, I promise to take you out to play again when the snow melts, now quit talking about retiring. :p

[Ken Robb]

in San Diego it's been 70ish this week. We get 9" of rain annually on average so there is rarely a day not fit for riding. But once you get bored with the usual spectacular view rides there are not a lot of quiet rural roads to meander along as in the Finger Lakes of NY.

Housing is still mid-$300,000 for an average home. Taxes are low and some folks never light their furnace all year.

If you kick back early and reduce your income and expenses you may lower your social security income too low for comfort in your later years.

I retired a couple of years earlier than I might have because I could see that the economy was going in the tank and I was not likely to earn much as a real estate broker for a few years. I didn't take SS for a couple of years so I did not reduce my or my widow's monthly benefits. You're so young you may be able to find some job with wonderful benefits and retirement even though the current income might be a little lower than you are currently earning this could be a good deal for you.

Good luck. I think you are wise to consider all your options.

[Louis]

Meanwhile I have a small shed in the back that I could put a cot in so you could stay here to ride in cyclist's heaven! :p

Dave, I've seen pictures of snow piled up in your driveway. I know cycling heaven, and I can tell you sir, that Spokane is no winter cycling heaven.

OK, maybe I need to earn enough to have two homes, one in Arizona/New Mexico/wherever decent in the winter and one in Spokane. The best of both worlds. I'm guessing that if I want to live year-round in Santa Barbara CA I'll have to work a bit longer.

It's just something fun to think about as the snow flies. My job is sometimes frustrating, but we get to design/analyze/build some cool products and in the end it's quite rewarding, with few serious hassles. We do make fun of the guys who seem to have no purpose in life outside of work and end up giving the company their very last drop of blood. There are too many fun things to do in life to be like that.

[dave thompson]

Dave, I've seen pictures of snow piled up in your driveway. I know cycling heaven, and I can tell you sir, that Spokane is no winter cycling heaven.
I never promised you a rose garden.

[Ray]

Louis, you have two questions here - can you afford it financially and would you like all of that free time. One of those only you can answer. The other one, only you can answer!

But at least one is quantifiable and a good accountant can help you work through it based on a bunch of different assumptions. Whether and how you'd enjoy all the free time is a total crap shoot and one you can't really know until you try it.

I'm kind of doing it, except I haven't moved anyplace warm to do it. I'm 50 and have been very very fortunate financially, but part of that is not having a lot of expensive tastes and being able to live comfortably on very little cash flow (by the standards of this forum - I'm filthy rich by the standards of the world's population). I left my job when I was 46 after really enjoying my career for close to 25 years (including internships when I was still in college) but after a couple of years of dealing with a boss that I really couldn't stand working for. After about six months of doing nothing structured (it was March to September - I rode a TON that summer), I got bored out of my mind with not working. I was ok financially and already couldn't see myself going back to a structured 9-5, so I started a consulting business in my professional field and did pretty well for three years until the economy tanked late last year. This year I've done almost zero work and, to my surprise, I haven't been bored at all and I really don't want the phone to start ringing again with work - I realize I was doing it just to have something to do and I really didn't like it that much anymore and the percentage of it I still found interesting had gotten VERY small. I guess i've adapted to having a lot of free time, but it was a process - it about drove me crazy right after coming off of a 9-5 (plus numerous night meetings with boards and commissions). These days I ride plenty (although I've become a fair weather cyclist - when you have this much free time its a lot easier to just ride when its nice out and develop an aversion to riding when the weather sucks) and have found all sorts of other ways to fill my time. Some of them are interesting, some are sort of boring, but I realized I'm no more bored than I was during the occasional slow periods while working and at least I'm bored at something I'm choosing to be bored at and can change what I'm doing if I choose to.

In terms of cash flow, the kids are out of the house and their education is basically paid for and we've gotten our living expenses down pretty damn low. We sold our bigger house and bought condo and own it outright, so BIG savings there. We both drive Hondas (and don't drive them much), so we don't tie up a lot of money in cars. We're not into fancy clothes or furniture, etc, etc, etc. Bikes and travel are my biggest discretionary expenses and I'm not buying bikes anymore it seems so that's not costing much. We don't go out and spend a lot on entertainment. We do eat really well, including eating out reasonably often. Again, the cash flow issues have worked here but only you can figure out were you are financially with such a move.

OK, sorry, this is also waaaay too much about me and not enough about you, but having dome something similar at a similar age, I thought it might be helpful. They psychological stuff is probably pretty similar. The financial stuff is no doubt different, but if you can hack it, give it a try. One big thing to consider - you have lots of contacts and expertise in your career - you can theoretically always go back, so you have that in your back pocket. But once you leave the daily routine of your job and your time is your own, it will be VERY VERY VERY hard to jump back into that level of regimentation ever again. The thought of working again isn't at all frightening or intimidating to me - I did it pretty happily through last year and may do it again at some point, but the idea of having to wear a professional wardrobe and be at an office at a certain time every day and not take breaks at my own discretion and only have X number of vacation days every year - THAT part gives me the willies. And dealing with office politics again - I really doubt I'd have any level of tolerance for that part of the experience again. I really can't imagine getting back to that level of enforced routine again. And the handful of people I know who've done what I've done have all had the same reaction - I'll work again if I want or need to - but on MY terms, not on someone else's terms. So in that sense, you might want to look at it as a nearly irreversible move. Owning your own time is HIGHLY addictive.

So, for whatever that's worth....

-Ray

[weisan]

great post, Ray-pal, very insightful.

[ChuckK]

.....

[eddief]

I work about half time and most is over the phone and via the net. Have not been an employee for many years, but instead have two great long term contractual arrangements; both delivering career counseling. I do phone coaching and deliver seminars in webinar format. One gig is in outplacement which is countercyclical to the economy. Economy bad, outplacement good. So I live in some fear that this gig will diminish as the economy improves. The other gig is with the mba progarm at CAL. Work is consistent as long as the U doesn't get burned down by rebeling students.

Point being, I work 20-25 hours a week, nearly no commuting, no org BS or politics, and just a bit of butt kissing to keep the "work assigners" on my side. I am one who does not need the org or colleagues to converse with or tell me I am doing a good job...and much prefer sweat pants, a phone and an internet connection (sometimes I wear a shirt too). I overuse forums like this for stimulation...perhaps.

The work is intense, especially in this ecoomy, but I do enjoy the helping aspect of the work. More than 25 hours a week and it would be a burn out. In decent weather I am on my bike 5 days a week. Within a mile I can be on the Bay Trail and have a trafficless 20 mile flat roundtrip with views of that fine bridge.

I too lead a very economical life style. Not too much fancy food out, lucky to have a rent controlled house at half the market price, and usually buy used 9 speed bike parts. Vaca these days are credit card tours with the Bicycle Adventure Club. Volunteer-led tours at good prices.

I buy my own health insurance duh and if that could be stablilized or reduced, I could probably retire now. No wife, no kids, no mortgage...and a chunk of income property in MT.

But working half time doing something I enjoy is the best balance I have ever had here at age 59.

[SEABREEZE]

"my thoughts turn to something that always comes to me as winter sets in: moving to someplace with nicer weather and having more time to ride"

"In one dream world I'd "retire" early"

Louis, you are not the first nor will you be the last to have such thoughts. I would not be surprised if half the population in cold climates felt, and dreamed that way.

"Ken Robb in San Diego it's been 70ish this week. We get 9" of rain annually on average so there is rarely a day not fit for riding. But once you get bored with the usual spectacular view rides there are not a lot of quiet rural roads to meander along as in the Finger Lakes of NY"

KEN is absolutely correct , I dont think you can find a better climate than San Diego for year round riding. As a matter of fact, I 'll go out on a limb and say. I beleive its the best climate to live in The US.

"Ken also says Housing is still mid-$300,000 for an average home. Taxes are low and some folks never light their furnace all year."

I think he should also add use air condition. In the summer time it cools down in the evenings, where you open your windows to let the fresh cool air in and sleep with a comforter. In the morning you close the windows and draw the blinds to keep the house cool the entire day. The same applies for winter, but in reverse. Many homes have gas fired fire places, along with sweat pants and shirt, and you are comfortable in your home.

Dont discount skiing in a tee shirt and shorts in the spring time in the Sierra's
Who says skiing is a cold sport.

[Kirk007]

Louis,

You strike me as a very thoughtful guy; I would think it would be really important to keep engaged intellectually. As much as I enjoy riding and diving and play of that sorts, I would get bored with the scenario you have proposed, although there are times when it sounds really sweet.

But more importantly, as I get older, as I deal with a teenager who is trying to figure out what's it all about in this age of uncertainty, I believe more and more in the cliche that its the journey not the destination that is important. My desire and need for a lifestyle that would demand a huge cashflow to maintain has waned. Other than nice bikes, travel money, and lusting over a really good espresso machine - vibiemme super - I don't have many material wants anymore. I look forward to downsizing the house soon, and surrounding myself with meaningful objects, that make day to day more satisfying, be it the bikes, the espresso machine, high quality food, a few nice pieces of art on the wall, but I don't see myself needing to spend much money on things (although health care costs could be a concern).

What I cannot see myself doing, for a very long time, is disengaging from meaningful work. I need to feel that I am contributing to something much bigger than myself. There are so many issues in our world that need smart, committed folks engaged in the quest to find answers; and many of those positions by their nature don't pay all that great. I think that for talented folks that are comfortable financially, the nonprofit world is a great place. They often also allow much more flexible work arrangements than the dog eat dog private sector.

[rePhil]

Like Ray says,only you can answer the important questions.

Florida has been good to us. And while I have year round riding,it's not great. But as much as I hate to admit it,there's more to life than cycling.

I retired (not willingly)at your age. Freelanced a few years. A lot of time to ride and do chores around our house. Got burned out of freelancing, and found a job at a school. No nights, weekends or summers. The biggie for me is insurance.

We live a VERY modest lifestyle. I would prefer to maintain that than relocate to better cycling and be financially burdened.
From all the places I have been, San Diego has the best weather. I just can't afford to live there.

[nm87710]

Good Luck and most of all ENJOY!! :banana: :banana: :banana:

[Louis]

Guys,

Thanks for the thoughts.

There are lots of interesting career / life choices out there. Personally, I try to live well within my means (e.g. my '97 Integra, which I purchased new, just turned over 190k miles yesterday, and as stated in a previous thread, I don't feel obliged to go out and buy the latest fancy toys) so trading $ for better weather and time is an option I may choose sooner rather than later. In the meantime, the snow on all the tree branches does look pretty...

Time to go prepare my fireplace for the gas stove to be installed on the hearth on Tuesday. I have to cut out some steel angle iron to make room for the vents and manufacture a closeout facing to replace the existing folding fireplace doors.

No cycling today (or tomorrow).

Louis

[TAW]

I never promised you a rose garden.

I beg your pardon? :D

[Chief]

I retired at 62 10 years ago and have enjoyed every minute. I found that not having to live according to a schedule was the greatest thing. I do things when I feel like doing them and not when someone else wanted them done. As a friend related to me about retirement: The bad news about retirement is that you have to do something. The good news is just about anything counts. :banana: