Moots Compact vs. Parlee Z4? - help me decide....

[jonjones13]

If you had to have just one bike (and it was one of the above), which one would you choose and why? Help me make the choice :crap:

[1centaur]

The answer revolves around "had to have." If I were to answer based on riding pleasure I'd take the Z4 because I like light and carbon better than any metal bike (98% of the people here probably prefer metal). But if it revolves around "can't afford to break it" or "has to last 20 years and still please me" or "has to be easy to easier to sell if I have to raise cash" even I might say the Moots, which pretty much tells you the answer you will get. Notably, I would not use the chance of corrosion, often used to justify Ti over steel, as a reason to get the Moots over CF.

[soulspinner]

Good answer above. Use in detail would help answer the question-another good problem and no bad answer.

[ahumblecycler]

While I lust after Moots (one day will have my custom), I do not like the new non-standard BB30 utilized in this frameset. As it stands now, standard BB30 allow for shims/adapters so one can use any crank. If I read correctly, this frame does not allow for an adapter. IF true, then the owner will be limited to FSA cranks (hit and miss reviews) and maybe a C-dale pull off.

Food for thought.

[jpw]

Buy the Moots now and start saving for the Parlee for later.

[happycampyer]

I have a Moots Compact SL and a Parlee Z3 (among other carbon, ti, etc. bikes). If I had to sell off all of my bikes and could only keep one (the "desert island" scenario), it would be the Moots, for many of the reasons 1centaur mentioned (although it would be between the Compact and the Psychlo-X, depending on the terrain on the desert island). That said, I got a chance to ride the new RSL yesterday, and I will definitely get one next spring, and it would be the last one standing.

To ahumblecycler's point, I thought that I wasn't going to be a fan of the new bottom bracket, but I am a believer now. Speaking to the Moots rep, I would be able to use Campy on the bike (and rode it with a SRAM crank).

[jonjones13]

I've got both ! I already ride the moots (which is great) and the Parlee was bought off here (forum) and should be arriving in the mail any time now.

The longevity of titanium does give me faith, but the Parlee does come with a lifetime warranty.

Basically I could try both out and see what I like, but I of course will have to endure the costs of getting a bike shop to swap over some components (possibly twice!).

Just interested hearing the opinions of someone who's ridden both in particular....

[derosa_guy]

Is that the Cycle Center of Stamford? If so that's where I got my Moots. Good group of guys in that shop.


I have a Moots Compact SL and a Parlee Z3 (among other carbon, ti, etc. bikes). If I had to sell off all of my bikes and could only keep one (the "desert island" scenario), it would be the Moots, for many of the reasons 1centaur mentioned (although it would be between the Compact and the Psychlo-X, depending on the terrain on the desert island). That said, I got a chance to ride the new RSL yesterday, and I will definitely get one next spring, and it would be the last one standing.

To ahumblecycler's point, I thought that I wasn't going to be a fan of the new bottom bracket, but I am a believer now. Speaking to the Moots rep, I would be able to use Campy on the bike (and rode it with a SRAM crank).

[MIN]

i vote parlee because i am biased. the moots is undeniably timeless and they know what they are doing but i can't think of another carbon maker that fills that niche for carbon as well as parlee (well, nick crumpton too.) the parlee appeals to me on an aesthetic level too because of the subdued graphics.

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e211/gbae007/POV.jpg

[54ny77]

Gee what a timely question by the OP...

Well I *had* a Z4 (it's currently in a box, somewhere on the planet, en route courtesy of the ever-timely US postal service to a guy over in the U.K. named Jon.... ;) ), and I'm headed towards getting a ti bike.

The Z4 ride was nothing short of amazing.

Oh, and having had the pleasure of riding a certain happy guy's Moots compact SL, I can tell you that it's nirvana.

So, which one? Ahh, whichever way the wind blows, my friend...they're both great machines. :beer:

I've got both ! I already ride the moots (which is great) and the Parlee was bought off here (forum) and should be arriving in the mail any time now.

The longevity of titanium does give me faith, but the Parlee does come with a lifetime warranty.

Basically I could try both out and see what I like, but I of course will have to endure the costs of getting a bike shop to swap over some components (possibly twice!).

Just interested hearing the opinions of someone who's ridden both in particular....

[djg]

I've got both ! I already ride the moots (which is great) and the Parlee was bought off here (forum) and should be arriving in the mail any time now.

The longevity of titanium does give me faith, but the Parlee does come with a lifetime warranty.

Basically I could try both out and see what I like, but I of course will have to endure the costs of getting a bike shop to swap over some components (possibly twice!).

Just interested hearing the opinions of someone who's ridden both in particular....

I don't know the specifics of Parlee's offer, but personally, I don't attach all that much value to the typical manufacturer's lifetime warranty. It's a nice statement that the builder/mfg will stand behind manufacturing defects -- things do happen now and again -- but such defects are not all that common when there's serious quality control up front and are likely to surface relatively early when they do happen. More to the point, a warranty against materials or manufacturing defects doesn't typically cover you if you crash the bike, or have it run over, etc. And, of course, with a small company (or even a large one) the warranty may be good for the life of the entity standing behind it, which may or may not be coincident with your own life. For the risk averse, I have to like the Serotta crash replacement policy, but that's not on your short list and the list really has to be yours.

None of this is a slam against Parlee in particular or carbon bikes in general. People seem to really like their Parlees and I don't happen to think that well-made carbon bikes are especially fragile or accidents waiting to happen or any such thing -- as far as I know, they're pretty strong and, under most conditions, pretty durable.

Anything can break under the right/wrong circumstances. And neither bike should fall apart just because you drop it once in a slick corner. OTOH, if you're really concerned about potential damage, and could not afford to replace a frame if it broke, it really might be worth paying attention to the resilience of a good Ti frame -- more likely to survive a greater variety of crashes, all things equal, for what it's worth, etc.

With that done -- you know, whatever really floats your boat. Don't spend several grand on a frame that's not the one you want.

[happycampyer]

If you have (or will soon have) both, I would try to build both up and ride them side-by-side. There are qualities that I'm sure you will like about both. I have ridden the Z4 and it's a great bike. There are those who consider it heresy that Parlee would outsource production, but I think that Bob has done an amazing job of translating his vision into a production bike.

[happycampyer]

Is that the Cycle Center of Stamford? If so that's where I got my Moots. Good group of guys in that shop.
It is indeed. Totally agree, they are a great bunch of guys (and gals).

[jonjones13]

I knew this would happen :)

some parties like one and others like the other (what my two minds are saying!)

I think I will have to ride them side by side to make a proper comparison. I'll report back if and when I do. Campy 11 drivetrain so need the bike shop to transfer components as I just will not shell out for the 11speed chani tool - how much !?!

Thanks for the advice/comments guys - keep 'em coming...
Jon.

[Pete Serotta]

The Z4 was a big hit at the DEMO events at Ride the Rockies. In fact one of the folks working the MAVIC & Hincapie booth bought one of the DEMO bikes with Campy on it.


The selection of which one is best for you is really personal for both are VERY nice.

- Which one puts the smile or your face and the desire to get out and ride?
- Which one meets your intended riding purpose? They both will work in most situations
- if you are planning on keeping it many years and it is to lead a hard life - than the MOOTS meets that criteria the best.
- If a 15 lb bike without pedals is your desire - than the PARLEE meets that criteria.

Have fun with the selection process. PETE

[false_Aest]

sell them both and get a bride from Russia.

[happycampyer]

The Z4 was a big hit at the DEMO events at Ride the Rockies. In fact one of the folks working the MAVIC & Hincapie booth bought one of the DEMO bikes with Campy on it.


The selection of which one is best for you is really personal for both are VERY nice.

- Which one puts the smile or your face and the desire to get out and ride?
- Which one meets your intended riding purpose? They both will work in most situations
- if you are planning on keeping it many years and it is to lead a hard life - than the MOOTS meets that criteria the best.
- If a 15 lb bike without pedals is your desire - than the PARLEE meets that criteria.

Have fun with the selection process. PETESo true (except that my Moots is 15 lbs without pedals). You really can't go wrong either way.

Regarding durability, I know that Moots occasionally inspects frames that have survived car accidents, and often the frames are still aligned. This isn't just a Moots phenomenon, but a quality of a really well-built titanium bike. I'm sure that Tom Kellogg, IF, Serotta etc. can tell similar stories. I recently saw a ti bike (pretty sure it was a Legend) that hit an overhanging tree while on a roof rack of a car and the frame was unscathed.

The smile-on-the-face test is the best test of all. The Russian bride may be a contender. :)

[Ken Robb]

You might also consider contacting Hampsten. Their ti bikes are built by Moots or by Moots' founder. I have a ti Strada Bianca built by Moots with their YBB rear end. It is a wonderful ride and very versatile as it has canti brakes and clearance for 35mm tires though I usually run 700x25.

It has a fine paint job that I prefer to the standard Moots dull finish. Several of my pals have ridden the bike and everyone LOVED it. I mean, really LOVED it beyond just being polite to the owner. Our own PB Wrench, who has lots of experience with nice bikes, told me he'd buy it immediately if I ever decide to sell it. He will probably be dealing with my widow on that deal.

I had a stock Legend with O2 fork. It was a wonderful bike to. A magical ride with a springy feel for comfort but no BB flex and no wobbles. How does Serotta do that? No matter, I sold that to a pal Of PB Wrench. I have a lot of bikes and the Hampsten did everything the Legend did on skinny tires plus it had the ability to take fatter tires and an even cushier ride. There was a slight weight "penalty" to the Hampsten but not enough for me to notice when riding.

If a Serotta ti fits your budget and you can't miss there either. I have never ridden a Serotta, ti or steel, that wasn't a fine bike.

Now that I think about it, carbon Hampstens may be built by Parlee.

[Jeff N.]

Between a Moots and a Z1, the Moots would go.
Between a Moots and a Z4, the Z4 would go. Jeff N.

[OtayBW]

sell them both and get a bride from Russia.
I'm guessing that either bike will last longer that a bride from Russia.... :rolleyes:

[54ny77]

And be cheaper. :)

I'm guessing that either bike will last longer that a bride from Russia.... :rolleyes:

[Keith A]

I'm guessing that either bike will last longer that a bride from Russia.... :rolleyes:I wonder what their policy is for a replacement warranty :D

[Satellite]

The longevity of titanium does give me faith, but the Parlee does come with a lifetime warranty.
Jonjones13,

Does the Parlee lifetime warranty even apply to the second owner? The Moots warranty only applies to the original owner. I would keep the Moots but I am biased and I have never ridden a Parlee.

I knew I could count on Happycamper to buy a VaMoots RSL. I will live vicariously though him at the moment, but I am sure I will end up with one!

Satellite

[54ny77]

yes you can buy a 2nd owner warranty from parlee. check with them on pricing based on the model.

[Satellite]

yes you can buy a 2nd owner warranty from parlee. check with them on pricing based on the model.
Wow that is pretty cool, Airborne did that too but once out of business warranty is void; DARN. Not saying Parlee will be going out of business anytime soon.

[thwart]

Just happened to read this in Red Kite Prayer... Padraig says (re his experience at Interbike):

I’ll draw another comparison that is true in the extreme, but unfortunately disconnected from any experience most of you have had. At Outdoor Demo, I rode both Parlee’s Z5 and Z4. The Z5 was a stunning success. It had the sensitivity of road feel that fewer than a half dozen carbon fiber bikes I’ve ridden have exhibited. Truly, an outstanding bike. The Z4, on the other hand, though roughly $1000 less in retail pricing, was pretty dead. It was stiff and it was light, but it just wasn’t sexy. The Z5 was Pam Anderson in spray paint while the Z4 was Pam Anderson in … burlap sack. Personally, I think they should discontinue the Z4. No one should be allowed to confuse that bike with just how good a Parlee really is. If you need to buy based on price, there’s Specialized and Felt.

[Ti-Boy]

I have a Parlee z1 and a Moots Vamoots. Parlee is the "A" bike. But if I could only have one, it would be the Moots for durability reasons. Hope I never have to make that decision.

[54ny77]

"not sexy" as to why the z4 is no good? too funny. read the accolades put out about the z4 when it came out, and judge the ride based on that, not some brief interbike orgy.

150 gram savings is nice, but come on...that's a trip or two to the bathroom after a couple cups of pre-ride coffee...

but hey, what do i know...i'm biased... :rolleyes:

my team will have the option of z5's this year so i'll hear of (or experience) them firsthand.

Just happened to read this in Red Kite Prayer... Padraig says (re his experience at Interbike):

I’ll draw another comparison that is true in the extreme, but unfortunately disconnected from any experience most of you have had. At Outdoor Demo, I rode both Parlee’s Z5 and Z4. The Z5 was a stunning success. It had the sensitivity of road feel that fewer than a half dozen carbon fiber bikes I’ve ridden have exhibited. Truly, an outstanding bike. The Z4, on the other hand, though roughly $1000 less in retail pricing, was pretty dead. It was stiff and it was light, but it just wasn’t sexy. The Z5 was Pam Anderson in spray paint while the Z4 was Pam Anderson in … burlap sack. Personally, I think they should discontinue the Z4. No one should be allowed to confuse that bike with just how good a Parlee really is. If you need to buy based on price, there’s Specialized and Felt.

[MTrimmer]

Great question. I'm currently debating between a Crumpton SL, Parlee Z3, Serotta Ottrott, and Kent Eriksen custom.

For your question - I think I'd lean towards Parlee, but mainly because I already own a Ti bike (although not a Moots). I'd probably go with Z3 or Z2 rather than Z4.

Does anyone on forum own a Crumpton? I saw him and his work at NAHBS last spring - beautiful bikes. Very understated graphics/logos. Gorgeous work on frame. I've read a few reviews on line, but would love to hear from an owner how it rides.

Mark

[14max]

*****

[Pete Serotta]

Both wonderful rides....... :) ;)

[MsRN]

You mean, Parlee is modding Bimmers now? If you decide to go that route, I recommend a Z4M as base material.

Just kidding, of course, as I've not been on either bike. It strikes me that you'd be hard-pressed to go wrong with either maker, though. But, if you MUST choose, leave price out of it; buyers remorse is a HORRIBLE affliction, and totally avoidable.

I'm serious about the Z4M, though; if I could afford a less-practical Bimmer (I drive an '05 E46 330i ZHP), I'd be all over it! :D

Good Luck!

M :)

[Ken Robb]

I'd ride what Andy'd ride: http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/article/pro-bike-andy-hampstens-cycles-strada-bianca-ti-16577

"...Hampsten’s primary road rig is a Moots-built Hampsten Cycles Strada Bianca Ti..."

"If I had one bike, this would be it," he said. "I ride this 90 percent of the time."

me too :beer: