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View Full Version : Pursuit, madison to be eliminated from Olympics


fiamme red
09-27-2009, 12:01 PM
http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest/398662/olympic-track-shake-up-what-will-it-mean.html

At least we can look forward to golf in 2016. :crap:

Auk
09-28-2009, 09:57 AM
This is an insane move by the IOC.

BdaGhisallo
09-28-2009, 12:09 PM
Actually, it's probably the UCI who decided what to cut. The IOC largely looks to the International Federations to determine what gets on the Olympics schedule once the athlete numbers are allotted out.

benb
09-28-2009, 12:19 PM
I'm sure worldwide golf is accessible to more people then Pursuit or Madison.. even if Golf is incredibly exclusive and inaccessible.

They seem to often cut/include events based on their relevance to the whole world and accessibility to large percentages of the population.

Cycling is very accessible, velodrome events are most definitely not. Most of us cyclists will never get to ride in a velodrome.

Ozz
09-28-2009, 12:34 PM
I'm sure worldwide golf is accessible to more people then Pursuit or Madison.. even if Golf is incredibly exclusive and inaccessible.....
Only if you think all golf is played at resorts & private clubs.

Most golf is played at municipal courses or public courses. Shoot, I've played at a course a farmer built into his fields...

They only put the fancy golf on TV.....

:beer:

malcolm
09-28-2009, 01:18 PM
I'm sure worldwide golf is accessible to more people then Pursuit or Madison.. even if Golf is incredibly exclusive and inaccessible.

They seem to often cut/include events based on their relevance to the whole world and accessibility to large percentages of the population.

Cycling is very accessible, velodrome events are most definitely not. Most of us cyclists will never get to ride in a velodrome.


How do you explain curling? I admit I watch it during the olympics.

Blue Jays
09-28-2009, 01:40 PM
I'm thinking that they also focus on what works on television compared to "live" action.
Madison races might be challenging for audiences seeking to follow on a smaller screen.

David Kirk
09-28-2009, 01:48 PM
As I understand it the IOC gives the UCI a certain number of event slots and the UCI picks what events will run. I think they are trading out some events for others.

Still sucks IMO.


Dave

torquer
09-28-2009, 01:56 PM
They seem to often cut/include events based on their relevance to the whole world and accessibility to large percentages of the population.
I guess that explains dressage. :confused:

Nathanrtaylor
09-28-2009, 02:09 PM
This is an insane move by the IOC.


They are changing their name to IDOC ;)

sg8357
09-28-2009, 02:45 PM
I guess that explains dressage. :confused:

To the people at the IOC, dressage is a lot more common than stick ball.

The national OCs are mostly drawn from the ranks of the local kleptocracy.

Karin Kirk
09-28-2009, 03:32 PM
I dig dressage, stick ball, curling, Madison and all the other obscure sports that get their moment in the sun at the Olympics. From the TV point of view, not much of this matters to the viewer, since they'll never show any of those sports. Instead we'll get to watch the ice skating practice sessions and the gymnastics 'gala' which is a made for TV event that takes place after we've already watched 190 hours of gymnastics. I'd really enjoy seeing more time spent on the random events; they can be so interesting.

dd74
09-28-2009, 05:07 PM
Badminton, ping pong -- hardcore. :beer:

endosch2
09-28-2009, 05:52 PM
I wonder how you explain half of the winter sports? Ski Jumping, Biathalon, and Curling are so accessable to the majority of the world.....not.

rounder
09-28-2009, 10:13 PM
I dig dressage, stick ball, curling, Madison and all the other obscure sports that get their moment in the sun at the Olympics. From the TV point of view, not much of this matters to the viewer, since they'll never show any of those sports. Instead we'll get to watch the ice skating practice sessions and the gymnastics 'gala' which is a made for TV event that takes place after we've already watched 190 hours of gymnastics. I'd really enjoy seeing more time spent on the random events; they can be so interesting.

Me too. i worked on a job in salt lake city a few years ago in the summertime. we went to park city on the weekend and saw a sign for the olympic training village. So, we went there. there was a bobsled run where the sleds were riding on rollers (i guess). other folks were skiing down the hills on no snow. my favorite was where there were ramps set up for aerial skiing with a pool down below. anyone who wanted to could take lessons and ski down the ramp and jump and end up in the pool. a few of them were very good. one guy kept going down the biggest ramp over and over. each time, he would do a triple flip with a twist and land on his feet in the pool. we watched him for over an hour. when the olympics came, i watched to see if he was there and believe he was on the team. never got his name, but he was so good that he had to have been there. meanwhile, while watching the runs of others, i thought it was really cool that a lot of folks on the us team were listening to their ipods while they ran their runs.

keno
09-29-2009, 06:58 AM
Animals have feelings, too.

BTW, as one who owns a farm with a stable full of dressage horses, I could care less, or more, if they eliminated the events. Elimination of horse events would mean elimination for me of events my wife would instruct me to find and DVR and thereby lose valuable "Family Guy" time.

keno

fiamme red
09-30-2009, 03:00 PM
I'm sure worldwide golf is accessible to more people then Pursuit or Madison.. even if Golf is incredibly exclusive and inaccessible.Golf and tennis shouldn't be in the Olympics. Winning a gold medal is no bigger deal than winning a Grand Slam like Wimbledon or Masters (actually, it's less, because there's no prize money).

If the UCI decided to eliminate the road race from the Olympics, it wouldn't bother me too much. Road cyclists have many opportunities throughout each season to shine, but the only time that track cyclists get their hour in the world spotlight is in the Olympics. Besides, the Olympic Games were originally intended for "amateur" athletes, and track cyclists are much more "amateur" than road cyclists, because no one gets paid large amounts of money for winning a gold medal in pursuit or kilo (unless they're then signed by a road team).

Onno
09-30-2009, 03:17 PM
Golf and tennis shouldn't be in the Olympics. Winning a gold medal is no bigger deal than winning a Grand Slam like Wimbledon or Masters (actually, it's less, because there's no prize money).

If the UCI decided to eliminate the road race from the Olympics, it wouldn't bother me too much. Road cyclists have many opportunities throughout each season to shine, but the only time that track cyclists get their hour in the world spotlight is in the Olympics. Besides, the Olympic Games were originally intended for "amateur" athletes, and track cyclists are much more "amateur" than road cyclists, because no one gets paid large amounts of money for winning a gold medal in pursuit or kilo (unless they're then signed by a road team).

I agree with this completely. The Olympics ought to be reserved for those sports that don't otherwise get a lot of time in the sun (or snow), but still have a sizable number of athletes from many countries who do them. I'd also give some weight to tradition. Squash yes, golf no. Track cycling yes, road cycling, not so much. Curling yes, ski ballet, no.

Ozz
09-30-2009, 04:35 PM
I agree with this completely. The Olympics ought to be reserved for those sports that don't otherwise get a lot of time in the sun (or snow), but still have a sizable number of athletes from many countries who do them. I'd also give some weight to tradition. Squash yes, golf no. Track cycling yes, road cycling, not so much. Curling yes, ski ballet, no.
although I also agree completely, it is easy to lose sight of the sole purpose of the Olympics..............to make a lot of money!!!

For the IOC, sport orgs, TV networks, advertisers, etc....

They are going to put on TV whatever draws the views....unfortunately, that is ice dancing and anorexic pre-teens in tights jumping around on a mat.

:cool:

acorn_user
10-01-2009, 08:52 AM
If they introduce an omnium, that event will feature a points race anyway. So it would only mean losing the madison, which is a pity. I like the events that favour the smaller nations, and the madison is one of them.

fiamme red
10-01-2009, 09:04 AM
If they introduce an omnium, that event will feature a points race anyway. So it would only mean losing the madison, which is a pity.The omnium is a supposed test of best all-rounder. If it's not a big deal that the kilo and pursuit have been dropped because they're included in the omnium, by the same argument it wouldn't be a big deal to drop the 400 meter race or javelin throw, since they're included in the decathlon.

fiamme red
10-13-2009, 01:14 PM
Well, golf and rugby were approved for the 2016 Olympics. :crap:

Meanwhile, Taylor Phinney is understandably upset about the elimination of the pursuit:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/blogs/taylor-phinney/rebound

2009 will be remembered as one giant roller coaster ride and a whole series of rebounds. Some incredible high points and some really devastating lows. I've had some really tough luck, crashes, a lot of illness and most recently – some really bad news from the UCI Track Commission who are threatening to destroy endurance track cycling...

But all of that happened under the new cloud looming over my future. Out of the blue – like a bolt of lightening - came the news that the UCI track commission voted to eliminate the Olympic endurance track events, including the Madison, the Points race and the Pursuit. Their reasoning is gender equity (all but the Madison feature women's events) and marketing (ie, make it sexier). What? They've effectively made track cycling a sprinter's domain and excluded the great road riders – like Mark Cavendish – from performing on the Olympic Oval.

The pursuit is the purest of the pure in terms of time trials in cycling. No gears to change, no brakes to hit, just you and the lap counter. The new crop of upcoming riders includes guys who have all ridden fast enough to have medaled in Beijing. I was looking forward and I had made a road map to get me to London 2012. I had sponsors, USA Cycling and my team boss Lance Armstrong backing me in my mission. And now - what? The track was a stepping stone for me to the road – but I was enjoying the purity and the simplicity and it gave me opportunities very early in my pro career.

I'm hoping for divine intervention to keep my event in the Games and to honour those who have gone before me. Wiggins, Boardman, Hegg. I wanted to be added to that list. The International Olympic Committee will convene in December to decide the fate of endurance track cycling. I hope the fates are on the side of purity over show and power over beauty. But if not, I'll refocus and rebound. If nothing else, I've learned a lot about rebounds this year.

rugbysecondrow
10-13-2009, 01:35 PM
Well, golf and rugby were approved for the 2016 Olympics. :crap:



I can't speak for Golf wordlwide, but Rugby is close to soccer as far as popularity worldwide. The only rub is that they chose 7's rugby rather than 15's. They did this because it is easier to get matchs in and grab the attention of viewers I bet. The equivant of 5 on 5 in basketball verses 2 on 2. Pace, scoring, breakaways and defense is different. Is a blast to watch and play though. Watching a Rugby match is much better than football. They are nearly ruining football with all the tv timeouts, stops in action etc. Rugby, two halfs non stop action...good times.

palincss
10-13-2009, 04:15 PM
I wonder how you explain half of the winter sports? Ski Jumping, Biathalon, and Curling are so accessable to the majority of the world.....not.

Do the majority of the world even have "winter" as we know it? '

fiamme red
10-19-2009, 11:39 AM
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wiggins-opposes-revised-olympic-track-programme

"They've changed the program now, given the women a load of events. It's a shame, it will probably end up killing off track endurance cycling," Wiggins told the Brisbane Times...

"We're pawns in their game. We're just riders, it doesn't matter what we think," Wiggins told the Brisbane Times. He said the new programme was unfortunate "for the younger guys".

goonster
10-19-2009, 11:50 AM
Do the majority of the world even have "winter" as we know it? '
By area, yes.

Vancouverdave
10-20-2009, 10:10 AM
So, someone please explain BMX in the Olympics to me--it's pretend motorcycle racing for baby rednecks who more often than not do not age into road or mountain cycling. Today's 10 year old BMX'er is more likely to be tomorrow's 35 year old pickup driver who throws beer bottles at roadies.

fiamme red
10-20-2009, 10:22 AM
So, someone please explain BMX in the Olympics to me--it's pretend motorcycle racing for baby rednecks who more often than not do not age into road or mountain cycling. Today's 10 year old BMX'er is more likely to be tomorrow's 35 year old pickup driver who throws beer bottles at roadies.It must be about the crashes, otherwise who would want to watch adults wearing silly helmets riding kids' bikes around a bumpy track? I saw a BMX race on Universal Sports a few weeks ago, in which one of the riders slipped in a turn and took out 3/4 of the field. I guess that the IOC feels that they need to borrow from the X-Games to remain "relevant" to today's youth (i.e., get sponsors that target the X-Games crowd, like Red Bull).

rugbysecondrow
10-20-2009, 10:30 AM
So, someone please explain BMX in the Olympics to me--it's pretend motorcycle racing for baby rednecks who more often than not do not age into road or mountain cycling. Today's 10 year old BMX'er is more likely to be tomorrow's 35 year old pickup driver who throws beer bottles at roadies.

I get that you think BMX is stupid, but ask most people and I think they would find it more entertaining and athletic then the cycling events that were removed.

As for your attempt to insult these athletes, it seems pretty shallow and petty.

fiamme red
10-20-2009, 10:34 AM
I get that you think BMX is stupid, but ask most people and I think they would find it more entertaining and athletic then the cycling events that were removed.I don't know about "more athletic," but I agree that BMX crashes are entertaining. Maybe they could unleash some dogs and squrrels on the BMX track, which would make it even more entertaining.

Monthly Payment
10-20-2009, 11:39 AM
I'll add my $.02 about the elimination of mens track events.

The key thing to keep an eye on is how many medals and athlete spots there are for cycling. This is what the IOC and UCI need to adjust. UCI obviously wants to generate as much publicity with their spots as they are alloted.

Going back to 1996 and 2000, the UCI added track events like the madison, keirin (with lobbying from the Japanese Keirin industry), and Olympic Sprint events cutting spots that were for the mens road team time trial. Ultimately if the kilo, pursuit, and madison are eliminated, we will have as many or more track spots as we had in 1992.

The elimination of mens events will benefit women's track cycling by giving them more spots. I can only hope the UCI is thinking big picture and did their homework. I hope that they believe in the potential to increase women's track cycling. Personally, I don't know if it is. Its very possible that women's track cycling is closer to its cap than not. I hate to say that based on my experiences holding additional women's specific races doesn't always increase participation.

In regards to the points race still being part of the omnium, the best points racers are not necessarily the best time trialists and conversely the best time trialists are not great mass start racers. I would like to see Taylor Phinney get a shot at the pursuit but he's getting better at mass start racing. I think he'll get a medal in the omnium but I would like to see either the pursuit stay in the Olympic program or the US to develop a team around Taylor.

BMX is pretty exciting to watch. It involves athleticism, strength, and bike handling skill. I'm willing to bet that without a lot of training, any of those Olympic BMX guys would be really good road sprinters.

Cycling fans need to focus on how we want our sport to grow and the direction of sport. Fighting and downplaying the ability of other athletes in other sports who spend as much time and commitment on their sport doesn't add any value to the discussion. Cycling needs to figure out if we want to prioritize our spots on women's events, endurance track, sprint events, road, mountain cross, etc.

The elimination of endurance track events won't kill off endurance track cycling. At least I hope not. The lack of Olympic status doesn't seem to be hurting cyclocross in popularity and participation. Maybe if the people who care about track cycling focus on participation of popularity of track cycling, Olympic status will take care of itself.

Brian Smith
10-20-2009, 07:23 PM
To me, it seems like the cap/limit on the number of olympic cycling events in the climate of strongly increasing variety of cycling disciplines is the real problem. It's not a simple problem, for sure, but that doesn't mean that the best decision has been taken. It's probably a small privilege to be in the position to make that call.

fiamme red
11-17-2009, 12:34 PM
If they introduce an omnium, that event will feature a points race anyway. So it would only mean losing the madison, which is a pity. I like the events that favour the smaller nations, and the madison is one of them.http://www.velonews.com/article/100029/removing-individual-pursuit-from-the-olympics-is-a-mistake

I understand that the event being considered to replace the pursuit, one of the most prestigious events in cycling history, is a new event called the omnium — which has very little support from the athletes, some of whom regard it as a “joke.” Featuring five different races, including a 200-meter sprint and 1km time trial, the omnium has generated very little enthusiasm in the three years it has featured at the world track championships, whereas the pursuit has a 70-year legacy and is the only cross-over event truly accessible to both road and track racers.