Yet another wheel poll

[Mr. Butterworth]

I have narrowed down my next wheel purchase to these two... help me out a little.

[Ozz]

Ask Keno what he thinks about Velomax wheels..... :no:

Some folks swear by Topolinos (one of the Kevin/Kevan's)....kinda funky looking for my tastes...

I take my new DT Swiss (RR 1.1 rims / 240s hubs / 2.0/1.8/2.0 spokes / brass nipples) for a spin tomorrow. Eager to see how the ride compares to the (firm and fast) ride of my Campy Eurus wheels - same tires on both (23mm GP3000's, all black).

Waiting for my Dugasts to put on my tubular wheels (Mavic Reflex rims / Chorus hubs / Revolution spokes / brass nipples). Mr Jerk put them in the mail yesterday....still deciding between Tufo tape or glue....

I think picking the components for wheels is more fun that just getting pre-made set....

[RichMc]

I have the Velomax/Circuits on one bike - nearly bombproof and good wheels -- a friend of mine has the Ascent II's and has had a couple of problems with them over the last two years. Spoke broke one time & he got super fast service from them in fixing it (1 week turn around time) but then recently he found a funny "crack" running laterally in the brake surface. Not really a crack but an odd deformation, certainly ridable and not the crack running from the nipple hole that others talk about. I've ridden the Ascents and they are nice. They can take either Shimano or Campy. The Circuits take only Shimano. I run Campy Eurus on my Seven and the buddy with the Ascents just got Campy Eurus Carbons to replace the Ascents. The Eurus is great, although it's a pain in the butt to change a tire.

[mad_mark]

I have the Velomax/Circuits on one bike - nearly bombproof and good wheels -- a friend of mine has the Ascent II's and has had a couple of problems with them over the last two years. Spoke broke one time & he got super fast service from them in fixing it (1 week turn around time) but then recently he found a funny "crack" running laterally in the brake surface. Not really a crack but an odd deformation, certainly ridable and not the crack running from the nipple hole that others talk about. I've ridden the Ascents and they are nice. They can take either Shimano or Campy. The Circuits take only Shimano. I run Campy Eurus on my Seven and the buddy with the Ascents just got Campy Eurus Carbons to replace the Ascents. The Eurus is great, although it's a pain in the butt to change a tire.

That "crack" may not be "rideable"! It's possible the braking track of the rim could blow out from the pressure of the bead behind it causing an accident if it is in fact a crack caused by any number of reasons. Even if it's just a deformation, it's possibly not safe. Get it checked properly, he may not hurt himself in the result of an accident, but someone else, would you want to be riding on his wheel?

[CarbonTi]

I think that no pre-built wheel is worth the additional cost over a well made set of hand-builts - none of the so-called boutique wheels push the envelope other than from a marketing perspective. Lightweights and ADA's are the only wheels that are exceptions to this as they are in a completely different league performance-wise, but they're not wheels useful to mere mortals.

Find a good wheel builder, spec some nifty parts and have a servicable, high performance wheel built. The blokes that think Ksyriums are the end-all and be-all of high end wheels will be perplexed and you can just shrug. I like exotic wheels too. My latest wheel project involves Tune hubs, Cx-Rays and DT R1.1, my set of pseudo-Ksyriums.

[Chief]

I replaced my Velomax Ascents II with a set of Joe Young's wheels (DT Swiss RR 1.1 rims / 240s hubs / 2.0/1.8/2.0 spokes) because of rim cracking problems with the former. The initial rear rim cracked and was replaced by Velomax. A rear spoke on the repaired wheel then broke and the rear rim showed evidence of initiation of three cracks after 1,500 miles. When the spoke broke, the wheel was so far out of true that it would not turn in the rear triangle and I had to carry the bike as I walked about a mile to home. Again Velomax replaced the rim, spokes, and also the bearings because they felt rough. They have been good about standing behind their wheels, but I became worried that some day I would be stranded in the boonies. I decided no more boutique wheels with funky spokes that are expensive, hard to get and replace, went for the traditional wheelset and got Young's custom wheels. If they are good enough for e-Riche to put on his bikes, I figure they are good enough for my bike. Moreover, Young's wheels can be had for $100-$150 less than the price of the Ascents with no significant weight difference. I have more than 1,400 miles on the Young wheels and they are as true as the day I brought them home. A friend of mine who bought Ascents II on my recommendation also had the rear rim replaced because of cracking and now the replaced rim has cracks. He has ordered out a set of Young wheels. In fairness, my lbs owner from whom I bought the Ascent wheels has a set and has had no problems and he weighs more and is a stronger rider than I am.

[Ti Designs]

I think that no pre-built wheel is worth the additional cost over a well made set of hand-builts


Wow, I thought I was the only one who said things like that. I still tell my customers that their primary set of wheel should be a good set of hand built wheels. There's nothing you can do to a set of wheels I build that I can't fix in two days - any of the prebuilt wheels making that claim? If you need faster or lighter wheels for special rides, get them IN ADDITION to the hand built set.

[Mr. Butterworth]

If you need faster or lighter wheels for special rides, get them IN ADDITION to the hand built set.

Exactly. I already have quite a nice collection of wheels, some of which are hand-built. This is very specific shopping I am doing, as I can get both of the aforementioned wheels relatively inexpensively. I am just trying to round-out my wheel stable - hand-builts are not part of this equation right now.

[Ozz]

Exactly. I already have quite a nice collection of wheels, some of which are hand-built. This is very specific shopping I am doing, as I can get both of the aforementioned wheels relatively inexpensively. I am just trying to round-out my wheel stable - hand-builts are not part of this equation right now.

Don't rule out the Campy Eurus. Bomb-proof and fast. Much cooler than the ubiquitous Kysriums...

They even have a carbon version now!

[Vancouverdave]

About those designer wheels (what I like to call "geek fraud" wheels,)
Except for Campy, Shimano, and Mavic, many of these are hiding dreadfully cheap hubs and/or freehub bodies as their overpriced hearts. If you are finally suckered into a set of wheels made by a company that doesn't make their own hubs, make sure you know where the hubs came from. There are a number of $500+ wheel sets out there with $10 generic freehub bodies grinding away. It's also a good idea to get wheels that, if they weren't built by a real mechanic in a local shop, can at least be repaired by one.

[Jeff N.]

FYI, Velomax was bought out by Easton, so now all the new ones say EASTON on them, but are otherwise the same. I have several riders in my 55 member club who've had problems of one type or another with Velomax wheelsets. IMO, I think theres better wheelsets out there. Between Velomax/Easton and Ksyrium SSC SL's, I'd go Ksyrium without hesitation. I'd pass on the Top's for a variety of reasons..although they're beautiful wheels. But I am of the opinion these days that a good pair of custom builds (DA-10 speed hubs laced to CXP-33's for example) are the way to go. Jeff N.

[musgravecycles]

About those designer wheels (what I like to call "geek fraud" wheels,)
Except for Campy, Shimano, and Mavic, many of these are hiding dreadfully cheap hubs and/or freehub bodies as their overpriced hearts. If you are finally suckered into a set of wheels made by a company that doesn't make their own hubs, make sure you know where the hubs came from. There are a number of $500+ wheel sets out there with $10 generic freehub bodies grinding away. It's also a good idea to get wheels that, if they weren't built by a real mechanic in a local shop, can at least be repaired by one.

Vancouverdave is absolutely correct on this one! There is so many $$ wheelsets with cheap hubs these days. I am very partial to handbuilt myself. There isn't anything special 'bout the Ksryiums in my opinion, but there are those willing to burn me on that. I was talking to Craig Calfee the other day about the Topo's, he says they're great, but not my bag. I almost bought a pair of the Velomax carbon wheels several years ago, but they have alot of problems with spokes breaking. Maybe Easton will fix that?!

In my opinion there's nothing smother than a pair of Record or Phil hubs laced up 3x to a good quality rim. But then again my next wheelset will be tied and soldered just because I've always wanted a wheelset that way(I can't wait to try a pair of the Jerks Dugast's on them), so you might call disregard everything I have to say about wheels and mis-label me as a 'retro-grouch.'

[Larry]

Decide precisely what your needs are..... then call two or three custom wheel builders. Dave Thomas, Joe Young, and several others that you can find. Lightness is not the most crucial factor.

The Topolinos are down right ugly.

Larry

[bulliedawg]

I've had my Dave Thomas Speed Dreams for over 3,000 miles. 1,475 grams, and they ride true as the day I got them. They are without a doubt the best money I've ever spent on my cycling "habit".

[Too Tall]

See? This is why I keep coming back here, everyone is pretty open minded and so into the culture of bikes. ahhh.

I def. am in the camp of own a few great bikes and a quiver of wheels to mix an match for diff. needs. Yep, I've got Joe Young clinchers, Dave T. Tubs and my recent favorite a set of custom Zipp Pave' tubs running Clement Strada training tyres....just a frickin' awesome wheelset for guys like me.

Ha ha VC Dave you are KILLING me man. THAT comment is funny and I'll am just finishing working on a $3000+ wheelset recently that most def. falls in that category. OMG. Delicate, not durable, hard to work on all comes to mind. In fact the mfg. had to replace one rim because it warped badly after less than 500 miles of racing!!! :rolleyes:

Ditto on the cheap hub bodies...without naming names. However I'll vouch for the quality and durability of the inexpensive hubs used by Velocity in their lower end wheelsets. I think these are rebadged (conventional pawls) Hugi's....these are really really good and should you ever have a problem the cassette body is easy and inexpenisve to replace OR swap to Campag. A real sleeper in my opinion.

[keno]

yupp, I've broken the Velomax habit. They turned my cracked rim around in a mere 6 weeks. (BTW, you tell me, should they have put rim tape on the repaired wheel rather than sending it to me so naked?)

I bought a set of DA/Open Pros from Performance for $250 and couldn't be happier with about 3,000 miles on them so far.

I bought some Ksyriums on ebay but find them oh so harsh. I've put an EC70 seatpost on the Serotta and will try them again when the roads allow and see how they feel. For me, the best part of them is the looks. When I get inspired I'll happily sell them. They're perfect, but add nothing to my biking enjoyment. BTW, I'll sell the Velomax Orion IIs, as well.

keno

[Ozz]

Those were really giving you some heartburn a couple months ago!

I took my new DT Swiss wheels (RR 1.1 rims / 240s hubs / 2.0/1.8/2.0 spokes / brass nipples) out this past weekend, and I am really pleased!

They have the same tires, run at the same pressure as my Eurus, but if I had to put a number to it, they run about 20-30% smoother. No vibration from chip seal, the seams in the road have the edge taken off. No real difference in cornering stability as far as I could tell, but I didn't really push too hard..too early in the season for me.

Downside? The only thing I could tell was acceleration on descents. My Eurus are definitely more aero, and seem to "fall" downhill...no trouble coasting to 35 mph on this one hill on my usual route. I had to put some "pedal" into the DT Swiss to get the same speed...

Also, anyone who thinks the new 240s hubs are as noisy as the old Hugi's, apparently has not ridden them! The road noise from the tires is louder than anything coming from the rear hub.

Bottomline - gorgeous wheel (if you like red & black), smooth hubs, comfy set up. Highly recommended!

[Too Tall]

Nice review of your wheels Ozzzr. I've been waiting for a discerning souls to try the DT rims. Sounds like we have a winner in that eh?

[WickedWheels]

For my money I can't find anything better than Bontrager! Light, relatively inexpensive, hand-built, U.S.-made... and considering that there are THOUSANDS sold every year their reliability rate is very impressive. Here are the reasons I like them, part for part.

Hubs: Their top two wheelsets use DT Swiss/Hugi hubs with a custom shell. It is the Hugi 240 mechanism (on the higher-end Bontragers), with a clutch plate drive. Easy to repair, easy parts availability and you can swap out a Shimano freehub body for a Campy one in about 30 seconds.

Rims: The rims are second to none--they use a pinned AND welded seam, machined braking surface and reinforced eyelets. All the features of a nice Mavic Open Pro, but with an off-center rear for more even spoke tension. The Race X-Lite also use the ZR9000 alloy (similar to Mavic Maxtal) that's a little bit stronger than what most rim manufacturers use.

Spokes: DT spokes, straight-pull. This means no more spokes breaking at the head, and yet any half-way decent shop should have replacements. They even use different gauge spokes on the drive vs. non-drive side.

Lacing: Pair-up spoke design allows the spokes to share the load, rather than each spoke taking up the load at a time and alternating to different sides of the hub.

[Ozz]

my shop shipped my wheels to me in a Bontrager box.... :beer:

[Too Tall]

WW - I hear many good reports like yours regards Bontrager tubular wheels....but there is only one definative way to know for sure. Send me a pair and I promise to provide the Forumites with a "Fair and Balanced" review :cool:

[WickedWheels]

Sorry, I don't work for Bontrager... and with my bike shop salary I think that most of the people here are in a better position to send ME a set. But if you want to demo a set I've got a set or two as designated "take-home-demos" of Race X-Lite clinchers hanging around.

And all that being said... I'm looking to sell my Rolf Vector Pro's (that I'm fairly satified with) because pair-up spokes don't look right on my old "Z" LeMond.

[Too Tall]

YOU know I was kidding right? PS - I'm bike poor ;)

[Mr. Butterworth]

are good wheels. I already own a pair of X-Lites. I was considering a pair of Triple X lite carbons, but the pair I was about to buy failed catastophically while sitting idle.
I am sure that was a fluke event, because my X-Lites have about 4000 incident-free miles on them.

[vaxn8r]

geek frauds all of you.....

Only lugged steel, Italian preferably, with Campy Super Record and 36 spoke, 3-cross, tied and soldered, of course built with something like GEL 330 rims. No stinkin' clinchers! Top it off with a Silca pump, quill stem, single water bottle cage, wool shorts and jersey and some knitted gloves.

Everything else is geek fraud....