dig the rig:

[oracle]

rig to be dug: (http://www.cyclingnews.com/trackphotos.php?id=photos/2004/dec04/weinachtspreis/joerg)

[shinomaster]

What circus act do you think he is getting ready for? :banana:

[Too Tall]

Awesome. Thanks :) Before you know it all the kids will be turning their forks backwards. Seriously, that takes brass youknowwhats.

[William]

I caught the fork too. :cool:

I also like the "Big Cookie", 64 tooth big ring. Reminds me of a run down the side of Mt. Bachelor. :eek:

William

[pale scotsman]

Isn't that a moto-pacing rig? If you look at Mike Barry's site you can see a cool one from '34 with a stem that may, infact be too long for the jerk... :beer:

http://www.bikespecialties.com/vintage/1934ccmpacefollower.html

[torquer]

"I might also note that the specialized track bikes used in a "derny race"- the weird but wonderful European velodrome event in which the cyclists draft a few millimeters behind fat old men riding dorky looking motorbikes- have forks that look like they are turn around backwards. The high speed attained by the daring derny-drafters necessitates a bike with the utmost stability, hence the funny looking, but highly
functional fork with a very small rake. "

Zinn's latest discussion of fork configurations:
http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/articles/7322.0.html

BTW, does anyone know if there is a difference between "stayers" and "dernies"?

[Sandy]

The chain ring is very intimidating.

What surprises me is that the tubing all seems to be small diameter tubes of one fixed diameter. I would think that cyclists pushing such large gears would have bikes with larger tubing. The tubes don't even get any bigger at the bb. I find all that very interesting. How does the bike handle the torsional forces, when this guy "puts the hammer down"? I would think that weight of the bike is of little concern. Am I wrong? What design characteristics make this bike a good choice in this application for the super strong cyclists that ride it?


With my 25 tooth big ring,

Curious George

[ShockTreatment]

"BTW, does anyone know if there is a difference between "stayers" and "dernies"?"

The stayer is the cyclist that does motor paced events on the track. A derny is the funny looking motor bike where the driver is almost standing to give a better draft.

[William]

What surprises me is that the tubing all seems to be small diameter tubes of one fixed diameter. I would think that cyclists pushing such large gears would have bikes with larger tubing. The tubes don't even get any bigger at the bb. I find all that very interesting. How does the bike handle the torsional forces, when this guy "puts the hammer down"?

Related to the point that Sandy brought up:

One thing that I've noticed reading posts on this forum and the Frame builder forum is that there are a lot people & builders who don't seem to like OS/shaped tubing. As I was cleaning up my old Super Course fixie the other day, I was looking at the straight/standard diameter tubing and wondering why builders many times use the same diameter and gauge of tubing that they do on smaller frames. The SC is fun but it's a wet noodle under torque. When you get into the 60 cm and over range, it seems to me that the main triangle starts getting weaker...or less able to handle the load with out excessive flexing. I know there are builders that use OS/shaped tubes to get more strength & stiffness for larger frames, but there still seems to be a number of them out there who stay with the "standard" tubes for bigger frames. Any thoughts on why that is?

The chain ring is very intimidating.
A big chain ring like that is more about building up to, and maintaining a high rate of speed in the draft. Not that Jack Rabbit burst of torquey speed.

William

[saab2000]

Alright Guys, here is the scoop.

That bike looks familiar to me.

When I lived in Switzerland I spent one season racing on the track at the Offene Rennbahn in Oerlikon bei Zuerich. They offered a mandatory course to all those who wished to race on the track and as I had a lot of time that year I decided to do it. It was 1994 or 1995 I think. Anyway, the track there is dominated by a couple of old codgers who are part of the cycling mafia. In order to acheive anything in cycling, one must either be ultra talented or on the good side of these fat old men who control the sport. The Jerk probably knows what I am talking about. One of those old guys is a former gold medalist in the Olympics. He also rode the Tour and was the guy that Davis Phinney beat in 1986 when he won his first Tour stage. My little bit ' trivia.

So I take this course and everyone who does not have their own bike is issued a freebie, but that freebie belongs to the track. They are all the same (except for size) and there are about 40 of these bikes hanging in a room at the track. I picked one out and who would have thought it, but they all looked exactly like that bike pictured above, except that they were normal track bikes. But they all had that red color with the Swiss Cross on them. They are all about 30-40 years old, but not much has changed in those 40 years in track bikes. They all have old Campagnolo track groups. And tubular tires.

By this time of my "career" I was pretty much finished, but still had enough to be the 2nd best guy in the course and should have continued with it. I probably could have raced in some 6 day races had I continued, at least the amateur events which proceed the pro events. There used to be a Zuerich 6-day race, but it has now been cancelled.

Anyway, it was pretty cool to see this bike. In the '90s there was a guy from the south of Switzerland (Ticino) who was called Felice Puttini. He was Swiss champ on the road several times and for years continued racing on the track in these paced events. The speeds are insane.

I wish I had stuck with it. Thanks for showing the picture. It is pretty cool and brings back some nice memories.

BTW, pro track racing is fascinating. The 6-day races are still dominated by the Swiss riders Bruno Risi and Kurt Betschardt. But don't go to watch the racing other than for fun. The atmosphere is only slightly more sophisticated than at "professional wrestling" or monster truck events. If you are sober, you are in the minority at a 6-day race. :beer:

[jerk]

saab has got it right....the six day circuit makes the belgian kermesse circuit look like a pillar of upstanding morality and sportsmanship. brutal, awful and sublime, the six day is the professional wrestling of cycling-so fake it is more real than anything else. betting, drugs, low rider pay unless you're a big gun and a cross between a las vegas casino and a munich beer hall for an audience and you begin to get the idea....suffice it to say that 6 day racing was america's most popular spectator sport prior to strong legal restrictions on betting on human athletes......both madison square garden and the boston garden were origanally built for this type of "sport"....
the reason the derny bikes havew those backward forks is not for high-speed handling....the trail measurement is pretty normal. its for drafting purposes...check out the small front wheel.....you can get really close to the fat rear end of the the 300 pounder with the delhaize jersey when your forks are backwards and the front wheel is itsy bitsy. by the way those things go really, really fast.

jerk