OT: Childhood flashback....

[William]

I just had a flashback to when my Dad brought me home a Bullfrog to cheer me up......dad didn't understand wild life too well.... :crap:

William's Bullfrog (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXHaCEhOiWU)





William ;)

[trophyoftexas]

I just had a flashback to when my Dad brought me home a Bullfrog to cheer me up......dad didn't understand wild life too well.... :crap:

William's Bullfrog (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXHaCEhOiWU)





William ;)

Reminds me of the first time we took my Dad duck hunting...he was 72-73 and my sons were about 8-9-10. Dad was about 100 yards up the bank from me and my youngest but had my oldest with him to help him ID what he could shoot, this was in the days of the "point system" of duck hunting. Anyway, we heard a shot ring out and I hollered "who shot what?" To which my oldest shouted something that I couldn't quite understand so I asked my youngest if he heard what his brother had said....to which he replied "Grandpa shot an ostrich!" Turns out he'd shot a frickin' chickin' hawk and the oldest son had yelled that "Grandpa shot an osprey!"....nope, Dad's duck recognizing skills left a lot to be desired!

[trophyoftexas]

....before anyone jumps on the anti-hunting band wagon let me say this....last week we invited friends over to the house on three separate evenings and cooked out....we ate most all of the teal, mallards, geese, and pheasant that we had taken the past season as well as the wild hog that my oldest had killed the night before....we shoot it and then we eat it, case closed!

[Ray]

....before anyone jumps on the anti-hunting band wagon let me say this....last week we invited friends over to the house on three separate evenings and cooked out....we ate most all of the teal, mallards, geese, and pheasant that we had taken the past season as well as the wild hog that my oldest had killed the night before....we shoot it and then we eat it, case closed!
I don't see how anyone who isn't a vegetarian can really be anti-hunting. They could maybe be in favor of some forms of gun control, but if you're OK with having someone else kill your meat for you, I can't see the rationale for having an issue with someone who chooses to kill their own instead.

I can't talk about my flashbacks from the '70s - they're, uhhh, not of the childhood type. :cool:

-Ray

[LegendRider]

I'm not a vegetarian because I love animals. I'm a vegetarian because I hate plants.
A. Whitney Brown

[Ozz]

........nope, Dad's duck recognizing skills left a lot to be desired!
Too funny (except for the osprey / chicken hawk! ;) )

It reminds me of a story my father told of a friend of his that shot the biggest snow goose he had ever seen....6'+ wingspan and all that. He was so proud of it, he put a picture of him holding it up on his Xmas cards.....turns out it was a swan! :cool:

[William]

I don't see how anyone who isn't a vegetarian can really be anti-hunting. They could maybe be in favor of some forms of gun control, but if you're OK with having someone else kill your meat for you, I can't see the rationale for having an issue with someone who chooses to kill their own instead.


-Ray



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[Sandy]

I don't see how anyone who isn't a vegetarian can really be anti-hunting. They could maybe be in favor of some forms of gun control, but if you're OK with having someone else kill your meat for you, I can't see the rationale for having an issue with someone who chooses to kill their own instead.

I can't talk about my flashbacks from the '70s - they're, uhhh, not of the childhood type. :cool:

-Ray

I think I mentioned this before on the forum a while ago. Probably about 8 years or so ago, I was walking a lot of dogs at the local shelter. I used to always play with a pit bull which had been at the shelter for a long time. Someone I knew from the shelter, whose girlfriend eventually adopted the pit bull, asked me a question: He asked how can someone who clearly loves dogs as much as you do have a meat business (in which you sell products from animals that are killed). I thought carefully about his question and simply don't think I had a very good answer. I don't even remember what I told him. I do eat chicken and fish, but almost no meat. I would absolutely never kill an animal intentionally, but I eat chiken and fish. Doesn't make much sense I guess. I think that the wholesale meat business and eating food derived from animals that are killed has simply always been part of my life and I simply never thjought about its implications- probably until the question was asked.

There is one thing about hunting that I just don't understand and always wondered about, in particular for animals killed for a trophy and not to eat: What is the motivation/pleasure/enjoyment in looking for, luring, and then shooting and killing an animal? Is it the kill, the entire process, the camaraderie with fellow hunters, the hunt itself, the satisfaction in being able to accomplish the kill?? I sometimes see a TV show on hunting when I do the male channel surfing. I will not stay on the hunting channel/show for long. I will never see the actual kill by the hunter. That just upsets me. That is when I wonder why does the hunter do it. How can the hunter enjoy killing a defenseless animal? Many years ago, I went fishing for the first and last time. I did not catch any fish. At that time I decided never to go again as I could never kill a fish.

The fact that I eat fish and chicken and will absolutely never kill either (or meat producing animals) is probably hypocritical and doesn't make much sense.


Sandy

[William]

Humans are omnivores. It’s built into the genes. One can choose not to eat meat or to eat nothing but vegetables, but we’re hard wired for it. Admittedly these days hunting isn’t an absolutely necessary skill for everyone…supermarkets took care of that….but at one time it was needed for survival. I personally don’t have a problem when folks hunt to feed their family. Even if it’s supplemental.

I’m like you though in that I don’t get the trophy hunting aspect. Even worse is when you get these nimrods who have a Panther, Leopard, Lion, etc… brought into and enclosed area and shoot them off the back of a pick-up truck. What are they getting out of that? Just to say they shot a Lion? Mount a head over the fire place and get their photos with a foot on top of a dead animal?


William

[beungood]

I think killing for a trophy is immoral. But in the same token I see nothing wrong with hunting as long as you use what you take. This extends to fishing also. I have alot of fond memories of fisshing with my grandfather and also picking blueberries and mushrooms in the woods. I would rather hunt and eat lean Vennison over store bought food. We have an over abundance of whitetails here and 3 or 4 a week get hit by cars...They are dangerous to humans... :p

[Ray]

The fact that I eat fish and chicken and will absolutely never kill either (or meat producing animals) is probably hypocritical and doesn't make much sense.
There's a difference between not wanting to do it yourself and condemning others for it. I don't hunt either. I went a few times as a kid with friends families, but it wasn't part of my family experience and I never really took to it. I liked fishing a bit more, but not hard-core in that respect either. And I have absolutely NO desire to ever skin and butcher a deer or anything else. Don't have the stomach for it. But that's different than condemning other people for doing the same thing.

As others have mentioned, I think there's a moral scale in there somewhere. Killing just for trophies is pretty bad and herding the animals into a pen to shoot them practically at point blank range just seems ridiculous to me (but really isn't that different than raising cows on a feed-lot and then herding them to slaughter). But as long as I eat animals, which I do and plan to keep doing, I just can't get moralistic on someone else for killing them.

-Ray

[Kirk007]

I grew up in a hunting and fishing environment. One of our local sources of amusement was to go to the gun range the day before deer season and what all the "hunters" from NYC, Philly and other large urban centers sighting in their guns, which often included rifles large enough to take an elephant and even handguns like .44 magnums. It was like watching an alien invasion. We also stayed out of the state game lands if we could that first week!!

I don't do either now, but don't have a problem with hunting for personal consumption. In fact, with species like the white tail in the east coast, turkeys in Oregon and likely many other species, we have a real population explosion without sufficient natural predation and control. We probably need a lot more hunting in some of these areas, and there seems to be enough hungry that with appropriate controls there could be hunting programs that helped supply protein to food kitchens etc.

The trophy hunting (not talking about the game farms where exotics are released etc., I get from a thrill of hunt perspective (when done by what hunters have phrased 'fair chase"). We are wired that way, but I also view it as biologically stupid (you don't kill off the healthy males in their prime before they've spread their genes through the pool). And if it is the thrill of the chase you want, take a camera.

[Michael Maddox]

Nuff said.

(No relation, by the way. He's a bit of a...well....you know.)

[Joellogicman]

Humans are omnivores. It’s built into the genes. One can choose not to eat meat or to eat nothing but vegetables, but we’re hard wired for it. Admittedly these days hunting isn’t an absolutely necessary skill for everyone…supermarkets took care of that….but at one time it was needed for survival. I personally don’t have a problem when folks hunt to feed their family. Even if it’s supplemental.

Humans are also hard wired to reproduce as soon as they reach breeding age. Males are hard wired to have multiple reproduction partners (females in species that mate for life tend to be able to breed only once or twice a year) and arguably kill - or at least drive away - young potential male rivals.

There may be other rational arguments to eat meat. But to say it is in our genes ignores that humanity has evolved intellectually to the point where it no longer engages in other natural behavior for moral reasons.

[William]

Humans are also hard wired to reproduce as soon as they reach breeding age. Males are hard wired to have multiple reproduction partners (females in species that mate for life tend to be able to breed only once or twice a year) and arguably kill - or at least drive away - young potential male rivals.

There may be other rational arguments to eat meat. But to say it is in our genes ignores that humanity has evolved intellectually to the point where it no longer engages in other natural behavior for moral reasons.


Right, one can "choose" not to eat meat for a variety of reasons. That's what I stated.



William

[Joellogicman]

Right, one can "choose" not to eat meat for a variety of reasons. That's what I stated.



William

Appears we are on the same page.

[William]

Appears we are on the same page.

:beer: (a Non-chicken malt beverage)



William :)

[Joellogicman]

:beer: (a Non-chicken malt beverage)



William :)

:D

[BumbleBeeDave]

Nuff said.

(No relation, by the way. He's a bit of a...well....you know.)

. . . my Koala-On-A-Stick on Guy Fawkes Day . . . :D

BBD

[Michael Maddox]

. . . my Koala-On-A-Stick on Guy Fawkes Day . . . :D

BBD

So THAT'S the holiday for Koala. We had been wondering. Toucan's for everyday eating, but when's chimp again?

Gad. That's a gross thought.