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Dave
09-16-2008, 02:41 PM
I’ve mounted my 2009 Centaur ergopower levers and have some info regarding the installation and my first riding impressions.

First the riding impressions. Even though I have small hands and short fingers, the new design is more comfortable than the old. Depending on the exact placement of the ergopower body, you may see an increase in reach to the brake hoods of 3-5mm, but the reach to the brake levers, from the hooks, has been reduced slightly. With my short fingers, I can still barely get the last joint of my middle finger around the brake lever, so I’ll soon make my standard reach reducing modification to these new levers. The right finger lever requires far less pressure and a shorter throw to make shifts to larger cogs. There is only the slightest audible click for each cog shift (still up to 3 with one sweep of the lever). This will take some getting used to since the clicks can scarcely be felt or heard. The force required to operate the thumb button has been reduced significantly, but there is still a distinct click for each cog that can both be heard and felt. The thumb button can shift up to 5 cogs smaller with one push.

The left lever functions much like the old one, but with reduced pressure to operate the finger lever and thumb button and a shorter stroke for the each click of the finger lever. Unlike the right finger lever, the left side has firmer and louder clicks. The left ergopower can operate any previous FD, including a triple. I measured the cable pull and found more than enough pull for a triple FD. There are no excess clicks, only the 7 needed to operate a triple FD. The instructions that came with my levers stated in bold lettering “not compatible with QS front derailleurs”. I hooked up my 2008 QS FD and it shifted perfectly, with 4 clicks, just like before.

Now to the installation details. First, buy a T25 (Torx) screwdriver. The clamping nut under the brake hood is now made of aluminum and like other aluminum fasteners from Campy, requires a Torx driver. The clamping nut can still be reached by inserting the driver under the front of the brake hood.

The instructions had some errors. They said to install the shift cable housing end with the preinstalled ferrule into the ergopower body. The new cables have no preinstalled ferrules and none is used at the ergopower end. Instead of a ferrule, there is a small metal disc in the bottom of the cable housing bore. Be sure not to lose it, since it can be pushed out if a cable housing is not in place when the cable is inserted. The ergopower body has a ceramic cable guide that makes a fairly sharp bend to guide the cable into the housing. Getting the cable around this bend and inserted into the tiny hole can be tricky. I got one cable into the hole by holding the end down into the groove of the ceramic guide with a small screwdriver, while I pushed on the cable from the underside of the ergopower body. The simple way to insert the cable is to extend several inches of cable, straight up, above the ergopower body, grab the end and insert it into the hole. The problem comes when you take the slack out of the big loop of cable – it will put a moderate kink in the cable, but it’s not too hard to straighten out.

The new Campy shift cable housing has been improved to reduce friction. The diameter is 4.1mm, but just about any common 4mm shift cable will probably work fine. I saw a minor problem with the optional shift cable routing, to the front of the bar. The opening for the cable housing at the very edge of the ergopower body can become too small, if the body is mounted too high up on the bars. I could easily see the need to carve away a little bit of the material to prevent pinching the cable housing. I’ve routed both shift and brake cable to the front of the bars for years, but with the Easton EC90 SLX3 bars, I decided to try routing the housing around the back of the bars, so the bend onto the top of the bars would have a larger radius and reduce friction.

Applying bar tape around the ergopower body is a little easier. When the tape reaches the lowest portion of the body, you no longer have to tuck the tape under the body. The groove for the thumb button is not as close to the bar. The tape can and should overlap the lower portion of the body by 5mm or so.

Bill Bove
09-16-2008, 03:07 PM
My partner (business, not life. not that there's anything wrong with that.) just put Super Record on his bike.

SWEET :banana:

soulspinner
09-16-2008, 04:01 PM
I’ve mounted my 2009 Centaur ergopower levers and have some info regarding the installation and my first riding impressions.

First the riding impressions. Even though I have small hands and short fingers, the new design is more comfortable than the old. Depending on the exact placement of the ergopower body, you may see an increase in reach to the brake hoods of 3-5mm, but the reach to the brake levers, from the hooks, has been reduced slightly. With my short fingers, I can still barely get the last joint of my middle finger around the brake lever, so I’ll soon make my standard reach reducing modification to these new levers. The right finger lever requires far less pressure and a shorter throw to make shifts to larger cogs. There is only the slightest audible click for each cog shift (still up to 3 with one sweep of the lever). This will take some getting used to since the clicks can scarcely be felt or heard. The force required to operate the thumb button has been reduced significantly, but there is still a distinct click for each cog that can both be heard and felt. The thumb button can shift up to 5 cogs smaller with one push.

The left lever functions much like the old one, but with reduced pressure to operate the finger lever and thumb button and a shorter stroke for the each click of the finger lever. Unlike the right finger lever, the left side has firmer and louder clicks. The left ergopower can operate any previous FD, including a triple. I measured the cable pull and found more than enough pull for a triple FD. There are no excess clicks, only the 7 needed to operate a triple FD. The instructions that came with my levers stated in bold lettering “not compatible with QS front derailleurs”. I hooked up my 2008 QS FD and it shifted perfectly, with 4 clicks, just like before.

Now to the installation details. First, buy a T25 (Torx) screwdriver. The clamping nut under the brake hood is now made of aluminum and like other aluminum fastners from Campy, requires a Torx driver. The clamping nut can still be reached by inserting the driver under the front of the brake hood.

The instructions had some errors. They said to install the shift cable housing end with the preinstalled ferrule into the ergopower body. The new cables have no preinstalled ferrules and none is used at the ergopower end. Instead of a ferrule, there is a small metal disc in the bottom of the cable housing bore. Be sure not to lose it, since it can be pushed out if a cable housing is not in place when the cable is inserted. The ergopower body has a ceramic cable guide that makes a fairly sharp bend to guide the cable into the housing. Getting the cable around this bend and inserted into the tiny hole can be tricky. I got one cable into the hole by holding the end down into the groove of the ceramic guide with a small screwdriver, while I pushed on the cable from the underside of the ergopower body. The simple way to insert the cable is to extend several inches of cable, straight up, above the ergopower body, grab the end and insert it into the hole. The problem comes when you take the slack out of the big loop of cable – it will put a moderate kink in the cable, but it’s not too hard to straighten out.

The new Campy shift cable housing has been improved to reduce friction. The diameter is 4.1mm, but just about any common 4mm shift cable will probably work fine. I saw a minor problem with the optional shift cable routing, to the front of the bar. The opening for the cable housing at the very edge of the ergopower body can become too small, if the body is mounted too high up on the bars. I could easily see the need to carve away a little bit of the material to prevent pinching the cable housing. I’ve routed both shift and brake cable to the front of the bars for years, but with the Easton EC90 SLX3 bars, I decided to try routing the housing around the back of the bars, so the bend onto the top of the bars would have a larger radius and reduce friction.

Applying bar tape around the ergopower body is a little easier. When the tape reaches the lowest portion of the body, you no longer have to tuck the tape under the body. The groove for the thumb button is not as close to the bar and the tape can and should overlap the lower portion of the body by 5mm or so.

Thanks for taking the time to let us know.

ergott
09-16-2008, 04:12 PM
So jealous. I want these on my cross bike.

-

Pete Serotta
09-16-2008, 04:23 PM
thanks for taking the time to give us a first hand impression. PETE

ox_rider
09-16-2008, 04:37 PM
I have not seen these in person. Do they feel similar to the older hoods, something like the SRAM hoods or a horse of a different color altogether?

Thanks.

bobswire
09-16-2008, 04:43 PM
The feel,fit and looks surpasses my campy 8, 9 or 10 speed chorus. IMO
http://i34.tinypic.com/21946bn.jpg
http://i37.tinypic.com/308dveo.jpg

cpg
09-16-2008, 04:46 PM
http://i34.tinypic.com/21946bn.jpg


Is that a match built Paramount? Nice levers.

Curt

Dave
09-16-2008, 04:46 PM
I have not seen these in person. Do they feel similar to the older hoods, something like the SRAM hoods or a horse of a different color altogether?

Thanks.

The new hoods have 15% more contact area, according to Campy. The curve right below the knobby top has a much larger radius, that feels better to me. Your palms never touch any cable housing, so comfort is improved. I actually did one ride with one old lever and one new one. The new one is better, IMO.

bobswire
09-16-2008, 04:49 PM
Is that a match built Paramount? Nice levers.

Curt

Yes a 2000 Match Paramount.

fiamme red
09-16-2008, 04:59 PM
Those brifters look as if someone took a hammer to the hoods and bashed them inwards. They may be comfortable, but they're ugly IMHO.

Nice Schwinn, BTW.

Erik.Lazdins
09-16-2008, 07:24 PM
I could have subscribed to any number of publications and not received 1/8 of the information contained within one of your posts.

You are INDEED ' DA MAN !!! '
:beer:

Marcusaurelius
09-17-2008, 12:06 AM
I just wanted to confirm you can use a shimano derailleur cable with these shifters? (I once tried a install shimano derailleur cable in my ergo shifters only to discover the campagnolo has a much smaller end on it)

I'd also have to agree that the shifters just don't do it for me, they may be more comfortable but they are ugly compared to the previous generation.

.

TAW
09-17-2008, 12:08 AM
Thanks for the report and the install techniques. Nicely done.

soulspinner
09-17-2008, 06:37 AM
I still cant get used to that shape. Anyone held Dura Ace and new Campy to compare? Thanks Dave, 4 pointing out no cable to irritate hands. Thin gloves and my hand position have contributed to soreness on the middle finger bone of both hands. Nice to see they changed the routing.

Dave
09-17-2008, 08:12 AM
I just wanted to confirm you can use a shimano derailleur cable with these shifters? (I once tried a install shimano derailleur cable in my ergo shifters only to discover the campagnolo has a much smaller end on it)

I'd also have to agree that the shifters just don't do it for me, they may be more comfortable but they are ugly compared to the previous generation.

.

Shimano or other brand of 4mm cable housing should be no problem, but the shift cable ends are still unique to Campy. Shimano cables would need to have the head ground down to fit.

r_mutt
09-17-2008, 08:38 AM
having to buy a torx driver is a minor annoyance.

MilanoTom
09-17-2008, 09:04 AM
Probikekit.com has Veloce for (based on current exchange rate) $154.28, including cables and free shipping. The black finish doesn't look great in the illustration (probably looks better in person), but it's a way to try out the new stuff for cheap.

http://probikekit.com/display.php?code=L5068

Regards,
Tom

cpg
09-17-2008, 01:23 PM
Yes a 2000 Match Paramount.


Cool. Mine was the same color.

Curt

Nil Else
09-17-2008, 07:23 PM
Those brifters look as if someone took a hammer to the hoods and bashed them inwards. They may be comfortable, but they're ugly IMHO.

Nice Schwinn, BTW.


They look big and happy!! :eek:

thwart
09-17-2008, 08:14 PM
Thanks for the review, Dave. Good stuff.

For me, the looks will be an acquired taste, I'm afraid.

Elefantino
09-18-2008, 07:03 AM
They look weird.

That said, the shape of the "old" Ergos fits me perfectly. So if anyone wants to dump their previous models, I'm your man.

Birch
09-19-2008, 09:52 AM
My partner (business, not life. not that there's anything wrong with that.) just put Super Record on his bike.

SWEET :banana:

I fondled, yes fondled some Super Record yesterday. Yummy. For a second I thought about it....

Dave
09-19-2008, 10:33 AM
After my first ride with both new levers installed, I decided that the increase in reach needed to be addressed, so I moved the levers up about 5mm on the curve, to reduce the reach and give the brake hood a slight upward angle, rather than horzontal. I've now got the reach to brake hood nearly the same as my old ergo levers.

I also decided that the reach to the brake levers, from the hooks, was more than I could tolerate for those long mountain descents, so I got out my 5-minute Loctite epoxy putty and ten minutes later, had the perfect reach to the brake levers. A small amount of epoxy putty, placed on the ergo body, where the brake lever release pin rests, easily reduces the reach by as much as needed. The putty is so much easier to work with than my old method, using 5-minute epoxy glue. I use the shank of a 1/4 inch drill bit as a shaping tool and an Xacto knife to trim off excess. When the putty just starts to harden, the brake release pin can be gently rested against the putty to produce the final adjustment. I try to do all of the shaping and trimming of the putty, before it fully hardens. It's a lot easier than sanding or carving off material when fully hardened.

bobswire
09-19-2008, 11:48 AM
Dave, can you post some photos? You can upload photos here http://tinypic.com and receive a code to post on forums.

Dave
09-19-2008, 03:42 PM
Lets see if these photos post properly.

soulspinner
09-19-2008, 05:51 PM
Wow, they really point up. Great photos Dave!

Dave
09-21-2008, 10:46 AM
Campy has posted the 2009 spare parts PDF. I'm not sure that the spare part showing the same ergo body with ball bearings for all levels is correct, but it's easy to see that the g-springs are gone.

There's scarcely any difference in the parts from SR all the way down to Veloce. See pages 40-44 of the PDF.

It also appears that 10 speed levers can be changed to 11 speed, just with the purchase of part EC-SR013 to replace EC-CE160.

http://www.campagnolo.com/repository/documenti/en/Spares09-A-1509.pdf

Marcusaurelius
09-21-2008, 02:29 PM
Campy has posted the 2009 spare parts PDF. I'm not sure that the spare part showing the same ergo body with ball bearings for all levels is correct, but it's easy to see that the g-springs are gone.

There's scarcely any difference in the parts from SR all the way down to Veloce. See pages 40-44 of the PDF.

It also appears that 10 speed levers can be changed to 11 speed, just with the purchase of part EC-SR013 to replace EC-CE160.

http://www.campagnolo.com/repository/documenti/en/Spares09-A-1509.pdf


I checked the 2009 catalog and now only Record and Super Record Ergo shifters have ball bearing even Chorus doesn't have ball bearings in the new shifters. I am guessing chorus is the new carbon centaur because the only reason I buy chorus shifters over centaur is for the ball bearings.

Dave
09-21-2008, 06:04 PM
I checked the 2009 catalog and now only Record and Super Record Ergo shifters have ball bearing even Chorus doesn't have ball bearings in the new shifters. I am guessing chorus is the new carbon centaur because the only reason I buy chorus shifters over centaur is for the ball bearings.

Yes, the literature and spare parts PDF are in conflict. The written documents list bushings for Chorus and below, but the PDF shows only one spare part with ball bearings for all levels. Centaur ergopower can be had with carbon or aluminum brake levers, with the aluminum significantly cheaper.

After using the '09 Centaur, I don't place as much value on the ball bearings. The operating effort is far lower than the previous Record shifters. Anyone with 10 speed will have to use Centaur or spend more money to change 11S to 10S.

EC-CE160 would be exchanged for EC-SR013 and EC-CE133 would be exchanged for EC-SR062 to change from 10S to 11S, or vice versa, to change any of the other levers from 11S to 10S.