Riccò admits to doping

[jmc22]

The Italian ANSA news agency has reported that cyclist Ricardo Riccò, who tested positive for a new form of EPO, following the 4th stage of the Tour de France, has admitted to having doped in preparation for the French tour.

According to ANSA, the former Saunier Duval rider made the admission at a hearing before the Italian Olympic Committee (CONI) on Wednesday.

The 24-year-old Riccò, who won two stages at the Tour before exiting the race for testing positive for a new product known as Continuous Erythropoietin Receptor Activator (CERA), was called before a CONI panel on Wednesday.

"Speaking to the anti-doping prosecutor, I took full responsibility for my actions,” Riccò told ANSA. “Prior to the Tour, I made a mistake; I took a product that everyone was talking about.”

Riccò said he made the decision to dope independently and took the drug outside of the auspices of his team.

"It was my error alone and because of this I refused the option to have my B sample tested," said Riccò. "My thoughts are with my team because of me some could have lost their jobs.

"I'm thinking also of my teammates who, because of me, could not continue their adventure in the Tour de France."

"I've come before the anti-doping prosecutor to lift a weight off my shoulders because I feel guilty and I need to apologize to my fans," he added.

Riccò learned of the positive before the Tour’s 12th stage and subsequently questioned by French police. Riccò faces a two-year ban from the sport and could still face criminal charges in France for possessing and using a “poisonous substance,” under that country's tough new sports doping laws.

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Riccò was the third rider to test positive for the drug at this year’s Tour after Spanish riders Moises Duenas (Barloworld) and Manuel Beltran (Liquigas) also tested positive for CERA. Unlike the Liquigas and Barloworld teams, Riccò’s Saunier Duval team withdrew from the race, raising questions about the winning performance by the squad’s Leonardo Piepoli on the Tour’s 10th stage.

While Riccò's positive was hailed a sign of the rigor of the Tour's testing protocol, the rider said he wasn't convinced.

"During the Tour they took a lot of samples (from me), they made 10 tests in about 13 stages, two were positive and in fact in theory all the tests should have been positive therefore the method needs to be checked," he said.

Both Riccò and Piepoli were fired by the team within a day of the positive test. The French Anti-Doping Agency has not yet released test results for Piepoli.

Since the Riccò controversy, the team’s title sponsor has withdrawn from the sport but the squad will continue to operate under the joint sponsorship of the Scott-USA bicycle company and Mexican meatpacker, American Beef, based in Chihuahua. The company supplies patties to Burger King, one of its primary customers, and to Wal-Mart and Costco under various brand names.

Thoughts as to if what he said about being sampled 10 times and only 2 times they came back positive?

[Samster]

i find the rapid & relatively full ex-post honesty refreshing (recall tricky dicky and festina [among others]-- drawn out)

++++++ ADDED ++++++
just to clarify: i wasn't expressing any sort of admiration for anyone. it's just nice to have the issue 'done with.' as opposed to months of irritating denial.
++++++ ADDED ++++++

[Avispa]

"During the Tour they took a lot of samples (from me), they made 10 tests in about 13 stages, two were positive and in fact in theory all the tests should have been positive therefore the method needs to be checked," he said.

Thoughts as to if what he said about being sampled 10 times and only 2 times they came back positive?

Oh Yeah.... Lance was never caught, I mean, tested positive! He is the greatest cheat, I mean, rider this country has ever produced!!!*

..A.. :hello: :beer:

* There are many others like him. No simply singling him out.

[girlie]

"During the Tour they took a lot of samples (from me), they made 10 tests in about 13 stages, two were positive and in fact in theory all the tests should have been positive therefore the method needs to be checked," he said.



I kind of dig on Ricco.....his ability to speak up may in the end equal a-whole-lot-of good for the sport. Now the notion of honor enters the sport in a new way. For messing up and getting caught......he is doing the honorable thing. And at the very lease he's screaming out about the fact there are still fellas in there - who he has to compete against - not clean. And yes this will keep him on the list in 2 years. But at least he found away to speak up a bit and not completely shut up or say only what saves his ass.
Interesting.
girlie

[soulspinner]

What I dont get is how they identitified it was CERA, which hs been on the market since January and the maker gave no sports body the ability to detect it as they put no markers in the drug, as was earlier reported. Sorry about the run on-its early...

[cadence90]

I kind of dig on Ricco.....his ability to speak up may in the end equal a-whole-lot-of good for the sport. Now the notion of honor enters the sport in a new way. For messing up and getting caught......he is doing the honorable thing. And at the very lease he's screaming out about the fact there are still fellas in there - who he has to compete against - not clean. And yes this will keep him on the list in 2 years. But at least he found away to speak up a bit and not completely shut up or say only what saves his ass.
Interesting.
girlie
I think we've heard all that before from many of the saintly, reformed and reborn "apoligists". Nothing new to this tactic, imho.

[BumbleBeeDave]

.....his ability to speak up may in the end equal a-whole-lot-of good for the sport.

I don't "dig" him. I find his cheating detestable and his admission has a self-serving air about it. But he raises an important and troubling point when he observes that if the testing was so good, then every one of the 13 tests should have been positive. That means the tests may not be nearly as reliable as the testers claim, which boosts the claims of innocence and victimization of people like Landis and Hamilton. To me it also raises the equally troubling possibility that the testers took the samples but did not test them all, either as a cost saving measure or simple laziness, depending on the threat of a positive to keep riders from cheating.

BBD

[hoss]

What BBD said. His selfishness cost many their jobs and drove a sponsor from the sport. He's a tool.

[Erik.Lazdins]

So CERA was brand spanking new early this year and here goes my theory...

Since its new and allegedly gets blocked by the kidney its totally undetectable SO its tempting for someone looking for an unfair advantage to try it. Here is this new drug, there is no test...

Even though the test didn't catch all of Ricco's samples, it still was developed in time and probably caused a few riders to be nervous.

The testing is getting better, I do think there will always be those who try and get the unfair advantage. I believe its part of sport. And since the testing is getting better, the cheats are getting better as well.

I do like that Ricco came clean pretty quickly. Since he is young, 2 years suspension may give him another shot at riding professionally.

[girlie]

I think we've heard all that before from many of the saintly, reformed and reborn "apoligists". Nothing new to this tactic, imho.

He never had to say anything about the other samples not coming back pos.......he could have just said; It was me, me alone, I made a bad choice.....I feel bad for my teammates. But to say more than was needed, to simply save ass, was not an accident......and earns him bonus points in my book. And yes my book is very important;)
Still dig on him because in a ****ty situation...he's handling business. Grant it he's young and has less to lose than some.....but still he's taking his opportunities and informing. He let us know the best way he could. Not saying it's ok to take the drugs but he ain't alone. And his speaking up, for me, is an indication that doing the drugs in the first place may not be what he REALLY would like to be doing.

[Samster]

.

[bnewt07]

How refreshing to hear such openness and honesty from a rider.

Righte after they'd attempted to be dishonest and deceitful-but got caught

[Samster]

How refreshing to hear such openness and honesty from a rider.

Righte after they'd attempted to be dishonest and deceitful-but got caught
+1. no disagreement.

[cadence90]

I don't "dig" him. I find his cheating detestable and his admission has a self-serving air about it. But he raises an important and troubling point when he observes that if the testing was so good, then every one of the 13 tests should have been positive. That means the tests may not be nearly as reliable as the testers claim, which boosts the claims of innocence and victimization people like Landis and Hamilton. To me it also raises the equally troubling possibility that the testers took the samples but did not test them all, either as a cost saving measure or simple laziness, depending on the threat of a positive to keep riders from cheating.

BBD
Frankly, BBD, despite Ricco's admission, he not only admitted (as did Piepoli) that Piepoli gave him the stuff, and that he took it.

So he doped, period, and sullied his own reputation and his country's.
I am sick of these "admissions" which result in slaps on the wrist and the perpetual cycle of hope for "truly clean racing" being dashed.
He doped, he admitted it, he should be banned.

The arguments re: Phloyd, Tyler, testing, etc. are naive at best, because if your point is correct than CSC, Garmin, Columbia really don't have such sturdy and holy legs to stand on after all, do they, if the testing itself is suspect? No?

Perhaps the testing agencies are not perfect, I don't presume to know.
The fundamental problem is the sport itself is completely hypocritical, imo, between the riders, the teams, the managers, the organizers, the testing agencies....

Heck, maybe Paul Sherwen doped in his 7 tours and Senile Phil probably needs EPO just to turn the cranks on that stupid Bike Friday of his, so they soft-peddle the entire issue, like most of the rest of the world.

Marion Jones never actually tested positive, afaik, and she's in jail.

Imo: Ban these guys for life: if they dope and are caught: that phase of their life is over, and they can learn to be bakers or truck drivers or mechanics or lawyers or artists, etc. And the team managers can join them, in the real world.

Ricco' was/is a HUGE disappointment, being of the so-called "new generation".
What BS. :crap:

These "admitted, reformed, apologetic" riders aren't saints. They cheated.

Dope at your day job, and I bet you are forever out of work at that firm for life, period.

[BumbleBeeDave]

He never had to say anything about the other samples not coming back pos.......he could have just said; It was me, me alone, I made a bad choice.....I feel bad for my teammates. But to say more than was needed, to simply save ass, was not an accident......and earns him bonus points in my book.

That's a good point. Maybe I'd have more respect for him if he didn't already have the reputation of having a big mouth. He was talking mighty big about how he was beating people or was going to beat people. "Today I will attack the Polack and the Joey on the climb" or some such nonsense . . . Great quotes for the press, but now we see exactly why he was so confident.

BBD

[girlie]

Dope at your day job, and I bet you are forever out of work at that firm for life, period.

Not true:D ;)

[cadence90]

He never had to say anything about the other samples not coming back pos.......he could have just said; It was me, me alone, I made a bad choice.....I feel bad for my teammates. But to say more than was needed, to simply save ass, was not an accident......and earns him bonus points in my book. And yes my book is very important;)
Still dig on him because in a ****ty situation...he's handling business. Grant it he's young and has less to lose than some.....but still he's taking his opportunities and informing. He let us know the best way he could. Not saying it's ok to take the drugs but he ain't alone. And his speaking up, for me, is an indication that doing the drugs in the first place may not be what he REALLY would like to be doing.
Yes, I know your book is important.

But he chose to do what he did. These guys aren't victims: they are representatives of the perpetual system.

I could somewhat respect his current statements if they were made the same day he was busted; instead, that day and after, it was denial after denial.
Now he plays the goodie-two-shoes...= hypocrite in my book.

[cadence90]

Not true:D ;)
Well, maybe not your job, but most typical middle-class Americans jobs....

Hell, I interviewed at an architectecture firm that during the interview notified me that they required doping testing as part of the application. That interview ended real fast, on my part, and I couldn't wait to get out of the parking lot.

PS: "I have never, ever tested positive." :D

[girlie]

Well, maybe not your job, but most typical middle-class Americans jobs....

Hell, I interviewed at an architectecture firm that during the interview notified me that they required doping testing as part of the application. That interview ended real fast, on my part, and I couldn't wait to get out of the parking lot.

PS: "I have never, ever tested positive." :D

Cadence90 denial until you are busted......poor form ;)
Shoe on the other foot :D
As Mr. Burroughs would say; "Wouldn't you."
They may not be victims in our normal sense of the word but nor are they in a fair playing ground. It will take time and so what - it should take time...to clean this up. All positive progress in my book - which has already been recognized as very important.

[BumbleBeeDave]

Frankly, BBD, despite Ricco's admission, he not only admitted (as did Piepoli) that Piepoli gave him the stuff, and that he took it.

So he doped, period, and sullied his own reputation and his country's.
I am sick of these "admissions" which result in slaps on the wrist and the perpetual cycle of hope for "truly clean racing" being dashed.
He doped, he admitted it, he should be banned.

The arguments re: Phloyd, Tyler, testing, etc. are naive at best, because if your point is correct than CSC, Garmin, Columbia really don't have such sturdy and holy legs to stand on after all, do they, if the testing itself is suspect? No?


. . . since I essentially agree with you. I will give Ricco positive points as Girlie does, but only on that one issue--pointing out the tests may not be reliable. The rest of his "admission" rings hollow to me and I deplore it's hypocrisy. I'm also NOT saying that Landis and Hamilton are innocent, but only that Ricco's observation, if true, bolsters the claims that Landis and Hamilton also made as part of their defenses that the tests are not reliable.

The teams you mention may not have rock solid legs to stand on, but they are certainly making the good faith effort to do something. I think the commitment by a team in that direction, showing where their ethics lie, is more likely to attract riders who share and admire those ethics and the effort the teams are making. So you are simply likely to see more honest riders on one of those teams not because they are afraid of getting caught, but because they sign on to the effort being made.

BBD

[cadence90]

Cadence90 denial until you are busted......poor form ;)
Shoe on the other foot :D
As Mr. Burroughs would say; "Wouldn't you."
They may not be victims in our normal sense of the word but nor are they in a fair playing ground. It will take time and so what - it should take time...to clean this up. All positive progress in my book - which has already been recognized as very important.
Not denial at all. Just stating the "facts".
The facts are all that counts, right???

PS1 (hey, isn't that a cool art place???): all my shoes fit; I never have to switch feet.
It makes life so convenient, easy, care-free and simple.... :rolleyes:

PS2: Burroughs was more honest than most of these these dudes combined.

[cadence90]

. . . since I essentially agree with you. I will give Ricco positive points as Girlie does, but only on that one issue--pointing out the tests may not be reliable. The rest of his "admission" rings hollow to me and I deplore it's hypocrisy. I'm also NOT saying that Landis and Hamilton are innocent, but only that Ricco's observation, if true, bolsters the claims that Landis and Hamilton also made as part of their defenses that the tests are not reliable.

The teams you mention may not have rock solid legs to stand on, but they are certainly making the good faith effort to do something. I think the commitment by a team in that direction, showing where their ethics lie, is more likely to attract riders who share and admire those ethics and the effort the teams are making. So you are simply likely to see more honest riders on one of those teams not because they are afraid of getting caught, but because they sign on to the effort being made.

BBD
BBD: I've seen your Acqua Sapone kit, with you in it....It's a lovely kit.

However, no offense, but if you have a "chimeric twin", like Tyler had/did/does/will, who wears whatever the chimeric opposite of that kit is...PLEASE: do not post pics.

TIA! :)

Yes, I agree: I hope the "clean teams", and that Bjarne "Mr. 65" Riis et al are truly committed to reform. We'll see.

I think it will take another generation, including new managers, riders and sponsors, before real faith is restored again, in all sports, not just cyclisming.

You know that doping is now the first thing that comes to mind in many people's minds now :
Dara Torres, age 41, sets an American record. The press "Doper?".
Tyson Gay runs the fastest 100M ever (wind-aided). The press: "Doper?"
Iskinbayeva (or whatever the Russian female pole vaulter's name is) sets her her 16th World Record yesterday. The press: "Doper?"
Tiger Woods: The press: "Doper?".
Etc.

It has become almost semi-accepted, or used as the kernel for potential "revealing" and "scandalous" "reporting". It's now a true mind-set in the culture.

[BumbleBeeDave]

I think it will take another generation, including new managers, riders and sponsors, before real faith is restored again, in all sports, not just cyclisming.

You know that doping is now the first thing that comes to mind in many people's minds now :
Dara Torres, age 41, sets an American record. The press "Doper?".
Tyson Gay runs the fastest 100M ever (wind-aided). The press: "Doper?"
Iskinbayeva (or whatever the Russian female pole vaulter's name is) sets her her 16th World Record yesterday. The press: "Doper?"
Tiger Woods: The press: "Doper?".
Etc.

It has become almost semi-accepted, or used as the kernel for potential "revealing" and "scandalous" "reporting". It's now a true mind-set in the culture.

Agree with you 100%!

BBD

[jmc22]

Oh Yeah.... Lance was never caught, I mean, tested positive! He is the greatest cheat, I mean, rider this country has ever produced!!!

..A.. :hello: :beer:

Avispa:

Sorry man, but your quote holds water as well as a fishing net...Ricco was tested 10 times and came back with 2 positives...LA was tested lets say for argument sake a 100 times in the 7 consecutive yrs he won the Tour...using the same odds LA would have tested positive around 20 times...funny, I don't remember LA EVER testing positive! :fight:

[Marcusaurelius]

Ricco was a cheat and he got caught. I don't have a respect for someone who cheats even when he confesses a few days later.

If you can't win without cheating then you need to try something you can do well without cheating. Ping pong maybe? Or golf? I haven't heard of many golfers using performance enhancing drugs.

And of course there's always a typical lance hater offering up yet another mindless quote to inflate his ego.

[fiamme red]

All he needs is the baseball hat turned backwards and baggier pants to complete the look. :rolleyes:

http://www.velonews.com/photo/81090

http://www.velonews.com/files/images/RiccoCONI.jpg

[Elefantino]

I don't have a respect for someone who cheats even when he confesses a few days later.
Nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnot quite.

I'll bet you, like I, have respect for David Millar, who has seen the light and is among the driving forces behind a clean sport. Ditto for Bjarne Riis (who, of course, didn't confess a few days later). Each of them realized what they did was wrong and are making great amends.

If Ricco comes back as a strong anti-doping advocate and wins, more power to him.

[girlie]

Nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnot quite.

I'll bet you, like I, have respect for David Millar, who has seen the light and is among the driving forces behind a clean sport. Ditto for Bjarne Riis (who, of course, didn't confess a few days later). Each of them realized what they did was wrong and are making great amends.

If Ricco comes back as a strong anti-doping advocate and wins, more power to him.

That's the spirit......positive moves forward not negative looks backward.

[goonster]

if you have a "chimeric twin", like Tyler

Tyler never claimed to have had a chimeric twin. That was a hypothetical scenario presented to challenge the lab's laughable assertion that their test had "no known failure rate", i.e. a 0% rate of false positives. In that context, it was a reasonable argument.

I think Ricco's statements are important because they represent positive feedback (at least to the public) that the testing works at least once in a while. Dick Pound's grandstanding statements notwithstanding, the labs don't make claims with respect to the infallability of their tests, and rightfully so. They claim only that their positives are credible, and they are expected to back that up in the arbitration hearings (quite poorly in the Landis case, imho). Anyway, the lab's criteria for an EPO positive are very strict, so they see a lot of data that would be considered "inconclusive" or "probably positive" but because it doesn't meet the exact, certified criteria is not a positive. Anybody with experience in instrumental analysis knows how this works. A 20% return, with 80% "false negatives" sounds about right to me, and is vastly preferable to even 1% false positives.

The Garmin and Astana programs are different, because the analysts can treat the results completely subjectively. If something looks "possibly positive" you approach the rider and try to resolve the situation. Apples and oranges. The testing is infinitely more meaningful if you can look at larger data sets, instead of trying to derive a positive/negative result on a single sample.

[cadence90]

Ricco' first adamantly denied doping (even his sister got in the act), then pulled a 180. admitted and is going to name those who "aided" him in doping.
The reason: to gain a reduced penalty/sentence.

To me, that's indicative of the continuing hypocrisy within the system.
He knew beforehand what the risks and sanctions would be if he were to be caught, and he should be made to suffer the consequences. "No gifts...."

Survey from today's "Gazzetta dello Sport":

"Ricco' has admitted to doping and is naming those who helped him; for this he will be offered a reduced sentence. Is this correct?"

NO:.......................................65.0%
YES:......................................35.0%
Number of voters: 22,699

I'm with the NOs.

14,755 Italians can't be wrong.... ;)

[mikki]

Dope at your day job, and I bet you are forever out of work at that firm for life, period.

Gees, at our new yet-to-be opened location within a huge 15,000 sq. ft. Wellness Center at a local hospital, we not only have to have a drug/alcohol tested whenever they choose, but a credit check and background check also. The credit check seems like an invasion of privacy.. don't want them to see how much I drop at Nordstoms.

IMO, I think we've not heard the end of favorites doping. It is really an unnatural thing to be racing for three weeks over the mountains and in the rain or heat. It takes supernatural powers; some have it in natural form; others have to create it synthetically. I think we'll continue to be disappointed for some time as others are fingered for doping. Maybe it will never end, but my hope is that the tours will become cleaner and cleaner as the cheaters are weeded out.

[I Want Sachs?]

What if internal testing program of these "clean teams" is really a titration program to dope to a level right below positive threshold?

[Karin Kirk]

Back to the issue of how the labs detected CERA - I believe that the drug company, Hoffman-LaRoche, gave samples of the compound to WADA well ahead of time so they could develop analyses for it.

And I don't think that you can extrapolate that because some of Ricco's positive samples didn't show up as positive, then perhaps some of Floyd's or Tyler's samples may have been falsely positive. For one thing, that extrapolation may not work the same way in both directions (in other words, a false positive is a whole different result from a false negative) and they were completely different types of doping in each case. So I don't think that argument holds much water, scientifically speaking.

So, the science isn't perfect yet, what else is new? But we do have some cases where it's working and that indeed is progress. As a spectator, the biggest improvement has been faster turnaround at the labs so that the cheaters get caught and yanked before they have time to go on and win the whole race.

Did you notice too that in the VS coverage on the last day of the Tour they did a little review of the race and they never showed a photo or mentioned the name of Ricco or anyone from his team. It was like it never happened. I thought that was interesting.

[Elefantino]

I believe that the drug company, Hoffman-LaRoche, gave samples of the compound to WADA well ahead of time so they could develop analyses for it.
That, I think, is the revelation of this whole matter. The drug companies are cooperating. It's about time. If all the manufacturers pass on their drugs' markers to the test makers before the products enter use, game over.

It makes so much sense it's a wonder it wasn't thought of before.