Not another shimmy thread...

[chakatrain]

...but a "noodley feel" thread.

Both my custom CIII from '05 and my stock '07 Legend Ti feel "noodley" in the front end (yes, I know this is *highly* subjective). Same wheelset was used for both (Kysrium SLs). CIII had a Reynolds Ouzo Pro, 43mm rake (complementing the 73degree HTA) while the Legend Ti has a F3, 6.5, fork, 43mm rake (complementing the 73degree HTA).

Both bikes are "noodley" downhill hils and on fast rollers. By "noodley" I mean that the entire front end doesn't feel solid underneath me. I'm not going to be able to explain it well (lack of writing skills, I'm afraid), but bascially it makes the bikes unrideable down the mt. passes I love to climb. Yes, sometimes the noodley feel can become a shimmy, but this isn't the topic for this thread.

Are Serottas generally a bit "noodley" up front? Of course this depends on a zillion things, like the tubeset used, wheels, etc.

I'm 5' 10", 160lbs, thin, no upper body strength, decent leg strength.

[SPOKE]

noodley compared to what other bike??

[regularguy412]

How's your position? Got enough weight on the front end?

My long-time riding/racing buddy recently (well, ongoing since late last summer) had this same experience. He had a 'near-death' experience going down a hill on one of our usual routes. That day, he put it off to having been stung by a wasp on the hand and was not gripping the bars with equal pressure with both hands.

Unfortunately, that experience made him a bit gun-shy and he didn't like getting over about 22-24 mph downhill after that. So last week, I told him I'd ride his bike down that same hill, at speed, and see for my self if there was any issue.

The bike is a 2005 Special Ed Roubaix. All DA 10 speed with OP wheels, Revolution spokes and Michelin P2R tires. The headset is not loose, nor are the hub bearings.

I took it down the hill and pedaled it up to about 42 mph in the 11 and tucked up. I could not make the bike shimmy. However, it seemed to me that the front end seemed 'light', for lack of a better descriptive term.

The bike has aluminum bars, but a CF stem. It just seemed to me that the higher front end on the Roubaix coupled with the upturned stem let too much weight be transferred to the back half. Later that week, he took all the spacers out from beneath the stem and moved his saddle forward just a bit.

He says the changes have helped , but he's still not feeling real comfortable descending. I haven't had a chance to ride the bike after the changes.

This type change is something you might look into.

Mike in AR:beer:

[Peter P.]

Bikes with low trail figures will feel vague or unsure at higher speeds. I don't know why this is true, but I certainly experienced it on a bike I had with a low 50mm trail figure. Turning at high speed, it felt like the front wheel was on ice.

Your two bikes with 73/43 combinations SHOULDN'T feel noodly (which I interpret as vague); perhaps you would find a bike with an even greater amount of trail preferable.

[Fixed]

noodley compared to what other bike??
+1 and....
have you gone down recently bro
cheers

[chakatrain]

It's noodly compared to my steel gunnar crosshairs, which has a bit larger trail (~61mm) and a longer wheelbase (gunner=101mm; legend and ciii=99cm). Wheels on the gunnar are open pro 32x laced to ultegra hubs. Trail on both serottas is basically the same at ~59, (23mm tired), according to the great Kogswell trail calculator.

I did go down earlier this year, but at slow speed turning onto a wet bridge, so it *shouldn't* affect my fast downhilling, but in truth, I'm a bit more gunshy.

I think I'm putting enough weight forward. I have read to put less weight forward to avoid the vauge feeling up front...not sure what to do now.

I think next steps are to try [a] riding the serottas with a different front wheel to see how that feels and [b] experiment with a 40mm rake fork to increase front trial. Oh...and [c] keep practicing riding downhill fast to get used to the active feel.

[Ken Robb]

I had a Legend and a CSI they were both stock and wonderful descenders with F1 fork on CSI and O2 fork on Legend. I dumped the Ksyriums that came on the Legend for Open Pro 32 holes on Ultegra or DA 10spd. I had Spinergy SR 3 wheels on the CSI and replaced them with Open Pros on Chorus 32 hole.
None of these set-ups felt at all noodly.

I didn't like the Ks because they did get pushed around in crosswinds and that made the bike feel like it was slightly vague-handling at times.

[mgm777]

I have a 04 Legend w/ hand built 28 spoke DT Swiss wheels. The Legend is my best descending bike. Solid and stable at speeds approaching 50 mph on the long curvy descents around here (Boulder, CO). My brother rides a Madone with is also typically, a stable descender. However, if there are any significant cross winds, he too complains that the bike feels "unstable" while descending. He attributes this feeling to the flat-bladed spokes of his aero wheelset. If there is no wind, then the bike is rock solid. I have heard the Ks are more sensitive to crosswinds.