Compact Drive

[mike p]

I see many new bikes have what they call compact drive with 50-34 chainrings. What is the advantage of this? Can you convert to normal drive by just changing back to 53 39 chainrings? Thanks for any help.

mike

[Serotta PETE]

Mike, the advantage is that a person can have lower gear ratios for climbing without the need to install a triple crank. Largest Ultegra/Dura-Ace rear cog set is 27 teeth. If a 39/27 is not low enough, a person must go to a triple which requires new crank, and usually front&rear der.

With compact, most folks can have more than enough gears with a 34/27 and no new der...

I personally have not seen a compact that you can switch back to chainrings of 39/53. I hear that with TA cranks you can do this but I do not have personal experience.

PETE

[dbrk]

TA makes chainrings in nearly every size. There is no disadvantage to the 110bcd. Deda has a new crank with this bcd and I have had luck getting a few of the new Ritcheys which are nicely made and relatively cheap. The most beautiful of all 110bcd cranks, the TA Zephyr was discontinued because it's better to have some thing uglier (apparently). If you are creative you can use the TA Cyclotouriste with the etoille attachment and use _any_ size chainring you can imagine. Of course that's an old school solution that makes far too much sense given the need to sell new stuff, especially the next expensive gadget made of carbon. See the Velonews's report on the Milan show for the death of metal article...I digress.

dbrk
happy to have all the TA I think I will need...

[Cavu]

I set up my Legend with an FSA compact crank set. I like climbing and the 34/50 lets me do that pretty well. I climbed to an 8700 foot pass a couple weeks ago and didn't have to get out of the saddle. The only downside was the decent; I maxed out my ability to push down hill any faster with the 50. The guy riding with me was riding a 53. It gave him just a little more oomph. BUT, I was still cruising down the mountain at 45+ miles per hour, which for this old fart is pushing the comfort zone. [Note: while riding some ridges in the NAPA area last week, some of the last pitches were definitly in the double digit % climb. I had to get out the saddle to make a few of the pitches. If was riding in that environment more often, I mike put a granny sprocket on the year.]

In short, I like the compact crankset. I don't think the FSA can go larger on the big ring ( could be wrong ), but I've been told the small ring can go up to 36. [Note, I ride a 36/52 on another bike and have to get out of the saddle more often.] But, I don't have any plans to change the system. By the way, my cogset on the Legend is 12-25.

I agree with many of the comments above re: what necessitates going to triple. Having ridden some triple systems, I would reserve there application to touring with gear on board.

My only gripe with the FSA system is that it is not compatible with Campy BB's. So I went with Octalink.

Hope my rantings helps.
-c

[Dekonick]

How well do the compact cranksets work with standard front der's? I see Campy is now making special der's...

[Bruce K]

I have had no trouble with my FSA compacts and "standard" Shimano front derailleurs.

My Ottrott has the compact carbons (50/34) and a D-A 9 speed front der. and my cross bike has FSA Energys (46/34) and a 105 front der.

You might need to relocate the front der. slightly to maintain proper clearances.

BK

[dbrk]

I have used all of the "standard" Shimano and Campagnolo front derailleurs on the more-or-less standard 50/36 or 34 or close to those including my own favorite 46/36 (more use of the big ring for things other than hammering or descending at crazy speeds and around here you are always looking for gears). Everything works just fine and I like to mix the "wrong" front derailleur particularly into a homogenous "industry-standard" group. I would use a Zeus or Suntour derailleur just to make a point: my own futile, foolish, pointless effort to defy what the corporations tell I should do.
I have done just that on contemporary brifter groups: Mavic, Suntour, Fuji made by Suntour, Simplex, and Huret front derailleurs all shifting on STI/Ergo bikes without the slightest glitch in the obsession to feel nothing. BTW, the 105 double front will often shift a triple, especially a 46/36/2X without having to go long cage: it is a far superior design to the Ult/DA which are the same shape.

dbrk

[Birddog]

I've been messing around with a Compact w/Record 10, and it takes a full sweep and a half of the shifter to move the chain to the big chainring with standard short derailleur. It should be noted that I'm using an "el cheapo" Nashbar crank and rings coupled with a Wippermann chain. I'd be interested in knowing if others have this slight problem with Record 10. It's just a small nuisance and I'm getting used to it. I'm not sure if it's the chainrings, the chain, or adjustments, however I've tried all the adjusting that I think is possible.

Birddog

[davep]

Interesting - my bike has a 50/36/26 and I tried to use a 105 triple front derailleur and it would not work properly. Changed to a DA triple FD and it works much better.

[jeffg]

I set up my Legend with an FSA compact crank set. I like climbing and the 34/50 lets me do that pretty well. I climbed to an 8700 foot pass a couple weeks ago and didn't have to get out of the saddle. The only downside was the decent; I maxed out my ability to push down hill any faster with the 50. The guy riding with me was riding a 53. It gave him just a little more oomph. BUT, I was still cruising down the mountain at 45+ miles per hour, which for this old fart is pushing the comfort zone. [Note: while riding some ridges in the NAPA area last week, some of the last pitches were definitly in the double digit % climb. I had to get out the saddle to make a few of the pitches. If was riding in that environment more often, I mike put a granny sprocket on the year.]

In short, I like the compact crankset. I don't think the FSA can go larger on the big ring ( could be wrong ), but I've been told the small ring can go up to 36. [Note, I ride a 36/52 on another bike and have to get out of the saddle more often.] But, I don't have any plans to change the system. By the way, my cogset on the Legend is 12-25.

I agree with many of the comments above re: what necessitates going to triple. Having ridden some triple systems, I would reserve there application to touring with gear on board.

My only gripe with the FSA system is that it is not compatible with Campy BB's. So I went with Octalink.

Hope my rantings helps.
-c

Cavu --

Where were you riding in Napa? I just got back from vacation in the Bay Area and got a few quick rides in on the old haunts in Napa/Sonoma. To keep with the compact topic, I was using a 48/34 PMP Microroad setup (12-27). :banana:

[Kurt]

Mike, the advantage is that a person can have lower gear ratios for climbing without the need to install a triple crank. Largest Ultegra/Dura-Ace rear cog set is 27 teeth. If a 39/27 is not low enough, a person must go to a triple which requires new crank, and usually front&rear der.

With compact, most folks can have more than enough gears with a 34/27 and no new der...

I personally have not seen a compact that you can switch back to chainrings of 39/53. I hear that with TA cranks you can do this but I do not have personal experience.

PETE.

The poster did not say if he was using 9 or 10, it its 9 speed then an mtb cassette can be used - all the way up to 34. If its campy 10 then it will shift a 9-speed mtb also. Cycle dymanic will make 27+ for 9 or 10 campy or shimano, all ti, very nice replaceable cogs for around $ 140us. Just remember if you use a compact it changes all the high gears, if you ride alone you might not care, but in club rides you will.

[Dekonick]

OK

Now we are getting somewhere!

If I wanted to try compact cranks, and I did not have access to the plethera of old school parts DBRK seems to have hidden from Sandy's super slippery sneaky snatching hands, what do yall suggest?

I was looking at the Nashbar compact crank, just to try it out. FSA also makes an Al crank that could be another option. Its gonna go on a cross bike that wont be set up as a cross bike all the time (the good old cross check I have on order...) so I dont want to use nice cranks. It (hopefully) will be a fixxie or commuter/rain bike most of the time.

FSA carbon compacts are out as are the Campy compacts (but they do look nice)

so - how have yer experiences been? (I am grumpy today - havent been on the bike in a week except on rollers - thanks to rain, work, or waiting for repairmen to show up...however I can now ride rollers - even while watching TV.)

Hey - Sandy - I was reading the potomic pedalers printed paper - and listed leading a group ride was 'sweeping sandy...' is that you by chance? (this Sat. ride) - wish I could go but I have a friend getting married....

[93legendti]

Cavu --

Where were you riding in Napa? I just got back from vacation in the Bay Area and got a few quick rides in on the old haunts in Napa/Sonoma. To keep with the compact topic, I was using a 48/34 PMP Microroad setup (12-27). :banana:

Some of the best riding I have one was in Napa/Sonoma...Trinity Grade, the climb out of Bodega Bay and one more killer climb on the way to Bodega.

[Serotta PETE]

Some of the best riding I have one was in Napa/Sonoma...Trinity Grade, the climb out of Bodega Bay and one more killer climb on the way to Bodega.


This is a great ride....Spokes and I were out there about 4 years ago. Pete

[93legendti]

I wish I could remember the very steep climb on the road to Bodega Bay...we climbed past an elementary school. It was recess and the teachers and kids outside thought we were nuts!

[Birddog]

Dekonick,
I bought the el cheapo Nashbar compact because it was cheaper than the cheapest Campy 10 sp cassette. It also gave me the opportunity to try it and see if I liked it w/o much invested. I think I got it for about $60 with a discount.

Birddog

[jeffg]

Some of the best riding I have one was in Napa/Sonoma...Trinity Grade, the climb out of Bodega Bay and one more killer climb on the way to Bodega.

Yes, I just did Trinity/Dry Creek/Oakville Grade last week. A very satisfying ride, even when done in the heat of the day. My other favorites are King's Ridge and Fort Ross.

On the Bodega Bay loop, are you thinking of Joy Road?

Another thought: If you take trinity/dry creek and descend into Napa, continue into St. Helena and then find Spring Mountain Road (take a left just out of "town). Take this climb up to the Sonoma line at the top of the ridge, and then follow St. Helena Road (the name on the Sonoma side) to Calisotga Road to return to 12. This makes a great loop.

Ah, to be back in CA :(

[93legendti]

That sounds right. Hpow steep is Trinity Grade? Our tour leader said it was 6 %, but it felt like 9% or more!

[jeffg]

That sounds right. Hpow steep is Trinity Grade? Our tour leader said it was 6 %, but it felt like 9% or more!


Who is your tour leader? After you cross Highway 12 and get to the base of the climb, it's 2.9 miles @ 8.6% according to my Polar data. As you know, the bottom 2/3 is much steeper than the last part, which flattens significantly.

The backside (Oakville+Dry Creek) is good as well, with about 1 mile @ 12% on Oakville and another 2.9 miles @ 7%. with the first 1.8 of that at 9%. The last time I was there I didn't have enough time to hit the loop through St. Helena, so I just did the out and back. That gets you a little over 3600 vertical feet in just under 20 miles. :banana: :banana: :banana:

[93legendti]

It was a Breaking Away Napa/Sonoma trip in 2002. it was pretty cool, it was really foggy and yes it was steeper at the bottom! How steep are the steepest parts? I knew it was close to 9%!

[jeffg]

It was a Breaking Away Napa/Sonoma trip in 2002. it was pretty cool, it was really foggy and yes it was steeper at the bottom! How steep are the steepest parts? I knew it was close to 9%!

Trinity is not too bad. I have done it in the fog at about 6:00 AM as part of the Terrible Two Double Century, so I know about descending the backside when it is a bit wet (dew). Anyway, maybe because it's the first climb it doesn't seem as bad as several of the others. I would say the maxiumum gradient is likely a little over 11%. It is a great climb!