I miss swoop ...

[Fixed]

bro I miss that funny and smart cat and bro is too tall still here/
i hope grant is .. and the master too
cheers

[Louis]

I heard Swoop flipped his stem...

[92degrees]

Maybe they're at the other lunchtable. Oh, wait, that was the last time everyone left.

[Keith A]

They certainly aren't at this lunchtable (http://frameforum.net/)...as it looks like they let their domain name expire :eek:

[fiamme red]

They certainly aren't at this lunchtable (http://frameforum.net/)...as it looks like they let their domain name expire :eek:http://www.frameforum.org/forum3/index.php

[TMB]

They certainly aren't at this lunchtable (http://frameforum.net/)...as it looks like they let their domain name expire :eek:


.org now

[fiamme red]

Swoop bought a new bike. He's now growing a beard.

http://ca.geocities.com/rbscycle/pics/swb2_1.jpg

[Ahneida Ride]

Would some one PLEASE release me from Double Secret Probation?

[csm]

did swoop leave?

[shinomaster]

I think his feeling got hurt. ;)

[ti_boi]

:rolleyes:

[Blue Jays]

Get Well soon!

[CNY rider]

Yep, I'm just all broken up.
It's a struggle to go on, but somehow I will make it!

[fiamme red]

Yep, I'm just all broken up.
It's a struggle to go on, but somehow I will make it!No more free therapy. :crap:

[News Man]

No more free therapy. :crap:


I find myself in the following quandary. I miss Swoop so much I may need therapy and he is not here to give it to me. :crap:

[taylorj]

Notice how cowgirl and swoop disappeared about the same time? :D

[RPS]

Swoop bought a new bike.

http://ca.geocities.com/rbscycle/pics/swb2_1.jpg

There is no way that's swoop's. It has a kick stand.

[mosca]

There is no way that's swoop's. It has a kick stand.
But the flag matches his booties!

[ClutchCargo]

I find myself in the following quandary. I miss Swoop so much I may need therapy and he is not here to give it to me. :crap:

you get what you pay for


:crap:

p.s. you could just keep banging your head against a wall. it feels good when you stop!

[Louis]

Swoop bought a new bike.

No wonder he's so fast. Faired recumbents are the slickest (technical aerodynamic term) things out there.

[taylorj]

swoop is busy riding his bike...he is not the cowgirl.

[M.Sommers]

Swoop will be on CNN Crossfire tonight. He's endorsing someone for the Election in November. The he's off to do Larry King to discuss the Giro, Tour de France, EPO, the latest on the LeMaire-Knee surgery technique, the benefit of trimming your nasal hair, summer skin care, Prince's upcoming album, folks whose shoelaces don't match their sneakers and to address the massive debate of business professionals who don't wear socks that are:

1). Either the same color as their dress slacks or:
2). The same color as the slacks, but a darker shade than the color of the dress slacks.

Swoop for VP I say!

:beer:

[confente]

swoop is busy riding his bike...he is not the cowgirl.


Oh yeah? Well no one has seen the two of them in the same place at the same time... what does that tell ya?

[paczki]

Oh yeah? Well no one has seen the two of them in the same place at the same time... what does that tell ya?

Actually the two have been logged in at the same time.

Joni, Old La Honda Road is tough. How'd you get up there in under 20 minutes!

[taylorj]

Oh yeah? Well no one has seen the two of them in the same place at the same time... what does that tell ya?

i know...i gave him h3ll over email though and he swears he is not he/she.

[M.Sommers]

Oh yeah? Well no one has seen the two of them in the same place at the same time... what does that tell ya?

watch larry king.

[taylorj]

Actually the two have been logged in at the same time.

Joni, Old La Honda Road is tough. How'd you get up there in under 20 minutes!

My husband can do it in 16 and change. I rode up it everyday---always started my rides up Old La Honda or Kings. The GM at Palo Alto can do it in 18:something. My best time was 19:43 and I was pretty sick when I got to the top. I stood the whole way up!

[paczki]

My husband can do it in 16 and change. I rode up it everyday---always started my rides up Old La Honda or Kings. The GM at Palo Alto can do it in 18:something. My best time was 19:43 and I was pretty sick when I got to the top. I stood the whole way up!

I didn't know you were married to Lance :)

BTW I think girlie had it right. I liked swoops posts, and those of a lot of people who haven't been posting recently, but I also like taylorj's posts and those of all sorts of people who have started posting recently.

[taylorj]

I didn't know you were married to Lance :)

BTW I think girlie had it right. I liked swoops posts, and those of a lot of people who haven't been posting recently, but I also like taylorj's posts and those of all sorts of people who have started posting recently.

Yeah---it's that circular thing---as the world and the wheels turn. I will be in Boston in July and am going to try and work in a ride with some of you guys!

[paczki]

Yeah---it's that circular thing---as the world and the wheels turn. I will be in Boston in July and am going to try and work in a ride with some of you guys!

We'll have to have a pre-Tour de Bivalve!

[jeffg]

My husband can do it in 16 and change. I rode up it everyday---always started my rides up Old La Honda or Kings. The GM at Palo Alto can do it in 18:something. My best time was 19:43 and I was pretty sick when I got to the top. I stood the whole way up!

16 is very, very fast

I have only broken 20 minutes twice and that was a few pounds ago.

Hey, did you/do you ride a Seven Alta?

[taylorj]

16 is very, very fast

I have only broken 20 minutes twice and that was a few pounds ago.

Hey, did you/do you ride a Seven Alta?

That's me!

[PoppaWheelie]

That's me!

Where do you guys start/stop your timing? Just curious...

Thread drifting...drifting.....

[keno]

http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSL1593449920080515?feedType=RSS&feedName=worldNews&rpc=22&sp=true

[jeffg]

Where do you guys start/stop your timing? Just curious...

Thread drifting...drifting.....

I time from the bridge to the stop sign, and so do most others I know

[jeffg]

That's me!

Cool! Hope you are doing well and hope to see you on the roads around here sometime.

I have had very limited time to ride but have done Kings or OLH and back every day so far this week ... it's only about 12 miles for the loop from our place but it sure is pretty

[paczki]

Where do you guys start/stop your timing? Just curious...

Thread drifting...drifting.....

I figured it was the stone wall at the bottom up to Skyline. 1300 feet in not enough distance to make it easy.

[A.L.Breguet]

http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSL1593449920080515?feedType=RSS&feedName=worldNews&rpc=22&sp=true
The rim shot heard round the world!
:beer:











.

[taylorj]

Cool! Hope you are doing well and hope to see you on the roads around here sometime.

I have had very limited time to ride but have done Kings or OLH and back every day so far this week ... it's only about 12 miles for the loop from our place but it sure is pretty

Lucky you. I was there two weeks ago and am usually around every 6 weeks visiting my folks. I am envious of your access to the roads of Paradise! I lived there my whole adult life and nothing compares.

Oh, and yes---we time from the bridge at the bottom to the stop sign. :banana:

[shanerpvt]

come back Swoop!

[William]

come back Swoop!

THE ORIGINAL VERSION: If you love something, Set it free... If it comes back, it's yours, If it doesn't, it never was yours....

THE PESSIMIST VERSION: If you love somebody, Set him free ... If he ever comes back, he's yours, If he doesn't, well, as expected, he never was.

THE OPTIMIST VERSION: If you love somebody, Set him free ... Don't worry, he will come back.

THE SUSPICIOUS VERSION: If you love somebody, Set him free ... If he ever comes back, ask him why.

THE IMPATIENT VERSION: If you love somebody, Set him free ... If he doesn't comes back within some time limit, forget him.

THE PATIENT VERSION: If you love somebody, Set him free ... If he doesn't come back, continue to wait until he comes back ...

THE PLAYFUL VERSION: If you love somebody, Set him free ... If he comes back, and if you love him still, set him free again, repeat

THE LAWYER'S VERSION: If you love somebody, Set him free... Clause 1a of Paragraph 13a-1 in the second amendment of the Matrimonial Freedom Act clearly states that...

THE BILL GATES VERSION: If you love somebody, Set him free... If he comes back, I think we can charge him for re-installation fees and tell him that he's also going to get an upgrade.

THE STATISTICIAN'S VERSION:: If you love somebody, Set him free... If he loves you, the probability of him coming back is high If he doesn't, your relationship was improbable anyway.

THE POSSESSIVE VERSION: If you love somebody don't ever set him free.

THE MBA VERSION: If you love somebody set him free... instantaneously... and look for others simultaneously.

THE PSYCHOLOGIST'S VERSION: If you love somebody set him free... If he comes back, his super ego is dominant If he doesn't come, back his id is supreme If he doesn't go, he must be crazy.

THE FINANCE EXPERT VERSION: If you love somebody set him free... If he comes back, its time to look for fresh loans. If he doesn't, write him off as an asset gone bad.

THE MARKETING VERSION: If you love somebody set him free... If he comes back, he has brand loyalty If he doesn't, reposition the brand in new markets.



William ;) :D

[Ti Designs]

It's not fair, I never got to go riding with Swoop.

[Fixed]

you cats would like each other if you did imho
cheers

[Len J]

you cats would like each other if you did imho
cheers

Did he die?

Len

[Ginger]

(No, I don't know if Swoop is part of the protest...this is just the thread I'm on when I thought of it...and I'm not referring to this thread...)

Seems to me that initially the only reason anyone knows that certain folks are not currently participating is because they were told that certain people were proving a point of how much they contributed to the forum by sitting out of the forum.

That whole teenager "Watch this, they'll miss me when I'm gone."

In my opinion the very first "I miss so-and-so" thread was way too early in the protest for it not to have been prompted. (I mean...if nobody noticed they were gone how much of a protest would it be?) Heck, I heard about the protest and the very next day, there was a post "missing" someone.
How could you miss them, they've only been gone 12 hours, they could be sleeping for THAT long!

Not to say that I necessarily don't miss those forum member's contributions.
I just think the protest marketing is funny.

[chuckroast]

.

[rounder]

William is the new swoop and ginger is still the voice of reason (my opinion). Oh yeah, and fixed is still the guiding light (edit).

[cadence90]

Did he die?

Len
Worse, much worse, I think, for one with such a finely tuned command of self-referential psychojive:

I heard his zeitgeist told him he was just another plain old bike rider, while his gestalt insisted that he was indeed a true cyclist of the holy rollers...and, well, pesky contradictions being what they are and knowing that the twain shall never, ever meet, naturally a teenage nervous nerva teena teena nervous breakdown ensued.... :rolleyes:

Or something.

This whole thing is so pathetic.

Gawd willing we really wouldn't have had Nixon to kick around any more....

[paczki]

William is the new swoop and ginger is still the voice of reason (my opinion). Oh yeah, and fixed is still the guiding light (edit).

William has been around much longer, is ever cheerful and helpful.

This "protest" is too lame.

[sn69]

Worse, much worse, I think, for one with such a finely tuned command of self-referential psychojive:

I heard his zeitgeist told him he was just another plain old bike rider, while his gestalt insisted that he was indeed a true cyclist of the holy rollers...and, well, pesky contradictions being what they are and knowing that the twain shall never, ever meet, naturally a teenage nervous nerva teena teena nervous breakdown ensued.... :rolleyes:

Or something.

This whole thing is so pathetic.

Gawd willing we really wouldn't have had Nixon to kick around any more....

12345Idon'thaveanythingfunnyorwittytoadd.

[cadence231]

William has been around much longer, is ever cheerful and helpful.

This "protest" is too lame.

And to think that I bought into Richard's cult of personalityhttp://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/koolaid.gif ...I feel dirty and usedhttp://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/cry.gif .

[paczki]

And to think that I bought into Richard's cult of personalityhttp://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/koolaid.gif ...I feel dirty and usedhttp://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/cry.gif .

Nothing against Richard, he's great. But I've learned more from 11.4s posts than just about anyone. Your posts about the oxygen tent were hysterical. Lots of people add content.

[Dekonick]

Passive agressive protest?

[M.Sommers]

Leonard/Hearns
Leonard/Duran
Leonard/Hagler

Which was the best? Whoever rides with e-RICHIE, please ask him this question for me. He was sneaky smart when it came to sports atmo.


Whoever rides with swoop:

Neutrogena or Lancome sunscreen?


Whoever rides with DarrenCT:

Did he ever have a crush on Ohura?

[Ti Designs]

Did he die?

There are a lot of things you can't do when your dead, posting on the Serotta form isn't one of them.

[Tom]

That's hysterical. In every sense of the word.

[El Chaba]

It has been a case of addition by subtraction.

[capybaras]

It has been a case of addition by subtraction.

+1 :banana:

[keno]

What's being protested? The possibilities are endless around here.

Will there be a march? A mosh pit?

(Nonsense is nonsense, but the study of nonsense is scholarship.)

keno

[shanerpvt]

It has been a case of addition by subtraction.


no. think about all the people you haven't seen post in a few days.......then think about all you've learned from them, we are not better off.

paczki - +1 on 11.4's post. his are my favorite.

[duke]

If you really were learning that much from them, good for you. Personally most of it did nothing for me and I don't miss it. Inevitably it will all start again.
duke

[paczki]

A mosh pit?

keno

I vote for a mosh pit. And if there's no mosh pit I'm going to pout. And blame Serotta -- darn you Ben! I mean it is a Serotta website, it's all their fault in the end.

No good deed goes unpunished.

[Tom]

no. think about all the people you haven't seen post in a few days.......then think about all you've learned from them, we are not better off.

paczki - +1 on 11.4's post. his are my favorite.

It is ironic that we complain how Serotta doesn't add more content to the board. Quite frankly, those that can add a lot tend to add more jokes amongst themselves or American Idol type stuff then actual content. This is fine, really, but the disconnect is mildly amusing.

A lot of people have moved on from the site that added something. Not to kiss anybody's ass or anything, but among those still posting some David Kirk adds content and among the several that I'd prefer to see around here more, the Jerk seems to have turned his attention elsewhere a while back.

Frankly, American Idol refs and youtube doesn't do squat for me to train better or enjoy my ride more.

I also have no need to bask in the reflected glow of their accomplishments.

[girlie]

No women involved......always something to b i t c h about.
atmosalon and big blue have no ladies......what up with that?

Seems to me the omitting and exclusion is far worst than Serotta editing a few posts. At least it's out in the open about who and what it is......so with that - I protest the big blue or is it amtosalon and the exclusion of women from it:)

OH and Cowgirl doesn't count as a woman;)

[Fixed]

bro life comes and goes things change it is a loss for the forum but I wish all my bros well take care and ride don't drive .. imho i will miss the wit from all of the cats
good luck
cheers

[shanerpvt]

It is ironic that we complain how Serotta doesn't add more content to the board. Quite frankly, those that can add a lot tend to add more jokes amongst themselves or American Idol type stuff then actual content. This is fine, really, but the disconnect is mildly amusing.

A lot of people have moved on from the site that added something. Not to kiss anybody's ass or anything, but among those still posting some David Kirk adds content and among the several that I'd prefer to see around here more, the Jerk seems to have turned his attention elsewhere a while back.

Frankly, American Idol refs and youtube doesn't do squat for me to train better or enjoy my ride more.

I also have no need to bask in the reflected glow of their accomplishments.


i understand were you are coming from. i agree 100% on DK. i guess i don't mind sorting through a bit of junk to find something insightful online. it seems like that everywhere on the internet, so i don't really expect this place to be much different. and some of it actually pretty funny.

have a good day,

shaner

[paczki]

No women involved......always something to b i t c h about.
atmosalon and big blue have no ladies......what up with that?

Seems to me the omitting and exclusion is far worst than Serotta editing a few posts. At least it's out in the open about who and what it is......so with that - I protest the big blue or is it amtosalon and the exclusion of women from it:)

OH and Cowgirl doesn't count as a woman;)

The entrance page says it all:

http://www.atmosalon.com/

[M.Sommers]

Another moral from Aesop's 'The Old Lion' is this, it's easy to kick somebody when they're down.

All I'm saying is speaking badly or poorly of someone who isn't here, isn't exactly great sportsmanship. Something to consider over a cup of am coffee. I'm not the policeman on this subject, but I believe Aesop (and Fixed and Your_Friend! and even some who aren't here right now) was very wise (Girlie is bringing sexy back fyi). The worst part about this all is...that Swoop misses me. :beer:


The Old Lion

A LION, worn out with years and powerless from disease, lay on the ground at the point of death. A Boar rushed upon him, and avenged with a stroke of his tusks a long-remembered injury. Shortly afterwards the Bull with his horns gored him as if he were an enemy. When the Ass saw that the huge beast could be assailed with impunity, he let drive at his forehead with his heels. The expiring Lion said, "I have reluctantly brooked the insults of the brave, but to be compelled to endure such treatment from thee, a disgrace to Nature, is indeed to die a double death."

[92degrees]

Who is John Galt?

[paczki]

All I'm saying is speaking badly or poorly of someone who isn't here, isn't exactly great sportsmanship.

Dude, girlie is right. First he's elected not to be here to show all of us and Ben that he is the forum's content. Second he's at the secret atmosalon.

[flickwet]

Who is John Galt?
Where's Hank Reardon?

[M.Sommers]

Dude, girlie is right. First he's elected not to be here to show you that he is the forum's content. Second he's at the secret atmosalon.

Bro, I dunno him, or Swoop, or even DarrenCT. But I'd ride with any/all of those cats, drink coffee throughout, nibble on twizzlers and offer a post-ride beer to all. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with anyone here, I respect the history and duration of people's opinions (there is depth to this story, thread atmo).

No man is an island. The Great White off Amity didn't stop the Fourth of July.

[92degrees]

Where's Hank Reardon?


Gazing longingly at Dagny Taggart, in much the same way some people here seem to regard the missing...

[William]

The Great White off Amity didn't stop the Fourth of July.

Tell that to the guy in the dingy. ;)


Just sayin'




William

[ti_boi]

bro life comes and goes things change it is a loss for the forum but I wish all my bros well take care and ride don't drive .. imho i will miss the wit from all of the cats
good luck
cheers


Yo Man, that's cause you live in the flow.

mad props to Swoop -- I could use two hours with him over 22 mph average.

[dbrk]

I've been too busy following this auction to post much. The room is only as interesting as the people who come to the party atmoimho.

dbrk

Check out my current project...well, it's this auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=140217303572&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=004

[mschol17]

I've been too busy following this auction to post much. The room is only as interesting as the people who come to the party atmoimho.

dbrk

Check out my current project...well, it's this auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=140217303572&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=004

That's wild. :beer:
Win the auction and being busy will be a thing of the past..

[92degrees]

I've been too busy following this auction to post much. The room is only as interesting as the people who come to the party atmoimho.

dbrk

Check out my current project...well, it's this auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=140217303572&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=004


Perfect! We could all travel back to the halcyon days of level top tubes, true cyclists™, and cycling content on the Forum.

[girlie]

The room is only as interesting as the people who come to the party atmoimho.

dbrk



Gotta be invited first....it's the exclusiveness that bits.....I'll take misguided editing over blatant sexism and exclusive snobbery. They leave because of it not being liberal enough yet they are doing the same thing.....but worse in my mind - cause they fly their high flag.
I love those guys but wake up it's 2008.

[slowgoing]

This “protest” reminds me of a child holding his breath, hoping someone will notice and tell him to stop holding his breath. I still haven’t noticed….

They’ll return again unceremoniously, just like they did last year after the frameforum “exodus” failed – they need to mine Ben’s forum for more customers. That’s the one constant that keeps any of them from leaving permanently.

[dbrk]

snip...– they need to mine Ben’s forum for more customers. That’s the one constant that keeps any of them from leaving permanently.

This is utter, uniequivocal nonsense.

dbrk

[fiamme red]

http://images.townnews.com/newportnewstimes.com/content/articles/2007/06/29/news/news05.jpg

[fiamme red]

Check out my current project...well, it's this auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=140217303572&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=004I'd consider it, but the seller offers local pickup only.

[Len J]

i understand were you are coming from. i agree 100% on DK. i guess i don't mind sorting through a bit of junk to find something insightful online. it seems like that everywhere on the internet, so i don't really expect this place to be much different. and some of it actually pretty funny.

have a good day,

shaner

Reading this thread.......

I feel like I'm in kindegarten.

Sheesh....make this place what you want it to be.

Len

[Ginger]

Gotta be invited first....it's the exclusiveness that bits.....I'll take misguided editing over blatant sexism and exclusive snobbery. They leave because of it not being liberal enough yet they are doing the same thing.....but worse in my mind - cause they fly their high flag.
I love those guys but wake up it's 2008.


So what. It's another forum. It's a group of people who like to talk to each other.

You assume they're all male.

And you're not invited.

It's their discussion. What business is it of ours?

None at all.

(and I don't mean that in a female/male framing, just in a "people like to talk together and don't necessarily want others listening in because they want to talk about what they want to talk about" Didn't we all learn that in kindergarten?)

Sometimes it isn't about who has the *

[paczki]

Reading this thread.......

I feel like I'm in kindegarten.

Sheesh....make this place what you want it to be.

Len

Ah, kindergarten. Good times. :banana:

[girlie]

A spade a spade.

It is what it is..........we all have our roles.
I'm like Fixed though my flow is a little different:)

[stormyClouds]

WTOTY - Worst Thread Of The Year.
No offense to the OP, but somebody stick a fork in this one. Useless.

[girlie]

So what. It's another forum. It's a group of people who like to talk to each other.

You assume they're all male.

And you're not invited.

It's their discussion. What business is it of ours?

None at all.

(and I don't mean that in a female/male framing, just in a "people like to talk together and don't necessarily want others listening in because they want to talk about what they want to talk about" Didn't we all learn that in kindergarten?)

Sometimes it isn't about who has the *

It's the principle....and how do you know that I don't know-Actually I do KNOW.
I was told no girls. Like I said let them have their Cabal, their cult, just calling a spade a spade.......and sexism - sexism.
just sayin'

[Tobias]

He’ll be back as soon as the check for his cut of forum derived proceeds clears. :rolleyes:

[paczki]

I love you all! Swoop and e-Richie and all the rest of you! Isn't the internet funny! :banana: :banana: :banana:

[girlie]

sex·ism Audio Help /ˈsɛksɪzəm/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[sek-siz-uhm] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –noun
1. attitudes or behavior based on traditional stereotypes of sexual roles.
2. discrimination or devaluation based on a person's sex, as in restricted job opportunities; esp., such discrimination directed against women.

sex·ist Audio Help /ˈsɛksɪst/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[sek-sist] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –adjective
1. pertaining to, involving, or fostering sexism: a sexist remark; sexist advertising.
–noun
2. a person with sexist attitudes or behavior.

ex·clu·sive Audio Help /ɪkˈsklusɪv, -zɪv/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[ik-skloo-siv, -ziv] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –adjective
1. not admitting of something else; incompatible: mutually exclusive plans of action.
2. omitting from consideration or account (often fol. by of): a profit of ten percent, exclusive of taxes.
3. limited to the object or objects designated: exclusive attention to business.
4. shutting out all others from a part or share: an exclusive right to film the novel.
5. fashionable; stylish: to patronize only the most exclusive designers.
6. charging comparatively high prices; expensive: exclusive shops.
7. noting that in which no others have a share: exclusive information.
8. single or sole: the exclusive means of communication between two places.
9. disposed to resist the admission of outsiders to association, intimacy, etc.: an exclusive circle of intimate friends.
10. admitting only members of a socially restricted or very carefully selected group: an exclusive club.
11. excluding or tending to exclude, as from use or possession: exclusive laws.

fem·i·nism Audio Help /ˈfɛməˌnɪzəm/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[fem-uh-niz-uhm] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –noun
1. the doctrine advocating social, political, and all other rights of women equal to those of men.
2. (sometimes initial capital letter) an organized movement for the attainment of such rights for women.
3. feminine character.

in·clu·sive Audio Help /ɪnˈklusɪv/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[in-kloo-siv] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –adjective
1. including the stated limit or extremes in consideration or account: from 6 to 37 inclusive.
2. including a great deal, or including everything concerned; comprehensive: an inclusive art form; an inclusive fee.
3. that includes; enclosing; embracing.

[dannyg1]

I've been too busy following this auction to post much. The room is only as interesting as the people who come to the party atmoimho.

dbrk

Check out my current project...well, it's this auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=140217303572&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=004

>>Time Travel is Very Close to Reality. I would not Waste Yours or My Time Folks if this were not Real.<<

You might want to edit this line. Time travel would, ISTM, render time somewhat waste-able. In any event, given what you're proposing, I think it creates an inelegant stop to the flow.

Danny

[ClutchCargo]

or what, is Swoop ?

:confused:

[M.Sommers]

Reading this thread.......

I feel like I'm in kindegarten.

Sheesh....make this place what you want it to be.

Len

LenJ,

You just sounded like the snooty, snobby crowd which you speak out against, that infamous, "Handful of members" you've labeled.

Think about it. Re-read your post above and tell me, tell us that you haven't just shot your right foot, shoe and cleat off using the "Kindergarten" jab.

Food for thought and it's low in calories (high in fiber). Not posting this to fight with you, just to ping you with perspective.

:beer:

Regards,
M.Sommers

PS. Girlie is so hot. En fuega.

[M.Sommers]

Tell that to the guy in the dingy. ;)


Just sayin'




William

Bill,

Anytime you're ready for a 'JAWS' in high def, widescreen, while eating some grilled Mako, fresh corn, pasta and beer, you let me know. Eating Mako during 'JAWS' would be cool, I never tried it before. Let me know.

Regards,
M.Sommers

[M.Sommers]

It's the principle....and how do you know that I don't know-Actually I do KNOW.
I was told no girls. Like I said let them have their Cabal, their cult, just calling a spade a spade.......and sexism - sexism.
just sayin'

Dear Girlie,

I love girls. I dream about being kidnapped by one of the female Cylons, taken to their Mother Ship, where I am forced to train with a new Cylon...the Liz Hatch model. Yes Girlie, Liz Hatch might be the Fifth Cylon. Heck Girlie, tell me where the all-girl cycling forum is, I'll join!

For girlie:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hU6g4TT56UI

Best regards,
M.Sommers

[bhungerford]

funny 'protest' all their old useful posts are searchable. just saying.

[rpm]

"If they don't want to come to the ballpark, you can't stop 'em."
Yogi

Buddha sun, Buddha moon. The forum was good with them. The forum is good without them.

[Tobias]

sex·ism
sex·ist
ex·clu·sive
fem·i·nism
in·clu·siveIsn’t life complicated?
How can you be inclusive and exclude those with views you find repulsive?
I try but with little success.

[cadence231]

I'm just trying like heck to keep my mouth/fingers out of ithttp://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/fryingpan.gif .

[Len J]

LenJ,

You just sounded like the snooty, snobby crowd which you speak out against, that infamous, "Handful of members" you've labeled.

Think about it. Re-read your post above and tell me, tell us that you haven't just shot your right foot, shoe and cleat off using the "Kindergarten" jab.

Food for thought and it's low in calories (high in fiber). Not posting this to fight with you, just to ping you with perspective.

:beer:

Regards,
M.Sommers

PS. Girlie is so hot. En fuega.

Not really.........just holding a mirror up.

Go back & reread this thread....about 70% of it or so is calling out one group or another for some (real or imagined) slight.....pointing out a we vs them....or some other (Seeming) pent up resentment. It's childish IMO and beneath what most of us want our behavior to be & what most of us are capable of. BTW, I've been as guilty of this in the past (& probably in the future) as anyone......it's a human reaction. Maybe it's just because I've been removed from the forum recently and have only been coming into threads like this late that I see it........I honestly have no idea about the details behing any "Protest" or "sexist exclusion" on any of the myraid slights alluded to in this thread.

So much drama.....

Len

[M.Sommers]

Isn’t life complicated?
How can you be inclusive and exclude those with views you find repulsive?
I try but with little success.

This is the basis of Battlestar Galactica (Friday nights, Sci-Fi channel at 10pm EST). Ask Girlie, she knows.

[Ginger]

It's the principle....and how do you know that I don't know-Actually I do KNOW.
I was told no girls. Like I said let them have their Cabal, their cult, just calling a spade a spade.......and sexism - sexism.
just sayin'

Can't anyone have a private conversation anymore?

And...a good chain yank is a good chain yank. :) Telling you "no girls" would be an excellent chain yank whether it was true or not.

Look at the spin you're in!


And you're getting the forum riled up against the supposed slight you've received even though you know the people who you're railing against aren't going to respond.
Just what is that?

[Dave B]

if you miss Swoop email him and say hi. Worked for me.

[gt6267a]

just because certain people may or may not be posting, there is no reason why they can't be reading even if you don't see their handle at the bottom of the page. its possible to logout you know? clear you cookies, use a different computer ... even if you are a member of the forum you'll cruise like a guest, or just create a new account ... who knows who is really here?

[Ginger]

if you miss Swoop email him and say hi. Worked for me.

Yep. (apply to others you miss as well
...maybe send a note to mom too... :) )

[Far Rider]

"If they don't want to come to the ballpark, you can't stop 'em."
Yogi

Buddha sun, Buddha moon. The forum was good with them. The forum is good without them.
Better.

[girlie]

Can't anyone have a private conversation anymore?

And...a good chain yank is a good chain yank. :) Telling you "no girls" would be an excellent chain yank whether it was true or not.

Look at the spin you're in!


And you're getting the forum riled up against the supposed slight you've received even though you know the people who you're railing against aren't going to respond.
Just what is that?
I am not rallied against anyone...you really don't know me. And for someone who is as open minded as yourself - you are missing the point - for what - what are you defending? I am not fighting against anyone person...I am standing up for an ideal and speaking publicly about stuff that sucks!

I like and love most of those people......and I respect their opinions. But the blatant smears about women are not cool. What if I said no Jews allowed....I mean "implied" no Jews.....say with a sign that looked racist?
Hell I'll even go so far as to say they have a right......though that does not mean I have to like it!
...good people make mistakes.

[fierte_poser]

I'm just trying like heck to keep my mouth/fingers out of ithttp://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/fryingpan.gif .

+1...so...hard...to...resist...the...quicksand... :crap:

[Dave B]

Yep. (apply to others you miss as well
...maybe send a note to mom too... :) )


Naahh I see her too much! ;)

Wait till I start emailign you! :beer:

[davyt]

Can't anyone have a private conversation anymore?
Strictly speaking, in a forum, no, you can't.

[rphetteplace]

this is pathetic. No girls? No jews? I'm joining swoop and e-ritchie on exile island.

[girlie]

this is pathetic. No girls? No jews? I'm joining swoop and e-ritchie on exile island.
silly that is who we are talking about! :)
good people.

[Karin Kirk]

Yep. (apply to others you miss as well
...maybe send a note to mom too... :) )
Dear Mom,

I miss Swoop.
Please send more cookies.

hugs,
Karin


Is that what you mean, Ginger? What if Mom doesn't know who swoop is, shall I explain it to her?

[rphetteplace]

silly that is who we are talking about! :)
good people.

well I new e-ritchie was jewish, but I didn't know swoop was a girl! :banana:

[girlie]

me either ;)
thanks for the info.

[Ginger]

Dear Mom,

I miss Swoop.
Please send more cookies.

hugs,
Karin


Is that what you mean, Ginger? What if Mom doesn't know who swoop is, shall I explain it to her?

Exactly.

Nah, mom's don't need that kind of explanation.

[RPS]

Can't anyone have a private conversation anymore?

And...a good chain yank is a good chain yank. :) Telling you "no girls" would be an excellent chain yank whether it was true or not.

Look at the spin you're in!


And you're getting the forum riled up against the supposed slight you've received even though you know the people who you're railing against aren't going to respond.
Just what is that?A good chain yank on her part? I think it's cool. :)

Those guys are all equal opportunity offenders -- no one should take it personal. It took me a while to learn to disregard the cr@p and ignore the BS. That's all it takes.

[girlie]

Exactly.

Nah, mom's don't need that kind of explanation.

Cause they know how to take ****? I'm confused.....
You are allowed to believe what you want allow me to mine. Maybe I know things you don't and maybe you know things I don't....BUT a sign like the one below is not a good sign for a girl....like to admit it or not...just sayin.
kind of like this sign is not good for Jews.

[girlie]

A good chain yank on her part? I think it's cool. :)

Those guys are all equal opportunity offenders -- no one should take it personal. It took me a while to learn to disregard the cr@p and ignore the BS. That's all it takes.

Ignore or accept? There is a difference...I can ignore and stand up strongly....but I cannot pretend what is in front of me is not in front of me.

I can say I am wrong so prove me wrong:)!

[Sandy]

I have hesitated commenting at all as I often feel that what I say is often misconstured but here is my take-

This thread is perpetuating the divisiveness that exists within the Serotta Forum. We must realize that it is best for all of us to learn that for better harmony, we must try to understand our differences and perspectives and genuinely try to post being sensitive to each other. But instead, we are continuing to divide the sand box into two distinct mutually exclusive parts- a them and an us. That just won't work.

Those who decide to post will post. Those who decide not to will not post. I sincerely hope that over time all that have decided not to post will return (if in fact they have actually left). When we post, I think we have several obligations- to our unique self and how we think and relate, to the sensitivities of other forum members, and to Serotta who provides the sand box we play in. Just simple respect for each and we will all do well together. I know that I will try.


Sandy

[girlie]

I'm being told I am incorrect about my idea about no women.....though as I have said PROVE ME WRONG and I am happy to admit my mistake:)

[rwsaunders]

When you place two people in a forum, sometimes you end up with three opinions. :cool:

[girlie]

WHICH is the beauty of a forum or critique:)
The third one counts for something....and we all work it out together:)

[RPS]

Ignore or accept? There is a difference...I can ignore and stand up strongly....but I cannot pretend what is in front of me is not in front of me.

I can say I am wrong so prove me wrong:)!This is not about being right or wrong; so no, I can’t say you are wrong. However, I’m not sure you can both ignore and stand-up strongly simultaneously. IMO the simple act of standing up against them essentially contradicts ignoring them.

This being my first forum I had a problem dealing with opinionated people who expressed their views as factual statements when I knew they were nothing more than opinions or personal tastes/likes/preferences. I also found it very difficult and frustrating to debate technical matters with non-technical people who often make claims that are not possible, and then resort to “I’m right because I can ride faster than you” or “I’ve been doing it this way for 20 years” to defend their position.

In time I found a happy compromise that works for me. I “stand up” enough to state when I think they are wrong, but beyond that I try not to get into a pointless debate that I know is not winnable. Not necessarily because they convince me I’m wrong, but because I accept I can’t change their minds or attitudes.

By the way, I'm not sure I follow your concern about being right. If you are refering to there not being any females in the Richard, swoop, etc... inner circle who cares? I'm Cuban born and doubt there are any Cuban-Americans in that circle either. And I could care less.

[jeffg]

:banana:

[paczki]

Enough is enough. We need to bring ourselves together. In times of conflict the best way to do this is to find a common enemy to unite against. Swoop and e-Richie and anyone else we can name who may or may not be protesting or may or may not have left are nice and funny, so they will not do.

Here are my suggestions in reverse order:

5. The idiots who believe that bikes plane

4. Makers of shorts or jerseys with itchy tags

3. Fat people who drive SUVs and cut me off, on cell-phones and/or people who kick open their car doors

2. The idiots who believe that bikes plane (again)

1. Whoever does marketing for Rapha

[RPS]

This thread is perpetuating the divisiveness that exists within the Serotta Forum. We must realize that it is best for all of us to learn that for better harmony, we must try to understand our differences and perspectives and genuinely try to post being sensitive to each other. But instead, we are continuing to divide the sand box into two distinct mutually exclusive parts- a them and an us. That just won't work.Sandy, with all due respect I'll disagree with your premise. Divisiveness can have value under right conditions.

Although I would agree that divisiveness in general is not a good thing, there are times when it is unavoidable and therefore necessary – constructive by default. From my perspective the problem is that unless everyone in a group wants to play nice, trying to play nice while others play by their own rules doesn't work either. Ignoring those who break the rules of the game demoralizes everyone else.

In that sense I'm with girlie -- you have to stand up and say enough. It's like a football game with rules. The refs have to control the game or else it ceases being a game and becomes a ruckus.

[Archibald]

Cause they know how to take ****? I'm confused.....
You are allowed to believe what you want allow me to mine. Maybe I know things you don't and maybe you know things I don't....BUT a sign like the one below is not a good sign for a girl....like to admit it or not...just sayin.
kind of like this sign is not good for Jews.
Whoa, whoa, whoa there, Girlie! Now you're comparing them to Nazis? You got some kind of hell hath no fury like a woman scorned complex going on. Consider yourself lucky you don't have a peach cuz' it takes true crazy talk to get Archie to rise from the dead.

BTW, is this you? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kTMpoEc4Wk)

If so, you might want to put down the tarot cards, up your meds, and sign on for a few more years of professional therapy.

:banana: :banana: :banana: Oh yeah, sometimes a banana is just a banana.

[cadence231]

Whoa, whoa, whoa there, Girlie! Now you're comparing them to Nazis? You got some kind of hell hath no fury like a woman scorned complex going on. Consider yourself lucky you don't have a peach cuz' it takes true crazy talk to get Archie to rise from the dead.

BTW, is this you? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kTMpoEc4Wk)

If so, you might want to put down the tarot cards, up your meds, and sign on for a few more years of professional therapy.

:banana: :banana: :banana: Oh yeah, sometimes a banana is just a banana.


My bananas are better!

http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/nana.gif http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/nana.gif http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m131/cadence220/nana.gif

[William]

Bill,

Anytime you're ready for a 'JAWS' in high def, widescreen, while eating some grilled Mako, fresh corn, pasta and beer, you let me know. Eating Mako during 'JAWS' would be cool, I never tried it before. Let me know.

Regards,
M.Sommers

Heck yeah!! I'm in!! Nice to know there is another 'JAWS' fanatic here besides Mr. Pacenti and myself. :cool:


Best,
William

[girlie]

You seem offended ;)

NO I am comparing the imagery! Yes and I suppose some of the meaning.....though why are some ok and others not? Their sign says HATE. The Nazi just a symbol. You tell me why one is better than the other?

If you confuse the two that is you not me.
Why is one acceptable and the other not? I am posing questions. If it makes you uncomfortable enough to respond...now now.
And as far as comparing pain or mistreatment I bet you are not the one to judge which one is worse - I know I'm not the one. I just put it out there.

PS. That video is funny I can't watch the whole thing as I am at work:) Yes that is me;) My hair is dyed for PUNK reasons though.


Whoa, whoa, whoa there, Girlie! Now you're comparing them to Nazis? You got some kind of hell hath no fury like a woman scorned complex going on. Consider yourself lucky you don't have a peach cuz' it takes true crazy talk to get Archie to rise from the dead.

BTW, is this you? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kTMpoEc4Wk)

If so, you might want to put down the tarot cards, up your meds, and sign on for a few more years of professional therapy.

:banana: :banana: :banana: Oh yeah, sometimes a banana is just a banana.

[rphetteplace]

You seem offended ;)

NO I am comparing the imagery! Yes and I suppose some of the meaning.....though why are some ok and others not? Their sign says HATE. The Nazi just a symbol. You tell me why one is better than the other?

If you confuse the two that is you not me.
Why is one acceptable and the other not? I am posing questions. If it makes you uncomfortable enough to respond...now now.
And as far as comparing pain or mistreatment I bet you are not the one to judge which one is worse - I know I'm not the one. I just put it out there.

PS. That video is funny I can't watch the whole thing as I am at work:) Yes that is me;) My hair is dyed for PUNK reasons though.


comparing the little rascals a kids show from what the 60's to nazi's is a little over the top. atmo.

[girlie]

I am comparing imagery.

Who judges over the top?

Both are nothing but images...actually one is linguistic.

I don't know the show little rascals.

[rphetteplace]

I am comparing imagery.

Who judges over the top?

Both are nothing but images...actually one is linguistic.

I don't know the show little rascals.

Buckwheat? Alfalfa? The sign is from a club that a group of kids had on a tv shows in the Leave it to Beaver era. Very wholesome stuff. Pretty sure they never had internment camps like the nazi's.

[M.Sommers]

Buckwheat? Alfalfa? The sign is from a club that a group of kids had on a tv shows in the Leave it to Beaver era. Very wholesome stuff. Pretty sure they never had internment camps like the nazi's.

Girlie has made her point regarding her use of imagery, she's made her point twice. Certainly you must know that infamous symbol dates back to the Neolithic period, is a word in the language of sanskrit, is used in major religions like Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism; the symbol was hijacked from a madman and and and.

I got Girlie's point the first time. And fwiw, 'The Little Rascals' had a major urban legend surrounding it, that Bill Cosby had bought up the rights/ownership of the series as he felt it was racist against afro-Americans. Turns out the urban legend is untrue, but the show is nowhere to be seen these days.

In other words, we all see what we choose to see (archibald, rphetteplace etc). Many folks died at those horrific camps you've brought up, all races, all religions and all creeds and nearly one million of Uncle Sam's GI's died going after that symbol and they were mainly one religion. A forum member who might be afro-American might be offended by the use of imagery in using the show 'The Little Rascals'. So, nagging Girlie for her use of imagery distracts from her point(s). But what do I know, I miss swoop too. :rolleyes: Let's not push the thread down a political path (where I'm Cat 1). :) No fight intended!!!!

Cheers.


:beer:

[shanerpvt]

Reading this thread.......

I feel like I'm in kindegarten.

Sheesh....make this place what you want it to be.

Len

i guess that's my point. i'm only one of the collective. i can only CONTRIBUTE what i want or READ what i want, but it can only be what it is............not what i want it to be.

not trying to be childish, just tolerant of what other people want out of the forum.

i miss reading the posts of: e-Rich, SteveP, Jerk, Darren, ect......

lots of great people still here, but without question the forum misses the contributions of those peeps.


peace and love to all,

shaner

[FMS_rider]

Reading this thread reminded me to take a photo of a new resident in my backyard.

[Fixed]

I am not rallied against anyone...you really don't know me. And for someone who is as open minded as yourself - you are missing the point - for what - what are you defending? I am not fighting against anyone person...I am standing up for an ideal and speaking publicly about stuff that sucks!

I like and love most of those people......and I respect their opinions. But the blatant smears about women are not cool. What if I said no Jews allowed....I mean "implied" no Jews.....say with a sign that looked racist?
Hell I'll even go so far as to say they have a right......though that does not mean I have to like it!
...good people make mistakes.


we can see good or we can see bad it is what's in our hearts that matters
imho
cheers

[cadence231]

.

Is that a Jack in pulpit?

[Fixed]

(No, I don't know if Swoop is part of the protest...this is just the thread I'm on when I thought of it...and I'm not referring to this thread...)

Seems to me that initially the only reason anyone knows that certain folks are not currently participating is because they were told that certain people were proving a point of how much they contributed to the forum by sitting out of the forum.

That whole teenager "Watch this, they'll miss me when I'm gone."

In my opinion the very first "I miss so-and-so" thread was way too early in the protest for it not to have been prompted. (I mean...if nobody noticed they were gone how much of a protest would it be?) Heck, I heard about the protest and the very next day, there was a post "missing" someone.
How could you miss them, they've only been gone 12 hours, they could be sleeping for THAT long!

Not to say that I necessarily don't miss those forum member's contributions.
I just think the protest marketing is funny.

sorry about the post I always look for swoops take on stuff and i didn't see it for a while so i posted ..
cheers :beer:

[girlie]

we can see good or we can see bad it is what's in our hearts that matters
imho
cheers

Then what does it matter what you see?
and
isn't it beneficial to be in the 'norm' to go with the flow and isn't that a privileged place to speak from?!

[girlie]

Buckwheat? Alfalfa? The sign is from a club that a group of kids had on a tv shows in the Leave it to Beaver era. Very wholesome stuff. Pretty sure they never had internment camps like the nazi's.

No it's more of a culture that accept signs with word like HATE WOMEN than something as obvious asCAMPS.....pain is pain....I will not take away from their pain please don't take away from mine....womens pain is everyday....you don't have to agree but you should respect.

LIKE I said I don't know the TV show...so why should I understand?
YOU MAKE ME BE APART OF SOMETHING I AM NOT AND HAVE NOT BEEN APART OF.....how fair is that?

I took history and I know what Nazi is but HONESTLY I don't know how WOMEN HATERS fits in????? I didn't grow Up with a tv with cable!

Please explain......why one HATE is ok and the other is not? And seriously I didnot have the cable.

[shinomaster]

Longo (http://bikeportland.org/2008/05/15/crowds-soak-up-sun-racing-action-at-mt-tabor/#more-7568)

[Fixed]

Then what does it matter what you see?
illusion imho
cheers

[girlie]

YO read the allegory of the cave.....I get that ! Feel me?
I might be the first person Fixed doesn't feel.....
sorry,
girlie

illusion imho
cheers

[rphetteplace]

No it's more of a culture that accept signs with word like HATE WOMEN than something as obvious asCAMPS.....pain is pain....I will not take away from their pain please don't take away from mine....womens pain is everyday....you don't have to agree but you should respect.

LIKE I said I don't know the TV show...so why should I understand?
YOU MAKE ME BE APART OF SOMETHING I AM NOT AND HAVE NOT BEEN APART OF.....how fair is that?

I took history and I know what Nazi is but HONESTLY I don't know how WOMEN HATERS fits in????? I didn't grow Up with a tv with cable!

Please explain......why one HATE is ok and the other is not? And seriously I didnot have the cable.

:crap: nobody hates women, just gotta steer clear of the crazy ones.

[girlie]

:crap: nobody hates women, just gotta steer clear of the crazy ones.

Like I said.......example placed!
Judge me as you will for speaking OUT about a sign that contain the word HATE....I can live with it.....but only "it" a long side the rest of the bull****.

pain is pain you have no idea!

[Ti Designs]

OK, I'll admit it. I hate girls. No more so than I hate guys, saddle sores or lima beans. I hate everybody. I also hate bikes. Titanium ones, aluminum ones, carbon ones, steel ones, blue ones, red ones and any other combination of colors, materials and wheels. I also hate this forum. In fact the only joy I see in life is the hope that some day that red wine swilling sherif will run me out of town.

[girlie]

OK, I'll admit it. I hate girls. No more so than I hate guys, saddle sores or lima beans. I hate everybody. I also hate bikes. Titanium ones, aluminum ones, carbon ones, steel ones, blue ones, red ones and any other combination of colors, materials and wheels. I also hate this forum. In fact the only joy I see in life is the hope that some day that red wine swilling sherif will run me out of town.

Yeah let it out!

[Sandy]

S ensitivity
E mpathy
R espect
O bjectivity
T olerance
T emperance
A ppreciation

We also need to end this thread.


Sandy

[Jack Brunk]

I spoke to the Jerk today and he says hi.

[girlie]

I spoke to the Jerk today and he says hi.


You just made my day-night!
Do you know if he was wearing a white small costume?

girlie

[RIHans]

Heck yeah!! I'm in!! Nice to know there is another 'JAWS' fanatic here besides Mr. Pacenti and myself. :cool:


Best,
William

We gotta get a bigger boat Will, to contain this crew!

Hans

[RIHans]

"LIKE I said I don't know the TV show...so why should I understand?"


I'm guessing this is a parady of the Zen from Ben. "Send some money 'cause you get a lotta love here on my dime." No other framebuilders allowed.

[shinomaster]

OK, I'll admit it. I hate girls. No more so than I hate guys, saddle sores or lima beans. I hate everybody. I also hate bikes. Titanium ones, aluminum ones, carbon ones, steel ones, blue ones, red ones and any other combination of colors, materials and wheels. I also hate this forum. In fact the only joy I see in life is the hope that some day that red wine swilling sherif will run me out of town.


Will you help me fit my GF?

[capybaras]

girlie,
IF they let you in their clubhouse you would probably get cooties AND boy germs. Ask Ginger. Why not stay out here with the people who like you?

[M.Sommers]

pain is pain you have no idea!

"Ya know, we spent years trying to feel good, then we find out what joy is and man, what a difference between happiness and true joy. Then ya know, bad sh*t happens too and ya feel bad sometimes, you lose friends, family, but then in time, you figure out the difference between sadness and true sorrow. So yeah, the album's about all that, understanding joy and sorrow."

~paraphrasing/quoting Bono before their release of 'All That You Can't Leave Behind'.

The symbol for that album was luggage, literally, a bag with a heart in it.

Girlie, when you talk about pain, women's pain, and you summarize that all deep pain is the same, well I agree: sorrow is sorrow. When someone on the board loses a family dog, their sorrow is no greater or less than when someone loses a family cat. So, when you say, "Pain is pain you have no idea!" ya lose me.

In the meantime Girlie, grab the sugar and move away from the salt. Life is too short, bitterness is a disease, meaning it grows with or without consent. Happiness and joy can be equally powerful to counter sorrow or sadness, but first the salt must be avoided. Salt and vinegar make fries taste great, this I know to be true.

Sandy is like 4x my age and he sees wisdom in my sh*t which is groovy. Everyone has pain, but not all have endured sorrow. Mebbe everyone has, who knows? The point is that even Gloria Steinem got married. All her years of being a pickle-sucker, bitter, filled with angst and now? She wakes up in a bed next to a man, she gives and receives love.

"And in the end, the love you take, is equal to the love---you make."
~Paul McCartney/Beatles 'The End'

Carry That Weight/The End:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coKGNwR8_4k



.

[Fixed]

"Ya know, we spent years trying to feel good, then we find out what joy is and man, what a difference between happiness and true joy. Then ya know, bad sh*t happens too and ya feel bad sometimes, you lose friends, family, but then in time, you figure out the difference between sadness and true sorrow. So yeah, the album's about all that, understanding joy and sorrow."

~paraphrasing/quoting Bono before their release of 'All That You Can't Leave Behind'.

The symbol for that album was luggage, literally, a bag with a heart in it.

Girlie, when you talk about pain, women's pain, and you summarize that all deep pain is the same, well I agree: sorrow is sorrow. When someone on the board loses a family dog, their sorrow is no greater or less than when someone loses a family cat. So, when you say, "Pain is pain you have no idea!" ya lose me.

In the meantime Girlie, grab the sugar and move away from the salt. Life is too short, bitterness is a disease, meaning it grows with or without consent. Happiness and joy can be equally powerful to counter sorrow or sadness, but first the salt must be avoided. Salt and vinegar make fries taste great, this I know to be true.

Sandy is like 4x my age and he sees wisdom in my sh*t which is groovy. Everyone has pain, but not all have endured sorrow. Mebbe everyone has, who knows? The point is that even Gloria Steinem got married. All her years of being a pickle-sucker, bitter, filled with angst and now? She wakes up in a bed next to a man, she gives and receives love.

"And in the end, the love you take, is equal to the love---you make."
~Paul McCartney/Beatles 'The End'

Carry That Weight/The End:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coKGNwR8_4k



.
bro keep this up and i won't miss swoop ...nice words imho
cheers

[girlie]

I am a happy person...and your words are kind and thoughtful:)

Sometimes it takes extremes to make points. I understand I am being extreme though I do stand behind my general points. I see the irony of my statement "pain is pain you have no idea" and that ironic approach is funny. Maybe I should say I find it self righteous of anyone who is willing to tell someone their pain does not compare to someone elses pain. Or for one sign of discrimination to be acceptable and another unacceptable. If this is our culture we are responsible for how it moves. I will not say it is ok for one sign of discrimination to exist and another not to. I am more likely to say they both stay......and we work it out.

For me the key word is WE.
Everyone is a ME.

[djg]

I'm being told I am incorrect about my idea about no women.....though as I have said PROVE ME WRONG and I am happy to admit my mistake:)

I'm an idiot for jumping into this thread.

There is indeed sexism, including virulent sexism, in the world. But . . .

Many little girls go through an "I 'hate' boys" phase, where the word "hate" picks out something real, but not real grownup hatred. Many of those girls grow up to be women with no generic hatred of men.

Many little boys go through an "I 'hate' girls" phase, where the word "hate" picks out something real, but nothing like real grownup hatred. Grownup sexism notwithstanding, most of 'em grow out of it, whatever it is.

What to make of dated entertainment symbols -- what they did then, what they do now -- is not an easy thing, despite all sorts of "theory" about . . . well, whatever. There's all sorts of uncomfortable stuff in old petit Rascals shows. But the goofy looking little kids in the picture -- as characters -- do not really hate girls any more than they really are "he men." Eye(s) of beholder(s), I reckon, but the image seems to me to make fun of a certain stage in boys' development more than it seeks to express or reinforce misogyny.

The flag -- whatever the social and linguistic history of the pilfered symbol -- well, to me it needs more context and not just more cowbell to make something else out of it. If one puts the flag on one's little kid's t-shirt, well, it's tough to imagine the right context . . .

To bring this full circle: I'm a dope for jumping into this thread, which I don't like, although I don't hate it. I'd like to think I'm not a hater.

[ti_boi]

six thousand views later I think it is clear what people are really interested in here on the forum.






















:argue:

[keno]

Seeing themselves post.

[capybaras]

Seeing themselves post.
+1

[gone]

This really has been the stupidest thread in quite some time.

And that's saying something.

[Fixed]

This really has been the stupidest thread in quite some time.

And that's saying something.
+1 this is why no swoop imho
cheers

[capybaras]

+1 this is why no swoop imho
cheers

poor swoop

[girlie]

I'm an idiot for jumping into this thread.

There is indeed sexism, including virulent sexism, in the world. But . . .

Many little girls go through an "I 'hate' boys" phase, where the word "hate" picks out something real, but not real grownup hatred. Many of those girls grow up to be women with no generic hatred of men.

Many little boys go through an "I 'hate' girls" phase, where the word "hate" picks out something real, but nothing like real grownup hatred. Grownup sexism notwithstanding, most of 'em grow out of it, whatever it is.

What to make of dated entertainment symbols -- what they did then, what they do now -- is not an easy thing, despite all sorts of "theory" about . . . well, whatever. There's all sorts of uncomfortable stuff in old petit Rascals shows. But the goofy looking little kids in the picture -- as characters -- do not really hate girls any more than they really are "he men." Eye(s) of beholder(s), I reckon, but the image seems to me to make fun of a certain stage in boys' development more than it seeks to express or reinforce misogyny.

The flag -- whatever the social and linguistic history of the pilfered symbol -- well, to me it needs more context and not just more cowbell to make something else out of it. If one puts the flag on one's little kid's t-shirt, well, it's tough to imagine the right context . . .

To bring this full circle: I'm a dope for jumping into this thread, which I don't like, although I don't hate it. I'd like to think I'm not a hater.

You spoke to the imagery:)! And I can understand you.
So both function with context differently.....
the little rascals are placed into a context to produce meaning where the nazi symbol has context innate with it's meaning. And yes I suppose you are correct that the imagery of the kids (within American Culture) is about some childhood thing. Though to fly it as an adult means something completely different. It is pointing to something which is present but you can't quite put your finger on......and just cause we can't name it doesn't mean it's not there.

My view has something to do with what M.Sommers spoke of......
"I got Girlie's point the first time. And fwiw, 'The Little Rascals' had a major urban legend surrounding it, that Bill Cosby had bought up the rights/ownership of the series as he felt it was racist against afro-Americans. Turns out the urban legend is untrue, but the show is nowhere to be seen these days."

[paczki]

poor swoop
Swoop loves to stir the pot. I imagine he's amused! :banana:

[92degrees]

+1 this is why no swoop imho
cheers


You really think so?

[Fixed]

You really think so?
maybe maybe not
cheers